rex362
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Post by rex362 on Sept 1, 2018 13:51:11 GMT -5
my question is/was for the Wizard of serbia ......
you 2 know nothing compared to Pyrros on serbian matters
case closed !
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 14:44:06 GMT -5
The Serbs didn't came to Balkans from Carpathian mountains, but from eastern Germany. The best of the best of Russian, Poles, etc scientists believe that the slavic migration is a big fat hoax (and I agree with them) and that the BALKANS are the ORIGINAL homeland of the Slavs.
I wish Novi was around when I need him... can't find the sources right now...
isnt Vinca script identical to Slavic alphabet anyway?
or look it up in the book for which you made this python script. Its all in there.
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 14:49:17 GMT -5
Which makes sense why Roman emperors wanted to employ those fighters if the later Serb tribe had so huge people.
All Slavs/Serbs were tall.
Slavs (Thracians) was the most numerous race on earth after the Indians.
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 14:57:12 GMT -5
Till Novi (the ultimate authority on this matter comes) we can enjoy this :
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Sept 1, 2018 15:01:46 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2018 15:03:13 GMT -5
The Serbs didn't came to Balkans from Carpathian mountains, but from eastern Germany. The best of the best of Russian, Poles, etc scientists believe that the slavic migration is a big fat hoax (and I agree with them) and that the BALKANS are the ORIGINAL homeland of the Slavs.
I wish Novi was around when I need him... can't find the sources right now...
isnt Vinca script identical to Slavic alphabet anyway?
or look it up in the book for which you made this python script. Its all in there.
My theory based on genetics: Original Serb tribe was Indo-European. They moved from Yamna/Kurgan/Grave Pit culture, which encopased the northern peaks of Black Sea region all the way to western parts of Kazakhstan and northern peaks of Caucasian mountains. They first moved to the eastern Germany (where we have Lusatian Serbs) and then to the Balkans. Other South Slavs (excluding Slovenians) lived around Danube. They were the Sclavnians who moved in the Balkans before the Serbs. They were paleolithic Europeans we talk about. Later on Serb tribe came and assimilated other Sclavnians that were culturally and linguistically similar (but not so much genetically).
As an interesting side note I have to say that Grave Pit culture Indo-Europeans weren't blond with blue eyes like many think. That mutation happened later on. In fact it occured among I2a carriers before R1a (which original Serb tribe was). They had dark hair, brown eyes and so far the sciences shown that connection to Mongolic people is virtually absent.
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 15:05:45 GMT -5
btw to answer to the SLAVE joke :
It is hypocritical for latins/romans to act like they don't know the meaning of the word SLAV since they were made (by SATAN) after the Greeks, they were a newer more advanced model, based on the SLAVIC substrate of Italy (with Venice (vendi - venedi) being the strongest SLAVIC city)
So the transformation went like :
( rex362 rexhotanil take notes I wont write this again) :
SLOV -> SLAV (with a dead fat L, Slavic L is so full that Serbs in many cases converted this to O, e.g. ja sam bio, rest of slavs, south serbs included : ja sam biL) , this in Greek could be noted by TH-L to emphacize on the fatness of L -> CθΛΑΒ -> ΣΘΛΑΒ -> Romans converted Θ to C as it seemed convenient for their mockery -> SCLAV -> which back to Greek becomes ΣΚΛΑΒ = Slave.
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 15:09:09 GMT -5
The best of the best of Russian, Poles, etc scientists believe that the slavic migration is a big fat hoax (and I agree with them) and that the BALKANS are the ORIGINAL homeland of the Slavs.
I wish Novi was around when I need him... can't find the sources right now...
isnt Vinca script identical to Slavic alphabet anyway?
or look it up in the book for which you made this python script. Its all in there.
My theory based on genetics: Original Serb tribe was Indo-European. They moved from Yamna/Kurgan/Grave Pit culture, which encopased the northern peaks of Black Sea region all the way to western parts of Kazakhstan and northern peaks of Caucasian mountains. They first moved to the eastern Germany (where we have Lusatian Serbs) and then to the Balkans. Other South Slavs (excluding Slovenians) lived around Danube. They were the Sclavnians who moved in the Balkans before the Serbs. They were paleolithic Europeans we talk about. Later on Serb tribe came and assimilated other Sclavnians that were culturally and linguistically similar (but not so much genetically).
As an interesting side note I have to say that Grave Pit culture Indo-Europeans weren't blond with blue eyes like many think. That mutation happened later on. In fact it occured among I2a carriers before R1a (which original Serb tribe was). They had dark hair, brown eyes and so far the sciences shown that connection to Mongolic people is virtually absent.
ok how can genetics shed light on the migrations and dates of those migrations? Why wasn't it the other way around? Balkans -> Kaukas? Are there any assumptions? I would like to read the whole proof, including all hypotheses. If there is anything serious and substantial I am all ears. I mean if you have a link of some serious work pls share it.
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 15:13:36 GMT -5
My friend Rex........ So you find some online screenshot of 'Προς Ιδιον Υιον Ρωμανόν" a book I read in its greek original many years ago.
Now Rex, since you respect the credibility of this book, find me one mention, ONE MENTION of the words :
- alb - alv - skip - sip - ship - shkip - squip - arv -arnaout - arb
in *ANY* form you may imagine.........
you wont find any poor rexotanil...
cause at the time being ... THERE WERE NO ALBS IN THE BALKANS OR NEAR EAST
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2018 15:19:20 GMT -5
My theory based on genetics: Original Serb tribe was Indo-European. They moved from Yamna/Kurgan/Grave Pit culture, which encopased the northern peaks of Black Sea region all the way to western parts of Kazakhstan and northern peaks of Caucasian mountains. They first moved to the eastern Germany (where we have Lusatian Serbs) and then to the Balkans. Other South Slavs (excluding Slovenians) lived around Danube. They were the Sclavnians who moved in the Balkans before the Serbs. They were paleolithic Europeans we talk about. Later on Serb tribe came and assimilated other Sclavnians that were culturally and linguistically similar (but not so much genetically).
As an interesting side note I have to say that Grave Pit culture Indo-Europeans weren't blond with blue eyes like many think. That mutation happened later on. In fact it occured among I2a carriers before R1a (which original Serb tribe was). They had dark hair, brown eyes and so far the sciences shown that connection to Mongolic people is virtually absent.
ok how can genetics shed light on the migrations and dates of those migrations? Why wasn't it the other way around? Balkans -> Kaukas? Are there any assumptions? I would like to read the whole proof, including all hypotheses. If there is anything serious and substantial I am all ears.
Because the evidence suggest my theory has some truth in it. The remains found from paleolithic Balkans show they weren't the same as early Yamna/Kurgan/Grave pit culture people, which the original Serb tribe was. Paleolithic Balkans = I2a, paleolithic south Ukraine and Romania = I2a, modern South Slavs = I2a, Yamna = R1a, Lusatian Serbs = R1a, Serbian rulers of Nemanjic dynasty = R1a. Total R1a among Serbs = 18%, but larger frequency among Sumadija Serbs and Serbs around Zvornik. Another population with larger frequency of R1a, south Macedonia (but tested on really small sample) and northwestern Croatia.
PS. This picture describe what happened, and how those Indo-Europeans and Paleolithic Europeans pushed Corded Ware culture (proto-Germanic and proto-Celtic) further to the west:
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Sept 1, 2018 15:29:03 GMT -5
making a mockery of known history while mocking the good serb people
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 15:42:52 GMT -5
which the original Serb tribe was. Paleolithic Balkans = I2a, paleolithic south Ukraine and Romania = I2a, modern South Slavs = I2a, Yamna = R1a, Lusatian Serbs = R1a, Serbian rulers of Nemanjic dynasty = R1a. Total R1a among Serbs = 18%, but larger frequency among Sumadija Serbs and Serbs around Zvornik. Another population with larger frequency of R1a, south Macedonia (but tested on really small sample) and northwestern Croatia.
so what are our sources for old Serbs? The DNA of nemanic?
Was there an EXHAUSTIVE test on ANYONE who could be considered SERB back then in order to have a reference composition of genes? (I guess not).
So anything about genuine serbs is just speculation....
were ALL members of nemanici tested?
If only some were tested, and modern Serbs are *exactly* like the old, could it be that it was 20% probability for them to be R1a? What if the whole race was based on classes with R1a always being the leaders? so that the probability was 100%..
A lot of questions here.... Did we have all farmers or an adequate sample tested? soldiers tested? clerks? employees ? the guard? the priests ?
So if the whole thing worked like a cluster why couldn't it migrate to Caucaus as a whole? or to Poland/Germany?
things are far more complicated than this I suppose ..
The people who are against the migration theory have STRONG grounds, I mean they are technical correct given the means of the time. Something is wrong here.
Either such a migration took place and was of mythical proportions and its a shame that the western pseudo-history burried this under the carpet, or there was a minimal migration but with great power, of people who changed EVERYTHING. You saw those 80 Slavic toponyms in the southest (small) region in Greece right? (and the great renamings of 1926 ERASED the majority, those 80 remained AFTER the renamings !!!)
The Slavs were
either NUMEROUS or POWERFUL
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 15:45:16 GMT -5
making a mockery of known history while mocking the good serb people
rex bro is that you?
man, you got owned like 10 times in this thread, go back and consider your position man... otherwise you'll go losing to eternity ..
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 16:00:02 GMT -5
PS. This picture describe what happened, and how those Indo-Europeans and Paleolithic Europeans pushed Corded Ware culture (proto-Germanic and proto-Celtic) further to the west:
Describes... Hmm but does not prove. How can a single freaking notion of a haplogroup prove the very essence of existence of nations? and the most basic question :
so you find some similarity between e.g. Stefan Dusan and some freaking tribe in northern India. Alright.
How the FUNK do I know which is "older"? by excavations? And if the FUNK that India is "original" and later something older is found in e.g. Serbia?
let us not be kidding here.
GRANTED, official history is a joke.
BUT THE SAME EXACT I can say about this genetics thingy ...
ALL IS DONE BY WESTERN FUNDING/SPONSORING, and in WESTERN LABS!!
You think that if *ANYTHING* pro-Slav appears (pro-BALKAN) it will be funded and see the light of the Sun??? I really doubt it....
PROOF : ALL funding for archaeological research today in Serbia deals with Romans. Period. Nothing else. Thats a fucking joke.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2018 16:06:56 GMT -5
which the original Serb tribe was. Paleolithic Balkans = I2a, paleolithic south Ukraine and Romania = I2a, modern South Slavs = I2a, Yamna = R1a, Lusatian Serbs = R1a, Serbian rulers of Nemanjic dynasty = R1a. Total R1a among Serbs = 18%, but larger frequency among Sumadija Serbs and Serbs around Zvornik. Another population with larger frequency of R1a, south Macedonia (but tested on really small sample) and northwestern Croatia.
so what are our sources for old Serbs? The DNA of nemanic?
Was there an EXHAUSTIVE test on ANYONE who could be considered SERB back then in order to have a reference composition of genes? (I guess not).
So anything about genuine serbs is just speculation....
were ALL members of nemanici tested?
If only some were tested, and modern Serbs are *exactly* like the old, could it be that it was 20% probability for them to be R1a? What if the whole race was based on classes with R1a always being the leaders? so that the probability was 100%..
A lot of questions here.... Did we have all farmers or an adequate sample tested? soldiers tested? clerks? employees ? the guard? the priests ?
So if the whole thing worked like a cluster why couldn't it migrate to Caucaus as a whole? or to Poland/Germany?
things are far more complicated than this I suppose ..
The people who are against the migration theory have STRONG grounds, I mean they are technical correct given the means of the time. Something is wrong here.
Either such a migration took place and was of mythical proportions and its a shame that the western pseudo-history burried this under the carpet, or there was a minimal migration but with great power, of people who changed EVERYTHING. You saw those 80 Slavic toponyms in the southest (small) region in Greece right? (and the great renamings of 1926 ERASED the majority, those 80 remained AFTER the renamings !!!)
The Slavs were
either NUMEROUS or POWERFUL
No, of course there wasn't extensive DNA testing. Our government doesn't support any scientific studies so its all about those professionals with a lot of enthusiasm to conduct the researchs on their own, but Medieval Serbian DNA project is not something a group of enthusiasts could undertake. Lusatians Serbs have 65% of R1a. That's a lot. Medieval Serbia assimilated other South Slavic (Sclavinians) tribes and they weren't R1a but I2a, so if I have to give some estimate I'd say the haplogroup frequency didn't change much. The Serbs that arrived to Balkans probably were majority of R1a carriers, however when they formed the Serbian country with other South Slavs they subjugated they weren't R1a majority anymore.
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Sept 1, 2018 16:10:38 GMT -5
ahahahah you know that Alb, Arv etc was not used that early on bcs we were known and called ourselves Illyrian
maybe not in that book
Euphremius 1313
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 16:13:45 GMT -5
so what are our sources for old Serbs? The DNA of nemanic?
Was there an EXHAUSTIVE test on ANYONE who could be considered SERB back then in order to have a reference composition of genes? (I guess not).
So anything about genuine serbs is just speculation....
were ALL members of nemanici tested?
If only some were tested, and modern Serbs are *exactly* like the old, could it be that it was 20% probability for them to be R1a? What if the whole race was based on classes with R1a always being the leaders? so that the probability was 100%..
A lot of questions here.... Did we have all farmers or an adequate sample tested? soldiers tested? clerks? employees ? the guard? the priests ?
So if the whole thing worked like a cluster why couldn't it migrate to Caucaus as a whole? or to Poland/Germany?
things are far more complicated than this I suppose ..
The people who are against the migration theory have STRONG grounds, I mean they are technical correct given the means of the time. Something is wrong here.
Either such a migration took place and was of mythical proportions and its a shame that the western pseudo-history burried this under the carpet, or there was a minimal migration but with great power, of people who changed EVERYTHING. You saw those 80 Slavic toponyms in the southest (small) region in Greece right? (and the great renamings of 1926 ERASED the majority, those 80 remained AFTER the renamings !!!)
The Slavs were
either NUMEROUS or POWERFUL
No, of course there wasn't extensive DNA testing. Our government doesn't support any scientific studies so its all about those professionals with a lot of enthusiasm to conduct the researchs on their own, but Medieval Serbian DNA project is not something a group of enthusiasts could undertake. Lusatians Serbs have 65% of R1a. That's a lot. Medieval Serbia assimilated other South Slavic (Sclavinians) tribes and they weren't R1a but I2a, so if I have to give some estimate I'd say the haplogroup frequency didn't change much.
How do we know the Lusatian Serbs are more "pure" than the Balkan Serbs? or older? For starters their language is closer to Czech than Balkan. And they have at least 2 dialects. Maybe One dialect would be closer to Balkan Serb but its not...
I am sorry to say, but every aspect of this theory screams : white (pro-German, and effectively non-Slavic) superiority from miles away..
In my theory, liberation from the pro-west, pro-German attitude is basic for a free (at last) research..
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 16:14:32 GMT -5
maybe not in that book
Euphremius 1313
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Post by Pyrros on Sept 1, 2018 16:20:25 GMT -5
Our government doesn't support any scientific studies And its the wise thing to do given the circumstances. Because any funds should be directed to pro-roman excavations. As the EU dictators demand.
Historic research is about VERY SENSITIVE MATTERS...
It makes perfect sense that the west endorses only anti-Slav research....
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2018 16:35:34 GMT -5
No, of course there wasn't extensive DNA testing. Our government doesn't support any scientific studies so its all about those professionals with a lot of enthusiasm to conduct the researchs on their own, but Medieval Serbian DNA project is not something a group of enthusiasts could undertake. Lusatians Serbs have 65% of R1a. That's a lot. Medieval Serbia assimilated other South Slavic (Sclavinians) tribes and they weren't R1a but I2a, so if I have to give some estimate I'd say the haplogroup frequency didn't change much.
How do we know the Lusatian Serbs are more "pure" than the Balkan Serbs? or older? For starters their language is closer to Czech than Balkan. And they have at least 2 dialects. Maybe One dialect would be closer to Balkan Serb but its not... Pure in what? Take into account Slavic people in general and what you get is R1a haplogroup accounts for 60% of modern Slavs, the 20% is I2a, and about 20% is something else. If the Slavs 3000 BC were majority I2a then today most of the other Slavs would score I2a. They don't. Its not like the East or West Slavs had some advantage in comparison to South Slavs, in fact South Slavs had advantage - warmer climate, better possibility for agriculture and more neighbours with whom they could trade.
Its not pro-German because Yamna culture people aren't related to Nordic/Germanic/Celtic people, only Slavs and some Balts possess the group in the Europe. Pashtuns and some higher caste Indians have it too. I once posted Sanskrit language in another thread here. Only Slav can read it without problem. Eastern and Western Slavs better than South Slavs because of some phonetic differences. Germans and Germanic people don't belong to R1a, except for some small fractions but its negligible percent.
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