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Post by Novi Pazar on Jul 14, 2008 1:54:09 GMT -5
^ Pyrro, as you know the illyrians at the end of their existance were Hellenistic, so why does modern Albanian lack Ancient Greek loan words and the Slavs of the Balkans have much more?
An Albanian academic by the name Resuli believes that the Albanians came after the slavs via romania in the 10th century and picked up latin loan words via the Vlachs there!.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jul 14, 2008 2:07:13 GMT -5
What a clue!!! Thanx man!! let me tell you a story Novi. In ancient Greece before the Greeks came, here lived the Pelasgians. The first 3 greek tribes (Aeoloi, Iones, Achaioi) came about 2,000 BC. They didnt destroy pelasgian civilazation. The Dorians came at about 1,100 BC. They destroyed and slaughtered much of the Pelasgian element, due to lack of space. (Ionians in the mean time they were mostly in Minor Asia). However, some places remained purely pelasgian, in mountainous Arcadia and foremost in mountainous Eurytania. Guess what!! Today the people of Eurytania are known VLACHS!!!! What i mean, is that in todays Greece the fact that someones speaks vlach is not by accident.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jul 14, 2008 2:14:34 GMT -5
So if albs were autochthonous, then they would speak pure Vlach and not this strange language they speak now. That said, indoeuropean-wise, Greek and Slav are much much more similar than alb and Greek/Slav
i run
Greek Serbocroatian === ======= Treho Trcim Trehis Trcis Trehi Trci Trehome Trcimo Trehete Tricite Trehoun Triciju
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Post by Fender on Jul 14, 2008 4:10:25 GMT -5
good, you just proved that the slavs during the middle ages assimilated some illyrian tribes, but not completely,mainly the krasniqi tribe! Hahahahahaaaaa. This is gold. I have to add this quote of yours as well to me sig Illir. You must be a stand up comedian. ;D
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Post by Novi Pazar on Jul 14, 2008 7:18:19 GMT -5
"So if albs were autochthonous, then they would speak pure Vlach and not this strange language they speak now."
Pyrro, if they had been in the Balkans for many thousands of years their lanuage would have had much more ancient Greek loan words. You must realise as well, their lanuage has borrowed heavily from the slavs regarding agriculture etc....If they were natives to present day Albania, their lanuage would be a wash with maritime vocabilary. As Resuli has said, the Slavs named everything before the Albanians arrived (cities, towns, mountains, rivers, plains).
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Post by Duke John on Jul 14, 2008 8:52:04 GMT -5
Kapllan Resuli-Burovic! lol its not ethnic albanian its your brother!
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jul 14, 2008 11:56:55 GMT -5
"So if albs were autochthonous, then they would speak pure Vlach and not this strange language they speak now." Pyrro, if they had been in the Balkans for many thousands of years their lanuage would have had much more ancient Greek loan words. You must realise as well, their lanuage has borrowed heavily from the slavs regarding agriculture etc....If they were natives to present day Albania, their lanuage would be a wash with maritime vocabilary. As Resuli has said, the Slavs named everything before the Albanians arrived (cities, towns, mountains, rivers, plains). Same in Epiros. So not only the albs came from somewhere when the slavs (Serbs) left but Greeks as well. I am sure that we came to Epiros from Peloponese or Thessaly after 1400. Because there are no "memories" prior to that. Novi its a mess. But it is true that, when even Vlachs took many words from Greeks or even ..... relearned them (they were latinized pelasgians), how come and the albs have not? Now about the mariner vocabulary, it was almost gone in western greece. Mariners were on the east, i.e. aegean Serbs say Bioskop (=view of life), Biblioteka (storage of books), katastrofa, etc... what do albs say? P.S. Novi, dont buy BS when i criticise Greece! I can assure you i have this civilazation in my heart more than anybody else.
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Jul 14, 2008 12:22:54 GMT -5
"So if albs were autochthonous, then they would speak pure Vlach and not this strange language they speak now." Pyrro, if they had been in the Balkans for many thousands of years their lanuage would have had much more ancient Greek loan words. You must realise as well, their lanuage has borrowed heavily from the slavs regarding agriculture etc....If they were natives to present day Albania, their lanuage would be a wash with maritime vocabilary. As Resuli has said, the Slavs named everything before the Albanians arrived (cities, towns, mountains, rivers, plains). you dude dont know about Albanian, first of all Albanian language have influenced all balcan languages, second Albanian language has over 800 words proto-balcanic (Pelasgians).....slavic language (serb language is just bastartion of slavic) is little daugher of Albanian language. what does have slavic language with balcan?.....nothing! look how slaves want to be more native than authoctone Albanians
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jul 14, 2008 12:44:47 GMT -5
"slavic language (serb language is just bastartion of slavic) is little daugher of Albanian language."
Serbocroatian has 7 (SEVEN) cases, and a big expressive power.
how many are there in alb? LOL!
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Jul 14, 2008 12:45:48 GMT -5
Lets start with this one: "The Mussulmanised Serbs, known as Arnauts, are the bitterest foes of the Serb." Lord H.Temperley do you see how retard are you Novi...Lord H.Temperley he dont talk about ethnicity but citizens and he visitet in 1927 Serbia and Kosova was under ocupator of Serbia. even today most european media/travels confuse Kosovars ore more specifiky Macedonians and Albanians...they call Albanians of macedonia...Muslim Macedonians (but not Albanians) hoverer can you post articlle of him let's see what said more... The Serb ethnic community in Albania is one of the world's most jeopardised national minorities as a consequence of the unconditional Albanisation carried out during the rule of Enver Hoxha and the stand of present Albanian authorities, whose aspirations towards Kosovo and Metohija and the creation of*greater Albania are indisputable. Metropolitan Amfilohije of Montenegro and the Coast said that several thousand Serbs in the Serbian Orthodox Church's Skadar Episcopate, which is situated in Albania, do not have a school, church or the right to use their mother tongue. The Serb school in the village of Vraka, near Shkoder, was torn down in 1934 and has not been reconstructed since. Two Serbian Orthodox churches were torn down during Hoxha's rule and Serbian cemeteries were obliterated despite a large number of Serbs in the region. Officially, ethnic Serbs still carry Albanian names and are of Albanian nationality, so that one can conclude that they have no national rights. Human Rights Watch International I thought l would add this in also just to spice things up, more will come later. They are Gorans and they dont nothing with serbs, ok and are just few 3000-4000.
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Jul 14, 2008 12:48:18 GMT -5
More widespread conversion to Islam took place in the 17th and the first half of 18th centuries, when ethnic Albanians began to wield more influence on political events in these regions. Many Serbs accepted Islamization as a necessary evil, waiting for the moment when they could revert to the faith of their ancestors, but most of them never lived to see that day. The first few generations of Islamized Serbs preserved their language and observed their old customs (especially slava - the family patron saint day, and the Easter holiday). But several generations later, owing to a strong ethnic Albanian environment, they gradually began adopting the Albanian dress to safety, and outside their narrow family circle they spoke the Albanian language. Thus came into being a special kind of social mimicry which enabled converts to survive. Albanization began only when Islamized Serbs, who were void of national feeling, married girls from ethnic Albanian tribal community. For a long time Orthodox Serbs called their Albanized compatriots Arnautasi, until the memory of their Serbian origin waned completely, though old customs and legends about their ancestors were passed on from one generation to the next. For a long time the Arnautasi felt neither like Turks nor ethnic Albanians, because their customs and traditions set them apart, and yet they did not feel like Serbs either, who considered Orthodoxy to be their prime national trait. Many Arnautasi retained their old surnames until the turn of the last century. In Drenica the Arnautasi bore such surnames as Dokic, Velic, Marusic, Zonic, Racic, Gecic, which unquestionably indicated their Serbian origin. The situation was similar in Pec and its surroundings where many Islamized and Albanized Serbs carries typically Serbian surnames: Stepanovic, Bojkovic, Dekic, Lekic, Stojkovic, etc. The eastern parts of Kosovo and Metohia, with their compact Serbian settlements, were the last to undergo Islamization. The earliest Islamization in Upper Morava and Izmornik is pinpointed as taking place in the first decades of the 18th century, and the latest in 1870s. Toponyms in many ethnic Albanian villages in Kosovo show that Serbs had lived there the preceding centuries, and in some places Orthodox cemeteries were shielded against desecrators by ethnic Albanians themselves, because they knew that the graves of their own ancestors lay there. In the late 18th century, all the people of Gora, the mountain region near Prizren were converted to Islam. However they succeeded in preserving their language and avoiding Albanization. There were also cases of conversion of Serbs to Islam in the second half of 19th century, especially during the Crimean War, again to save their lives, honor and property, though far more pronounced at the time was the process of emigration, since families, sometimes even entire villages, fled to Serbia or Montenegro. Fearing the renewed Serbian state, Kosovo (Albanian) pashas engaged in ruthless persecution in an effort to reduce number of Serbs living in their spacious holdings. A French travel writer was astounded by the utter anarchy and ferocity of the local pashas towards the Christians. Jashar-pasha Gjinolli of Prishtina was one of the worst, destroying several churches in Kosovo, seizing monastic lands and killing monks. In just a few years of sweeping terror, he evicted more than seventy Serbian villages between Vucitrn and Gnjilane...dividing up the seized land among the local Islamized population and mountain folk that had settled there from northern Albanian. The fertile plains of Kosovo became desolate meadows as the Malisor highlanders, unused to farming knew not to cultivate. Extensive anthropo-geographic research indicates that about 30% of the present-day ethnic Albanian population of Kosovo and Metohia is of Serbian origin. F.C.H.L Pouqueville French traveller and writer what propaganda and fake article: your article is from here and that did'not writet F.C.H.L Pouqueville...what lie like most serbs do: www.kosovo.net/histkim.html
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Jul 14, 2008 12:52:53 GMT -5
So if albs were autochthonous, then they would speak pure Vlach and not this strange language they speak now. That said, indoeuropean-wise, Greek and Slav are much much more similar than alb and Greek/Slav i run Greek Serbocroatian === ======= Treho Trcim Trehis Trcis Trehi Trci Trehome Trcimo Trehete Tricite Trehoun Triciju huaheuahueh this guy killing me you are very funny...anyway did you learned who are indo-europeans yet? hahahah vllach? do you know vllach what language is?
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Post by Novi Pazar on Jul 14, 2008 18:48:59 GMT -5
The region currently known as Kosovo is of utmost cultural importance to the Serbs. It is the home of over 1300 medieval churches and cultural monuments, and the Serbians have been living in the area since the Midle Ages. But the majority of Albanians are Muslim, and both sides see their histories as being undisputedly attached to the region of Kosovo.
Through these various conquests, it is apparent that the religious elements have influenced the changing demographics and ethnic conflicts of the region. The period of rule by the Ottomans for the latter part of the twentieth century solidified class distinctions between Muslims and Christians.
These distinctions were drawn along lines of Albanian and Serbian ethnicities. Nineteenth and twentieth century freedoms have now given an outlet to these rivalries.
In the battle for preservation, Orthodox Serbs have found themselves in arms against both the Islamicized Albanians and the Bosnian Muslims.
J. Thompson
Rochester University
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jul 15, 2008 2:20:21 GMT -5
Novi, new clues from a book i read.
Illirians were rather indoeuropean. They were employed usual as pirates, thieves or payed soldiers. They were completely latinized. (the urban population). So the pure illirians in the balkans are the vlachs. Albies must have taken the latin words from them.
illirians were of a lower civilazation. no sciences, no arts, no style.
Pyrros fought against them.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 15, 2008 2:35:40 GMT -5
There was alot more to the various Illyrian tribes then "piracy". The Romans and Greeks weren't too kind on them besides saying they were great warriors. But Greeks called everyone else Barbarians so it's nothing unusual. How did you conclude Illyrians were completly Latinized? I've read Vlachs are descendants of a mix of Dacians and Thracians. They didn't really inhabit most of the area where Illyrians were (Ex-Yugoslavia plus Albania)
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Jul 15, 2008 2:48:29 GMT -5
Novi, new clues from a book i read. Illirians were rather indoeuropean. They were employed usual as pirates, thieves or payed soldiers. They were completely latinized. (the urban population). So the pure illirians in the balkans are the vlachs. Albies must have taken the latin words from them. illirians were of a lower civilazation. no sciences, no arts, no style. Pyrros fought against them. listen joke, firstly vllach mentioned in 1082 in South Romania (where lived Dacians) and never mentioned in illyrian part, they are Dacians. Illyrians had great history and they gived Alexander the Great, Constadin the Great, Justanian I and Pirro Kaoni (Epirit) and 18 emperors of Roman Empire were of Illyrian origin.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jul 15, 2008 2:52:16 GMT -5
There was alot more to the various Illyrian tribes then "piracy". The Romans and Greeks weren't too kind on them besides saying they were great warriors. But Greeks called everyone else Barbarians so it's nothing unusual. How did you conclude Illyrians were completly Latinized? I've read Vlachs are descendants of a mix of Dacians and Thracians. They didn't really inhabit most of the area where Illyrians were (Ex-Yugoslavia plus Albania) it dependes how you define vlachs. In greece, vlach is the latin speaker. Vlach is remotely mutually comprehensible with Catalan in Spain (and of course romanian).
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jul 15, 2008 2:54:35 GMT -5
Novi, new clues from a book i read. Illirians were rather indoeuropean. They were employed usual as pirates, thieves or payed soldiers. They were completely latinized. (the urban population). So the pure illirians in the balkans are the vlachs. Albies must have taken the latin words from them. illirians were of a lower civilazation. no sciences, no arts, no style. Pyrros fought against them. listen joke, firstly vllach mentioned in 1082 in South Romania (where lived Dacians) and never mentioned in illyrian part, they are Dacians. Illyrians had great history and they gived Alexander the Great, Constadin the Great, Justanian I and Pirro Kaoni (Epirit) and 18 emperors of Roman Empire were of Illyrian origin. the only joke around, is small nation with no history, who struggle to fabricate one. I guess you are part of this big joke gamiola-Dardana.
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Jul 15, 2008 3:14:36 GMT -5
pjerdhosh you are a paranoid schizophren and funny, tipycall greek malakas acting, listen pidhosh when my ancestors liberatet your country you and your gypso family (like most others) were in Asia Minor and Sirya.
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Jul 15, 2008 3:19:01 GMT -5
it dependes how you define vlachs. In greece, vlach is the latin speaker. Vlach is remotely mutually comprehensible with Catalan in Spain (and of course romanian). huahuahuaha ;D this guy is very stupid...but Vllach living outside of Greece what language have? Jamacian? this guy is very illiterate ;D
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