ioan
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Post by ioan on Dec 13, 2010 5:32:35 GMT -5
No comment
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ivo
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Post by ivo on Dec 13, 2010 9:28:23 GMT -5
Great stuff Ioan! Thanks!
Anyway, ALL Serbian sources that I've come about from the early 1800's to just after the mid 1800's support the Bulgarian perspective. The BS Serb propaganda becomes their "official view" post 1880 I'd say.. and by the 1900's the BS had become a Serb national ideology.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Dec 13, 2010 9:35:27 GMT -5
Ha ha, the monkey got out of her cave earlier than i had predicted!
The project "south serbia" failed miserably, and now the tatars are back to business with Makedonia.
LOL
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ivo
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Post by ivo on Dec 13, 2010 10:00:49 GMT -5
Gyrryyy, relax ma.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Dec 13, 2010 10:03:13 GMT -5
wait a minute... its a Serbian source right? So according to you, it is not reliable, as such... lol
(tatars trapped in their shit as usual )
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Dec 13, 2010 10:04:15 GMT -5
BTW, Aziz!
i liked your answer to Srbobran in the other thread... You know which answer... The one which was never written lol
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Post by ljubotan on Dec 13, 2010 12:53:53 GMT -5
Can't argue with that fact you posted, but why don't you guys take about traditions/culture of Slavs in Macedonia and compare it to that of Serbians and Bulgarians. I think the language topic has been beat to death with each side having their own strong opinion.
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Post by Sh1 Shonić on Dec 13, 2010 15:40:53 GMT -5
Ioan
I think that name of the topic is misleading compared to the content of it. Topic name:Serbs about Macedonians in 1860 Content: Cover page of the book with title: Folk songs/poems of Macedonian Bulgarians - First book - Female songs
There is NO opinion or anything similar of Serbs toward Macedonians.
Conclusion:
You do not understand Serbian language well or You just want to instigate
As a moderator I am warning You not to instigate on this forum
Thank You in advance for Your cooperation
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Post by Novi Pazar on Dec 13, 2010 21:22:56 GMT -5
Ioan, this is irrelevant and it proves nothing at all. I don't need to go through this again, again and again what was spoken about this.
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ivo
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Post by ivo on Dec 14, 2010 2:00:53 GMT -5
Why do I get the feeling that the Serbs on this forum would prefer to conceal sources or delete posts rather than actually learning something?
Shonic, if you consider this post an instigation then there must be something wrong with you. In fact, your comment regarding the post is probably more of an instigation than this entire thread.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Dec 14, 2010 2:14:59 GMT -5
Funnily, this specific thread is the least instigating thread, in a long long time. Nearly, 99.99% of the rest of the content created by the Tatars in here, has been more hostile than this.
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Dec 14, 2010 2:57:05 GMT -5
Ioan I think that name of the topic is misleading compared to the content of it. Topic name:Serbs about Macedonians in 1860 Content: Cover page of the book with title: Folk songs/poems of Macedonian Bulgarians - First book - Female songs There is NO opinion or anything similar of Serbs toward Macedonians. Conclusion: You do not understand Serbian language well or You just want to instigate As a moderator I am warning You not to instigate on this forum Thank You in advance for Your cooperation I have just posted a first page of a book, issued in Belgrade, about Folk songs/poems of Macedonian Bulgarians in 1860. Its just a fact, not (my or anyone elses) interpretation. It just goes to show (at least for me) that in 1860 the Serbs though of the Macedonians as Macedonian Bulgarians. The book is issued in the Serbian Government printing office (according to the page), so we may assume that the serbian government suppored that view at that time. I understand quite well Serbian, because it is the closest slavic language to Bulgarian (if we assume Macedonian is different language from Bulgarian then Serbian is the second closest).
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Dec 14, 2010 3:03:26 GMT -5
^^^ No the title should be: SERB (one, not many) about Makedonian Bulgarians, which clearly differentiates them from the vast majority of Makedonians who have either a Serb or a Makedonian affinity.
But you have been worse than that... so i am not complaining.
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Post by Sh1 Shonić on Dec 14, 2010 8:08:12 GMT -5
Ioan I think that name of the topic is misleading compared to the content of it. Topic name:Serbs about Macedonians in 1860 Content: Cover page of the book with title: Folk songs/poems of Macedonian Bulgarians - First book - Female songs There is NO opinion or anything similar of Serbs toward Macedonians. Conclusion: You do not understand Serbian language well or You just want to instigate As a moderator I am warning You not to instigate on this forum Thank You in advance for Your cooperation I have just posted a first page of a book, issued in Belgrade, about Folk songs/poems of Macedonian Bulgarians in 1860. Its just a fact, not (my or anyone elses) interpretation. It just goes to show (at least for me) that in 1860 the Serbs though of the Macedonians as Macedonian Bulgarians. The book is issued in the Serbian Government printing office (according to the page), so we may assume that the serbian government suppored that view at that time. I understand quite well Serbian, because it is the closest slavic language to Bulgarian (if we assume Macedonian is different language from Bulgarian then Serbian is the second closest). So if I show You a book that for example Hungarians published about Croatian Serbians that means that Hungarians politics consider Croatians as Serbs or for example if htere is a book published in Belgrade about Bulgarian Romas it means that Belgrades official policy is that Bulgarians are Romas? And yes it is published in governments printing office but could You tell me how many private publishers existed in Serbia in 1860?
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Dec 14, 2010 8:19:26 GMT -5
So now I understand that for the Serbs some portion of the Macedonian population was Bulgarian. Ok, its a start.
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ivo
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Post by ivo on Dec 14, 2010 13:21:31 GMT -5
Absolutely correct. I'll see if I can find some of those Serbian sources I've read in the past. It's no secret that earlier, pre-propaganda, Serbian sources have supported the Bulgarian perspective.. nothing political about it, they've just recorded what they've seen (ie. the truth). And it's also no secret that the Bulgarian perspective is supported by nearly all independent sources.
There we go, the typical victim attitude that many Serbs (at least on this forum) seem to have.
The point is, that this is NOT a single source, this is not a single author. The Bulgarian identity of Macedonia is supported by a wide variatey of sources. Macedonians may identify as Macedonians today, however, they identified as Bulgarians in the past.. NEVER as Serbs. There are Serbs in Macedonia as well, however, those Macedonians have always been a tiny minority. Their numbers artificially increased post following the Second Balkan War, and more so, during Yugoslavia. That's all.
The Serbian perspective on this matter is irrelevant. They've been fed with so much propaganda for the past 80 years that they really believe that what they know is the only truth. None of them seem to stop to think why the rest of the world has views that are entirely contradictory to the Serbian propaganda they've been taught.
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Post by ljubotan on Dec 14, 2010 13:31:54 GMT -5
I just got back from a business trip in Atlanta, GA, and I met a couple Bulgarians that worked in the hotel. They didn't believe I couldn't understand Bulgarian, so they began speaking in their native tongue and I understand squat or a couple words; however, could not come to any conclusion to their sentences.
On the other hand without trying I've always understood Serbian regardless of the dialect (Sumadija - obviously easy, Zeta, Hercegovina etc). I do believe actually, the Serbian dialect I had to pay closer attention to was the Krajina Serb dialect out of Croatia.
I only speak for me and the immediate area my parents are from and Kumanovo; I don't know about other areas of Macedonia (Strumica, Ohrid etc).
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Post by terroreign on Dec 14, 2010 13:43:08 GMT -5
^Kumanovo and most of western Macedonians are renown in Macedonia as being Serbs "Serbomani", you could take a look at the Staro-Nagoricane flag for instance.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Dec 14, 2010 21:34:49 GMT -5
Guys, don't reason with these BuLgari, l'm sick and tired of their crap. I will be soon talking with these BuLgari about IMRO.
PS Guys, l will tell you all alittle secrete about Verkovich (Historically), if you are all interested, reply if you are!.
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