|
Post by Anittas on Apr 3, 2010 8:46:43 GMT -5
Bulgaria is a nasty country and its society is full of hatred. Racism is promoted by most institutions. I read an English blog article on the subject that was later translated into Bulgarian and French and couldn't help but wonder: how do Turks living in Bulgaria manage to stay alive and sane? www.howtomarryabulgarian.com/2009/08/black-in-bulgaria.html
|
|
|
Post by logjiktek on Apr 3, 2010 9:23:27 GMT -5
I don't find such behavior to be atypical in the Balkan -- such mentality is the the norm. I remember when I was younger my mother would tell me I should finish my food before the Gypsy comes to kidnap me.
Gypsies and Romas are pretty much discriminated in most places in the Balkans. Serbia is the exception though. Serbia's Gypsies are much more sophisticated (possibly the most sophisticated gypsies in the World!), and thus, are much more accepted.
|
|
|
Post by diurpaneus on Apr 3, 2010 11:03:22 GMT -5
I agree with Anittas. I mean, people dislike some other people in general, but these Bulgarians are the definitions of racism. Fuck me - Bulgaria should be pointed out in the dictionary at the word "racism" or "hitler"
|
|
|
Post by Anittas on Apr 3, 2010 11:53:08 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by hellboy87 on Apr 3, 2010 20:41:20 GMT -5
"The rhetoric of ATAKA that carried out far-nationalist election campaign is surprisingly very extreme even for Bulgarian politicians who described themselves as nationalist.: “The best Turk is dead Turk” “The best Gypsy is Gypsy who become raw material for soap”, “Jews are dangerous race who carries plague and deserves to be utterly destroyed from their birth”, “Bulgaria is the state that belongs only to Bulgarians”…
YES YES YES!!!!!!!!!!!
|
|
|
Post by Anittas on Apr 4, 2010 5:09:31 GMT -5
The Ottoman Empire was one of the most civilized states to rule Bulgaria, after the Roman-, Greek-, and Byzantine Empire. The Turks there deserve to be treated well and with utmost respect. I worry this isn't the case. The Bulgarians are a savage race--those that identify themselves as part of the native population (Thracian) are okay. The rest are not. They have no right to say who's to stay and who's to go when they themselves migrated to the land and forced their primitive ways on the natives.
It's unfair that Bulgaria should exist as a state: it would've been better if it was split between Romania, Turkey, Serbia, and Macedonia.
I hope Turkey will protect its minority in Bulgaria.
|
|
|
Post by diurpaneus on Apr 4, 2010 5:23:05 GMT -5
It's unfair that Bulgaria should exist as a state: it would've been better if it was split between Romania, Turkey, Serbia, and Macedonia. I agree. They were civilized and cultured by the Byzantines - but still, they bad-mouth Greeks. They were accepted into the Vlach Empire of the Asens - but still, they bad-mouth Romanians They were integrated into the Ottoman Empire, which gave them a purpose, jobs as soldiers and made them known to the world - but still, they bad-mouth Turks They were liberated by the Romanians in 1877 - but still, they bad-mouth Romanians They then became greedy and attacked former allies to conquer a province which was never theirs - Macedonia. Truly, a nation of primitives. They live in Europe for more than a thousand years now, but they still behave like in the Asian steppes where they came from.
|
|
|
Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Apr 4, 2010 5:37:44 GMT -5
lolz you guys are funny. When a gay gypsie by the name of Azis is the most popular singer in Bulgaria I doubt they too many deep problems with racism. One of the few photo's of him I can bare to look at.
|
|
|
Post by Ivanov on Apr 4, 2010 15:08:37 GMT -5
Anittas, I have a proposal. Come to Bulgaria and I will take you to a gypsy neighborhood right after the sunset. Your task will be to survive there for 1 hour. If you are not killed, beaten, robbed, raped...etc I will admit that the gypsies are angels.
|
|
|
Post by Vizier of Oz on Apr 5, 2010 3:12:07 GMT -5
Bulgaria is a nasty country and its society is full of hatred. Racism is promoted by most institutions. I read an English blog article on the subject that was later translated into Bulgarian and French and couldn't help but wonder: how do Turks living in Bulgaria manage to stay alive and sane? Dear Anittas, Thank you for coming back to the board, and thank you again for bringing up this important subject, which is mostly related to Bulgaria. I hope our Bulgarian firends would learn one or two things from Turkey. Prime minister tells Roma: Your sufferings are mineAddressing thousands of Roma who came to Ýstanbul to attend a meeting organized as part of*government initiative to find solutions to problems faced by the ethnic minority, Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoðan said he sees the Roma's problems as his own. Prime Minister Erdoðan was met with slogans of “Tayyip Baba” (father Tayyip), and Turkish flags were waved as he entered the jam-packed Abdi Ýpekçi arena. Erdoðan met with nearly 10,000 Roma yesterday in a meeting with a festive atmosphere, a move that came as a part of the government's democratic initiative, which is intended to expand the rights of previously disadvantaged groups and communities such as the Kurds, the Alevis and the Roma. “As the state, we have shouldered the responsibility on this [Roma] issue. From now on, your problems are my problems. Nobody in this country can be treated as ‘half' a person. We cannot tolerate this,” the prime minister said during the speech he delivered at the Roma meeting at Ýstanbul’s Abdi Ýpekçi Sports Hall yesterday. Thousands of Roma came to Ýstanbul from a number of provinces across Turkey early yesterday. The groups began gathering in front of the sports hall in the morning and waited for the meeting to start while dancing and singing songs. The meeting started at 12 p.m. with concerts and dance performances staged by various Roma groups. Famed Roma singer Balýk Ayhan also gave a concert. The prime minister was met with slogans of “Tayyip Baba” (father Tayyip), and Turkish flags waved as he entered the jam-packed hall. The prime minister presented carnations to the Roma as he toured the hall. The prime minister said the government is aware of the Roma people’s problems and that they have experienced many “resentful springs.” “This spring will be a very different one. This will be one when pain will turn into happiness and when resentments will be repaired. We are aware of the bitter smile on your face. We are aware of your sufferings, we are aware of your problems,” he added. Prime Minister Erdoðan met with nearly 10,000 Roma on Sunday in a festive atmosphere as a part of the government’s democratic initiative. “How succinctly a Roma saying explains the issue: ‘The road towards the destination is a part of the destination. It cannot be seen apart from the aim.’ Today we are heading towards the destination. We called this road the national unity and brotherhood project. We are taking up the issues one by one. The Kurds, the Laz, the Roma, the Circassians, all Turkish citizens, whoever comes to your mind, are our brothers. Their problems are our problems. I don’t want to see my Roma brothers in tents any more. I want them to enjoy a decent standard of living,” Erdoðan further remarked. Prime Minister Erdoðan met with nearly 10,000 Roma on Sunday in a festive atmosphere as a part of the government’s democratic initiativeSince many Roma are nomads, they often live in tents in unsuitable living conditions. Erdoðan also underlined that the government has begun to construct new housing for the Roma across Turkey, saying that the construction of 3,408 houses has already started. “We have taken the first steps. But we expect support from you as well. I hope this process will successfully continue and in time we will put an end to [the Roma’s] poverty and lack of education. We have strongly opposed the primitive mentality that there is no place for the Roma at state institutions, and we will continue to do so. We will construct the future with you,” he added. The government launched the Roma initiative late last year. A government-sponsored workshop was held on Dec. 9, 2009 to address issues facing the Roma community. Representatives of Turkey’s Roma community in Ýstanbul, Edirne, Kýrþehir, Artvin, Van and several other cities, 120 people in all, attended the event. A report was drafted listing the Roma community’s demands from the government following the workshop. According to the workshop report, there are 500,000 Roma living in Turkey, while other sources estimate as many as 2 million. Some 20,000 Turkish Roma are nomads. The most significant problems experienced by the Roma are insults and discrimination. They are generally referred to as “çingene,” a pejorative term meaning gypsy, but there are 20 other expressions commonly used in Turkish to refer to them. Stressing that Roma were treated as equal citizens during the reign of Ottoman Empire, Erdoðan said: “My brothers, I want to underline this point. Our civilization is nurtured by tolerance. The only thing not tolerated in these lands is intolerance. People from different backgrounds lived in these lands for centuries. … Our lands have never witnessed racism in history.” Giving some examples of pejorative expressions commonly used in Turkish to refer to them, Erdoðan said: “No matter what people say, you are our friends. You are human. You are my Roma brothers.” Well-known Roma singer Kibariye took the stage following the prime minister and gave a concert. www.todayszaman.com/tz-web/news-204361-prime-minister-tells-roma-your-sufferings-are-mine.html
|
|
|
Post by Kastorianos on Apr 5, 2010 3:24:07 GMT -5
The Bulgarians should beware of their Turks...they form a big danger for their country's sovereignty. Bulgaria should get rid of them.
Turks are well known for being usually not willing to integrate into the society...they are for no good in the Balkans and Asia Minor. Thats what history has proven countless times and what is still proved day by day.
|
|
|
Post by rusebg on Apr 5, 2010 4:32:29 GMT -5
Vizier, leaving aside the useless rhetorics in your post, let us focus on this:
Well, seems like we don't have to learn a thing or two from Turkey. Gypsies in Bulgaria (with the exception of a very small percentage) have been given housing a long time ago. Neigbourhoods, appartments, etc. The problem is the way in which they manage their property. If you think that throwing away your garbage through the window, dislodging your parquet to set a fire in the middle of your living room or breed sheep or horse on your balcony is how one should regard the state property given to them, then I have nothing else to discuss with you.
|
|
|
Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Apr 5, 2010 5:51:47 GMT -5
Turks are well known for being usually not willing to integrate into the society...they are for no good in the Balkans and Asia Minor. Thats what history has proven countless times and what is still proved day by day. True that although I'd say the same rule applies to all Islamic peoples living in any given European or western country.
|
|
|
Post by diurpaneus on Apr 5, 2010 6:06:53 GMT -5
Anittas, I have a proposal. Come to Bulgaria and I will take you to a gypsy neighborhood right after the sunset. Your task will be to survive there for 1 hour. If you are not killed, beaten, robbed, raped...etc I will admit that the gypsies are angels. Hitler himself couldn't have said it better.
|
|
|
Post by Kastorianos on Apr 5, 2010 6:17:44 GMT -5
But what if Ivanov is right?
|
|
|
Post by Vizier of Oz on Apr 5, 2010 7:23:22 GMT -5
Vizier, leaving aside the useless rhetorics in your post, let us focus on this: Well, seems like we don't have to learn a thing or two from Turkey. Gypsies in Bulgaria (with the exception of a very small percentage) have been given housing a long time ago. Neigbourhoods, appartments, etc. When reffering to the exception of small percentage, did you mean government housing of this kind for the masses? Roma peoples have a different culture. For sure, there are Romas like you describe, but there are also Romas who are not like what you try to describe. After all, it seems to me as if your governments never asked them what kind of places they really wanted to live in. Probably, your governments (like you do) tend to blame the Romas for who they are as if you guys are something very special. I am sorry to say, but you are not. If you read the news from Turkey carefully, then you would see that Turkey does not do that. At least, the government asks for their problems, treats them with respect, and gives them some perspective for the future. Is that enough? For sure not, but at least the prime minister admits the suffering of the Romas and calls them as his brothers and sisters. Practically, such a move might have resulted in demise of one's political career in Bulgaria. In Turkey, ones sees the Romas selling flowers, and picking paper, plastic, glass from rubbish bins, playing music around restaurants at where alcoholic beverages are served/sold. In general, I thank Anittas for cleverly raising the problems related to Bulgaria. In Turkey, racism targeting the Romas is an issue too. Probably, it is a problem in Romania or Moldova, but not as serious as the ones existing in Bulgaria.
|
|
|
Post by rusebg on Apr 5, 2010 8:35:14 GMT -5
I mean this: Yeah? It seems that a free apartment is not something that satisfies you. Hey, what if they want a three-storey villa somewhere near the Black Sea beach? Painted in pink with a special gatage for their wagons? Should the government fulfill such requirements as well? Suffering?! Give me a break. You said something about their culture and traditions. Well then, it is not in their culture and traditions to work and study. Isn't this so-called 'suffering' a result of this?
|
|
|
Post by thracian08 on Apr 5, 2010 12:06:52 GMT -5
wow Kastor, Turks not integrated, you sound ridicolous.
Turks are everywhere, in Europe, in America, and I can say the reason Turks in Germany weren't so much integrated was b/c of racism mostly. They were the uneducated villagers who were factory workers after WWII.
Contrastingly the Turks in USA are very integrated, it's b/c of not much racism, and the fact that people are not bound by ethnic lines in society, unlike Europe. And the fact that you immediately try to bring religion as a reason doesn't work. Your answer shows the bias in your judgement immediately.
|
|
|
Post by thracian08 on Apr 5, 2010 12:10:14 GMT -5
And speaking of Bulgaria, I have met Turks from Bulgaria who are quite integrated.
Additionally, you sound like a paranoid person, that we're going to take over Bulgaria - what a joke!
|
|
Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning
Senior Moderator
Simarik Turkish Pwincess
Know yourself...
Posts: 3,563
|
Post by Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning on Apr 5, 2010 13:08:48 GMT -5
Well considering Kastor lives in Germany seems he over intergrated but not as a german, more as a mixture of a Nazi and an orthodox racist priest. LOL personality defect ... he doesn't even know what he is just keeps trying to hate on Turks as that is what gives him some sense of identity.
|
|