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Post by leandros nikon on Mar 10, 2009 18:23:33 GMT -5
Fan Noli or Theofanis Mavromatis?
Greek or Albanian?
A greek origin vs an albanian concience?
how about Markos Botsaris again?
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Post by meltdown711 on Mar 10, 2009 21:11:57 GMT -5
Mavromatis was never his official name, it was Theofan Stylian Noli. He was born to a family in Edirne which traced its origin to Kolonja immigrants who in the 17-8th century moved to Thrace (and also settled in areas of Bulgaria which eventually was given the name Arbanasi). They were Orthodox Christians who lived in the surrounding villages of Thrace (Albanian speaking) who were called Rums and traded off to Greece at the beginning of the 20th century pop trade. To this day the community there speaks Albanian and his family members themselves have admitted their Albanian origin (they call themselves Shqiptars as opposed to Arvanites), even though they disagreed with his views and were/are, as opposed to him, pro Greek leaning (obviously for religious reasons). Top Channel in Albania did a documentary on this community a long while back.
Fan Noli never saw himself, nor claimed any origin, other than purely an Albanian one. Nor did he ever claim his native language was anything other than Albanian (although he spoke Greek and Turkish fluently as well). Marko Bocari even made a lexicon comparing his native language with something else.
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Post by ILIRI I MADH on Mar 11, 2009 0:47:58 GMT -5
He wil tell you what he was with his own voice...hehe if u understand albanian
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Mar 11, 2009 5:17:18 GMT -5
Can any Albo here explain why are there lot of Albanians with undisputed Greek surnames...when I say Greek I don't mean names from christian Greek,like Gjergi-Georgios,Kola-Nikolaos,Athanas etc
like: Kastrioti Arianiti Kristoforidhi Idhromeno Mavromati
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Post by leshte on Mar 11, 2009 9:25:35 GMT -5
Same goes for Greeks with undisputed Albanain names. The question is a naive question. We've lived beside each other for millenia. We've influenced each other.
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Post by meltdown711 on Mar 11, 2009 9:31:56 GMT -5
Arianit is a common name altogether. There is an Italian shop in my neighborhood and the family name is Arriana.
And as for 19th-20th century figures, surnames are rather useless in pointing to ethnic origin since their family was not necessarily in control of them. Often the church (or, for Muslims, the state) handed out surnames in the latter parts of the Ottoman Empire. So you have a large number of Very very Turkish or Greek surnames among them.
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Post by insomniac on Mar 11, 2009 9:47:56 GMT -5
He wil tell you what he was with his own voice...hehe if u understand albanian I havent heard this speech by Fan Noli. He was smart before his time. This was 3 years before he died. Thnx for posting it. In the future he will be a greek hero. ;D
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Post by meltdown711 on Mar 11, 2009 10:35:05 GMT -5
I think you Greeks should read "The Red Bishop"... its a biography of Noli's life from the viewpoint of a descendant of the Greek minority in America. He was a great man, if he had it his way... there would be no Greeks today in the south...
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Kanaris
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Post by Kanaris on Mar 11, 2009 14:32:38 GMT -5
What good would that bring... Melty.? We got so many of you in Greece.... yet you keep Liboing about Greeks in Albania... Who the Fuc you think you are? Someone threw a piece of bread to you father and he was lucky the US was accepting refugees...or else you still be collecting goatchit in the backwoods of South Albania... Get over it.... it's not even funny anymore... grow up for fucs sake...
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Post by meltdown711 on Mar 11, 2009 19:29:22 GMT -5
The so many of you is your problem, not mine. I would love it if you kicked them out, it would cause some notable turmoil in Albania for a time, but it would be much better in the long-term. And would fill south Albania with some much needed rejuvenation... Not to mention the whole country initself. I would be amazing come to think of it... But anyway, in my home in Vlora we keep two sets of guns, a .45 and an AK (after 97)... ask any Himariot what kind of gun he keeps at his house... (youd probably have to get him from Greece to do so first though)
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Kanaris
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Post by Kanaris on Mar 11, 2009 19:41:49 GMT -5
Booo..you scare me with your vast knowledge of guns.You should have smuggled them out of Albania when you came here... this way your dad could have had a one way ticket to Gitmo....
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Post by emily33 on Mar 11, 2009 19:42:41 GMT -5
Emily says, (..................edit........................)
---------------------------------------
Easy with the insults.
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Post by libofshe on Mar 12, 2009 7:50:53 GMT -5
yet you keep Liboing about Greeks in Albania
hope this was not a reference to me.
Someone threw a piece of bread to you father and he was lucky the US was accepting refugees
yeah, how'd you get to canada re? were you cordially invited over on a privately chartered marque jet paid for by the state of canada?
do you suffer from amnesia or smth, have you forgotten you are a refugee? and would you knock someone from having migrated, 70% of america are immigrants.
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Kanaris
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Post by Kanaris on Mar 12, 2009 12:40:31 GMT -5
My father was invited here in 1955.....That is why I can stand up with my head high ... and call YOU a refugee. Most if not all of Albanians are political refugees. They are always running away from something.
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Post by leandros nikon on Mar 12, 2009 12:48:54 GMT -5
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Post by Alb_Korcar on Mar 13, 2009 20:33:24 GMT -5
Fan Noli is Albanian...he is the father of the Albanian Orthodox church...dont be pathetic there's solid proof that hes Albanian. He has origins in Kolonja. But its even more pathetic that lowlives that hate Orthodox Albanians think they can have an opinion on Fan Noli, guess what Noli was a kaur too..probably a Communist as well ...he would spit on all your faces. Don't make me laugh.
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Post by leshte on Mar 13, 2009 23:10:57 GMT -5
I was invited here. You're not special Kanris.
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Kanaris
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Post by Kanaris on Mar 13, 2009 23:38:27 GMT -5
Sure I am .... at this point in my life I am special. When you reach here ....give me a call.
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Post by ilirdardani on Mar 14, 2009 11:20:24 GMT -5
My father was invited here in 1955.....That is why I can stand up with my head high ... and call YOU a refugee. Most if not all of Albanians are political refugees. They are always running away from something. Majority are refugees because of being terrorized back home, whether it be in Kosovo (from the Serbs), or Montenegro, or Albania (from communist pro-russian govt), etc. Of course some left for political reasons, but they're in the minority. About myself and my family, we left because we had nowhere to return back to for the reason that the house was burned down. Otherwise we would never come to the United States. (my parents hate it being away from homeland lol) (< and who can blame them)
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Kanaris
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Post by Kanaris on Mar 14, 2009 11:24:23 GMT -5
Illir most of the Kosovars I have met are nice people... I deal with one on a day to day basis and we are like friends... I wish I can say the same about some Albanians that I know.
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