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Post by Arxileas on Mar 3, 2009 5:03:43 GMT -5
"Introducing Greece" by Francis King p.53
Traditionally the white skirt, or fustanella, is said to have originated from the Roman tunics........
"The People of Turkey" by Fanny Janet Blunt p.69
The Albanians are divided into several distinct races, each presenting marked features of difference from the other and occupying separate districts. Those of Upper Albania are called Ghegs, and inhabit that portion oi the country called Ghegueria, which extends from the frontiers of Bosnia and Monte¬negro to Berat.
These men are broad-chested, tall, and robust, have regular features, and a proud, manly, independent mien. Their personal attractions are not a Uttle enhanced by their rich and picturesque national costume—a pair of cloth gaiters; an embroidered jacket with open sleeves; a double-breasted waistcoat, the Greek fustanella (white calico kilt), surmounted by a cloth skirt opened in front; a kemer, or leather belt decorated with silver ornaments and holding a pistol, yatagan and other arms of fine workmanship.[/i]
"Prince Louis of Battenberg, Admiral of the Fleet" by Mark Edward Frederic Kerr p. 18
The dinner was a very grand and picturesque affair, as all the servants were in the Greek costume, called the fustanella.
"Lord Cromer: Victorian imperialist, Edwardian proconsul" by Roger Owen p. 28
Baring remembered the King's fustanella (Greek kilt) as very dirty, and the Queen, in tears, telling him a very long story designed.........
"With the Greeks in Thessaly" By William Kinnaird Rose p.7
Every steamer arriving at Pineus landed hundreds of reservists, recruits, and volunteers not only from the Isles of Greece but from every quarter of the Levant, from North Africa, from Western Europe, and even from America, South Africa, and Australia. They were attired in every variety of costume ”the baggy pants and braided jacket of the Albanian ;
the fustanella, or plaited linen kilt, of the mountaineers, with picturesque jacket and tassellcd fez ; the heavy woollen cloak and tight white breeches of shepherds and peasants fiom plain and mountain on the mainland, and even suits of Western tweed.
"Our allies and enemies in the Near East" by Jean Victor Bates p. 163
A dispute has arisen between the proprietor and one of the new-comers, whose fustinella and long-tasselled scarlet fez proclaim him a Greek.
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Post by chalkedon on Mar 3, 2009 5:06:30 GMT -5
monsterofsouli...as the expression goes..." kill them w/ kindness " thats the only way. The more you get agitated the less possibilities they will try to understand you. Besides..the average internet troll dies out after a while...the ones that are interested stay.
I am just as guility of flaming them though...I usually do it when im bored or if im in the mood to flame somebody, but refrain when the conversation gets somewhat " serious " in dialoge
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:11:01 GMT -5
Albanians of Cairo at the Gate of Bab-el-Nasr, 1861 , oil Egypt Albanians playing chess, 1859. Albanian sword dance, by Paul Jovanovich. Albanian Pandours Napoleon's Albanian Troops Ionian/Seven Islands Corps ALBANIAN REGIMENT The Regiment Albanais had its origins in a Venetian regiment transferred in to French service in 1797, together with an Albanian militia raised by the Russians in 1799,which passed to the French when they recovered the Ionian Islands in 1807.On 12 October that year Napoleon approved the recruitment of about 3,000 Albanians, most of whom were refugees from the harsh rule of the local Ottoman governor of the Albanian coast, Ali-Pasha of Janiana. Albanian from Athens, 1825. Coloured lithograph. Design Dupre, engraving C. Motte. Dupre, L., Paris 1825
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:22:01 GMT -5
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Post by Arxileas on Mar 3, 2009 5:25:51 GMT -5
so what...a foreigner can come now to athens a see a lot of pakis....whats your point ?
Its one thing to say they were present at the time....and definitaly another to say that albos had an influence.
The only influence i can honestly see is being the henchmen for the ottomans...thats about it.
speaking of " albanian " can you post a source explicity siting that name in pre-independence time..
thanks No answer, you were ignored ! MUHAMMAD ‘ALÎ PASHA AND ALBANIAN ISLAMIC EMPIRE OF EGYPT (1833-1841) www.geocities.com/ga57/albania/albegypt.html .
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Post by chalkedon on Mar 3, 2009 5:26:39 GMT -5
They keep forgetting that maybe they borrowed it like others did around the region from the Greco - Roman Byzantine Empire and that their lands were influenced by Hellenism since time can remember.
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Post by Arxileas on Mar 3, 2009 5:27:54 GMT -5
^ That's right ! We can tame this one ;D .
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Mar 3, 2009 5:30:37 GMT -5
Why Tosks wear fustanella and Ghegs wear that weird trousers??? And why much more developed people(Greeks) adopt something from some barbarian mountaineers? Byzantine dadda gave some good things to Tosks... ;D
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:30:38 GMT -5
so what...a foreigner can come now to athens a see a lot of pakis....whats your point ?
Its one thing to say they were present at the time....and definitaly another to say that albos had an influence.
The only influence i can honestly see is being the henchmen for the ottomans...thats about it.
speaking of " albanian " can you post a source explicity siting that name in pre-independence time..
thanks No answer, you were ignored ! MUHAMMAD ‘ALÎ PASHA AND ALBANIAN ISLAMIC EMPIRE OF EGYPT (1833-1841) www.geocities.com/ga57/albania/albegypt.html . We are proud of him like Counduriottis
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Post by Arxileas on Mar 3, 2009 5:33:24 GMT -5
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Mar 3, 2009 5:33:25 GMT -5
Digenis Akritas ca.1200 A.D.
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:34:13 GMT -5
Why Tosks wear fustanella and Ghegs wear that weird trousers??? And why much more developed people(Greeks) adopt something from some barbarian mountaineers? Byzantine dadda gave some good things to Tosks... ;D nice illyrian costume
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:37:03 GMT -5
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Mar 3, 2009 5:38:35 GMT -5
Is Akritas Illyrian too? lol
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:39:55 GMT -5
Cham Dance (albanian dance) tsamiko dance (greeks who adobted from chams) greek friends do you like cham dance?
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Post by Arxileas on Mar 3, 2009 5:42:56 GMT -5
An abstract from Akritan Ikonography on Byzantine Pottery James A. Notopoulos Hesperia, Vol. 33, No. 2 (Apr. - Jun., 1964), pp. 108-133
A comparison of the fustanella warriors on the Byzantine plates with the klephts of the Greek Revolution of 1821-30, shown in the primitive paintings of Makriyiannes, shows that we are dealing in both instances with a garment which is peculiarly suited to a fast, mobile guerrilla mountain type of warrior. Professor Keramopoullos' study of the fustanella throws light on our problem. This highland kilt, which in 1833 was legally made part of the dress of the Greek army and survives today in the royal palace guard at Athens, has a long history.
The fustanella evolved from the Roman toga, shortened and with pleats added, as may be seen in statues of Roman emperors who wear a breastplate (lorica) above and a tunic ending in pleated kilts reaching to the knees. he transference of this shortened toga to central Europe, where the climate is colder, was accompanied by an increase in the number of folds to provide greater warmth. The fustanella as worn by the Greek peasants until recent times and by the Vlachs, whom Wace studied, is descended from the Roman military dress.[/u] The kinship of the Vlachs with the Romans may also be seen in the close relation of the Vlach dialect to Latin. In fact these Vlachs are descendants of Roman armies who kept watch on the Roman frontiers.
Being a military dress, as seen in the statues of emperors, it became the Roman dress of regular and mercenary troops who came from the conquered regions of Greece and the East. Since the mountain regions are barren, their hardy peoples turned to military service for a livelihood, remaining twenty years in the legions, and twenty-five in the auxilia. Dressed in their kilts these mountain-bred troops of the Roman army lived as milites limitainei in the distant frontier provinces of the Roman empire. Among such contingents in the Byzantine armies were the akrites who, as the name shows, guarded the frontiers.
A study of Byzantine art which portrays the Byzantine armies shows two types of kilted warriors. One is associated with the imperial Byzantine armies, officers, or emperors who usually wear a military helmet. They are heavily armed with a breast- plate and are always pictured on horse. The other is worn by foot soldiers who are described in the tenth century Byzantine treatise, Περί Παραδρομής Πολέμου, as οί ταχείς ψιλοί, ταχείς τής πόσι, and it is to this contingent of Akritan troops that our plates belong. They are not clad in armor, nor in helmets. They wear a cap, a cloth doublet, and their pleated kilt is unmistakably different from that of the other class of warriors. Their kilt resembles the klepht fustanella; it is longer, more flared, fluid, and ornamented with decorative stripes, horizontal or vertical. It is this difference in kilts that distinguishes the warriors in the Byzantine plates from the imperial forces depicted in other manifestations of Byzantine art. The kilts in our plates belong to the akrites, whose garb is required by their way of life and the guerrilla type of warfare described in the Byzantine military treatise...
This kind of warfare, also described in the Akritan ballads, called for a fast mobile guerrilla type of soldier. What kind of dress is suitable for this kind of warfare? Nothing better than the fustanella worn by the Akritan warriors in the Byzantine plates.
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Post by Arxileas on Mar 3, 2009 5:43:56 GMT -5
The 'foustanella' is nothing but the descendant of the ancient 'Chlamys' and 'Tonga' and the later Byzantine "tunica" that wasn't much of a change to the ancient forms.. Proof of the existance since ancient times is the find in Durres ( ancient Hellinic colony of Epidamnos founded 650BC) of this artifact dated 500BC:
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:44:51 GMT -5
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Mar 3, 2009 5:47:40 GMT -5
The 'foustanella' is nothing but the descendant of the ancient 'Chlamys' and 'Tonga' and the later Byzantine "tunica" that wasn't much of a change to the ancient forms.. Proof of the existance since ancient times is the find in Durres ( ancient Hellinic colony of Epidamnos founded 650BC) of this artifact dated 500BC: then why didn't found in modern Greece? and second this is illyrian man and third same fostunnela have been found in Maribor (Slovenian) an illyrian man
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Post by Arxileas on Mar 3, 2009 5:50:51 GMT -5
On the Albanian Claim that they have Illyrian names today
ISBN 960-210-279-9 Miranda Vickers, The Albanians Chapter 9. "Albania Isolates itself" page 256 In page 271 it is stated
From time to time the state gave out lists with pagan ,supposed Illyrian or newly constructed names that would be proper for the new generation of revolutionaries.(see also Also Logoreci "the Albanians" page 157. Usless Albanian you lost with the last posts You changed the subject
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