ioan
Amicus
Posts: 4,162
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Post by ioan on Sept 9, 2012 12:02:39 GMT -5
Kosnatntin Dragas Dejanovic, my friend, Kyustendil, Dobrich. blagojevgrad, pernik used to be Serbian, never forger that. Dobrich was not Serbian and I know only for Kustendil that was in the hands of a Serboi nobelman (Dragas) for like 10 years just before the Ottoman yoke when Bulgaria was practically devided into small pieces. Nothing to brag about. Actually we have more claim on Voden since Samuel at least ruled it for some decades (yet we dont claim it cause its populated with Greeks now). Remember that Beograd (as were all the lands east of Morava) was more years in Bulgarian hands than in Serbian. Nish was accepted as one of the main cities of Bulgaria by Serboi till...1878. Last but not least: the WHOLE of Serbia was a Bulgarian province and the same cant be said about Bulgaria! We were Byzantine province but never Serbian! Probably. The Serboi nobelmans and tcars respected Bulgaria in middle ages. Remember it was the patriarch of Bulgaria Simeon, together with the Archbishop of Ohrid, who crowned Dushan as car. Bulgarians allowed him to borrow our title for our monarch after Simeon wore it first since 9th century. 5 centuries later so did Dushan (who was 3/4 with Bulgarian blood, though I agree he acted like a Serbian king showing affection to his lands populated by Bulgarians though). yes It was a Serboi nobelman (I think Dragash again) and was it for more than 10 years out of couple of centuries under Bulgarian rule? Lets hope not only Western Bulgaria but the whole.
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ioan
Amicus
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Post by ioan on Sept 9, 2012 12:23:54 GMT -5
Torlaks are pure Srbi, the Shopi you mean, are ex-serbian traitors. If we look at what Torlaks thought of their language was we would find that they considered it Bulgarian, not Serbian. Also after forced serbanization in Serboi land in the Torlak areas there are still over 20000 Bulgarian according to your offical census. What do we have in Bulgaria: 0 Serboi. That alone simply and delicately answers the question who the Torlaks are (and were). Too bad you have ZERO knowledge on our history. Sure, Russia played major role after our liberation for like 10 years till Stefan Stambolov, but its role has no connection to bribing historians. Thats your wishful thinking again - you just do what every weak individual does when his rediculous ideas get rejected by everyone: he tries to blame it on some kind of conspiracy. Sure the whole of the Balkans were. Probably Serboi were SLIGHTLY better simply because they were liberated some decades earlier. As were Romania and Greece and all the other non Turk regions. However it wasnt for long: the Bulgarian legion left Serboi after Rakovski get to know Novakovich ideas and got to know the velikoserbian propaganda. Rather the Bulgarians politicians grew to know that not always Russia interests equalled ours. Hands up, its a lie. Eastern Serbia was more years in Bulgarian hands than in Serbian, Nish was considered by the Serboi as Bulgarian till late 19 century etc. Even today Serbia has territories with Bulgarian majority (officially recognized by the Serboi state via official census). Does Bulgaria has Serboi populated areas in our borders? No! This alone simply answers the question who has got lands that she shouldnt. Yet Bulgaria isnt like Nokia: getting smaller each year. Again you are proven wrong by facts: whose territory is questionable...
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Post by amateurs on Sept 9, 2012 13:28:18 GMT -5
Shut it Torlak (ex Bulgarian traitor)! Russia supported Serboi more than the Bulgarians (unfortunately). If Russia was supporting us she would ve interupted in the Second Balkan War to stop you from occupying Macedonia. She didnt. And that after the Bulgarians suffered the biggest casulties in the war with Turkey. Russia would not go so low as to support a backstabbing snake like Bulgaria. You backstab your allies, you get pwned!
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ioan
Amicus
Posts: 4,162
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Post by ioan on Sept 9, 2012 13:45:05 GMT -5
Russia would not go so low as to support a backstabbing snake like Bulgaria. You backstab your allies, you get pwned! 1885-Serbo-Bulgarian war: the very deffinition of backstabbing.
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Post by amateurs on Sept 9, 2012 14:32:18 GMT -5
There was no backstabbing there, since Serbia and Bulgaria were not allies. Serbia declared war on Bulgaria. Everything was in order.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 9, 2012 20:42:15 GMT -5
"The territory of modern Bulgaria was always populated with ethnic Bulgarians, just like Eastern Serbia, Vardar Macedonia, Northern Greece, Eastern Thrace and Northern Dobrogea. That's why we didn't lose any of our territory, like you did."
Serbian toponyms attest to the contrary. Just go and ask your Bulgarianised Shopi from Western Bulgaria why they celebrate VIDOVDEN!
Armani, keep away from the nationalist Attaka party, they are making you blind.
PS You know the Shopi even once had a Serbian Slava!
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 9, 2012 21:32:32 GMT -5
Ioan: "If we look at what Torlaks thought of their language was we would find that they considered it Bulgarian, not Serbian."
So your basing this claim from a monk who isn't even a linguist? Again, Torlakian just like Serbian Shopi are Serbian dialects which contain SERBO-SLAVIC DECLENSIONAL SYSTEM. BuLgarska Ezik is so un-slavic (Structurally) that it can be considered to be Vlach/Romanian...makes sense considering the amount of poor Vlachs Assen assilimated during his Bulgaro-Vlach Empire! Remember Old Church Slavonic could be classified as an Old Serbian dialect too, as it has the same SERBO-SLAVIC DECLENSIONAL SYSTEM. So lets remind you and some here of the Serbness of Shopi: BULgarski: he/she/they (Toj/Tya/To-e) Standard Serbian: he/she/they (On/Ona/Oni) Serbian Shopi: he/she/they (On/Ona/Oni) Ioan: "Also after forced serbanization in Serboi land in the Torlak areas there are still over 20000 Bulgarian according to your offical census. What do we have in Bulgaria: 0 Serboi. That alone simply and delicately answers the question who the Torlaks are (and were)."How can Serbs Serbianise its own people. Read and learn once more: Bulgarizing the SerbsJul 3, 1918, Wednesday Eastern and Southeastern Serbiathe Morava Valley, Nish, Skoplje--are at present in the hands of Bulgaria. There was a time, and not, so long ago, when, according to some students of the complications of races in the Balkans, Eastern Serbs and Western Bulgars ... query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.ht....9619C946996D6CFquery.nytimes.com/mem/archive-fre....9619C946996D6CBulgars Killed Serbs Brutally
BULGARS KILLED SERBS BRUTALLY; Ward Price Sees Proof of Wholesale Butcheries of Civilians. VILLAGERS GIVE DETAILS Tell of Peasants Being Tortured to Death and of Sufferings of Women Victims. Slaughtered 50 at a Time. BULGARS KILLED SERBS BRUTALLY Vranja Looted Periodically. By WARD PRICE. Special Cable to THE NEW YORK TIMES. Nov 19, 1918, Tuesday VRANJA, Serbia, Oct. 20. (via London, Nov. 17)--Here is a story of cold-blooded butchery without equal even in this war. It is a tale of deliberate, systematic effort by the Bulgarians extending over three months to exterminate the national spirit of ... query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.ht....FB7678383609EDEquery.nytimes.com/mem/archive-fre....FB7678383609EDEThe Bulgarians made their first use of deportations in the countries that had been given to Serbia by the peace of Bucharest in 1913, notably in Southern Serbia and a part of Macedonia. Thus they deported into Bulgaria almost all the Serbian families of Prizren and Prishtina; from Prilep, 170; from Krushevo, 70. At the end of 1915 an order was given to assemble and conduct away all the male population between the ages of 15 and 70 years from the districts of Veles, Poretch, and Prilep, where already torrents of blood had been shed. Like the Austrians and Hungarians, the Bulgars have been making deportations since July 1916, from all the Serbian territory they occupy. The northern part of the country is subject to Bulgarian rule. The families deported by the Bulgarians alone in the last six months of 1916 are estimated at 10,000. The Bulgarians are inhumane in their treatment of prisoners. They do not permit these unfortunates to prepare themselves, or to take away from their homes even the most indispensable articles, as the Germans do in Belgium. At Nish prominent persons were made prisoner in the streets without permitting them to say good-by to their families. The largest Serbian internment camp in Bulgaria is situated in a swampy plain near Sofia, where the families are housed in miserable sheds, and where they are dying of cold, hunger, and wretched sanitary conditions. Thus without any military necessity a part of the Serbian population has been systematically killed. The Bulgars have gone still further; they have deported into Bulgaria all the priests of the Serbian Church. The Bulgarian Synod has sent priests from Bulgaria and subjected all the occupied country to the Bulgarian Exarchate, which was obtained by force from the Sultan in 1871, but which the other Orthodox Greek Churches regard as schismatic. All the Serbian churches and convents have been pillaged. All the inscriptions recording the foundation of these institutions by Serbian Princes have been broken with axes. The famous convents of Ravanitza and Manassia have suffered most, though they date from the thirteenth century and had been respected even by the Turks. Furthermore, whatever the Bulgars have found written in the Serbian language they have destroyed absolutely. With this object they have made house-to-house search, and have confiscated all the books and manuscripts, even those of the churches, courts, and archives. All these were burned - until the Minister of Commerce at Sofia ordered all papers to be sent to the national printing office, stating that they would make good material for manufacturing paper. Immediately after occupation the Bulgarian authorities compelled the Serbs, whose family names usually end in "itch," to change that termination to "off," like those of Bulgarian families. Naturally, it was also at Belgrade that the Serbian teachers were interned; they were replaced by Bulgarians and the Bulgarian language was made compulsory. The children were compelled to learn the popular Bulgarian songs and heard the war explained from the Bulgar viewpoint; they were given to. understand that henceforth they were Bulgarians. Source: Source Records of the Great War, Vol. IV, ed. Charles F. Horne, National Alumni 1923 PS Enough of the Bulgarian lies please! Those Bulgars in the Western Outlands are Bulgarianized Serbs, just like the entire Western Bulgaria where Serbian toponyms exist, i.e, SRBENICA!
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 10, 2012 3:12:57 GMT -5
Like i said, there are 500 Servs in Bulgaria. These people are not indigenous, just very poor people which try to find better life in Bulgaria. the definition of ROTFLMAO
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Post by terroreign on Sept 10, 2012 5:55:58 GMT -5
ioan, Kyunstendil was ruled by Serbs from at least 1330 (battle of Velbuzd) to 1390 (death of Konstadin Dragas). from 1377 Konstadin was an Ottoman vassal but still had head authority of Kyustendil. Serb control still present.
So that makes it 60 years.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 10, 2012 6:18:12 GMT -5
^^^ certain tatars have issues with simple arithmetic, when it does not promote gooolyama bahlagriha (goolyama = golema = velika in proper serbian)
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 10, 2012 8:02:12 GMT -5
As l've said numerous times, yes, serbs ruled western bulgaria, BUT, the Ottomans assigned western bulgaria to serbian patriarchate because of its DENSE SERBIAN POPULATION!
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ioan
Amicus
Posts: 4,162
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Post by ioan on Sept 10, 2012 8:25:39 GMT -5
ioan, Kyunstendil was ruled by Serbs from at least 1330 (battle of Velbuzd) to 1390 (death of Konstadin Dragas). from 1377 Konstadin was an Ottoman vassal but still had head authority of Kyustendil. Serb control still present. So that makes it 60 years. Ok so I checked: direct Serbian rule: 1330-1355 (25 years) under feudal Velbazhd principality of Despot Deyan: 1355-1372 (17 years). So the direct rule is 25 years. The principality was semiindependant from the Serbian crown and its inhabitants were Bulgarians.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 11, 2012 2:51:34 GMT -5
^^^^ lol man, you have been bombarding us with propaganda about your supposed west oulands, but history proves that western bulgarian has always been serbian, that's why the speech of those people is so BLATANTLY closer to Serbian (more than makedonian) than proper eastern Bulgarian.
case closed.
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Post by terroreign on Sept 11, 2012 8:00:43 GMT -5
ioan, Kyunstendil was ruled by Serbs from at least 1330 (battle of Velbuzd) to 1390 (death of Konstadin Dragas). from 1377 Konstadin was an Ottoman vassal but still had head authority of Kyustendil. Serb control still present. So that makes it 60 years. Ok so I checked: direct Serbian rule: 1330-1355 (25 years) under feudal Velbazhd principality of Despot Deyan: 1355-1372 (17 years). So the direct rule is 25 years. The principality was semiindependant from the Serbian crown and its inhabitants were Bulgarians. And then after him Konstantin who was a Serb also ruled until 1390.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 11, 2012 8:09:43 GMT -5
"case closed."
Brate, it is case closed. Even Vardar was ruled longer by Serbs than Bulgars, if we add Sultana Marija then it will completely outweigh the Bulgars.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 11, 2012 9:27:50 GMT -5
^^^ their intonation is SO BLATANTLY closer to ukranian/russia than Makedonia/Serbian..... i don't know if this is supposed to be some sign of "purity" or some explicit Russian influence, this I cannot tell. But OTOH, I cannot imagine how *ONLY* the eastern Bulgarians use that speech, while the western speak more close to Serbian/Makedonian....
Their official accent is shockingly different than the one spoken in ex-Serbian eastern outlands (Pernik, Vidin, Blagoevgrad, Kyustendil, etc...)
Also not a surprise that the BOSNIAN Mrnjavcevici fought the turks in the battle of Marica having both Serbs and Bulgarians soldiers at their command.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 11, 2012 9:29:45 GMT -5
Mrnjavcevici are still worshiped in Bulgarian folklore. Leaders in the balkans are the Serbs. Balkan Slavs must be serbified. Balkan non-slavs must first be slavified. (like it used to be)
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Post by Shqipni13 on Sept 11, 2012 9:49:47 GMT -5
^Step away from the slavic dick sir. Remember you are a 40+ year old man.
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Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
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Posts: 9,814
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 11, 2012 9:51:27 GMT -5
^Step away from the slavic dick sir. Remember you are a 40+ year old man. fuck you animal.
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Post by masteralbanianknow on Sept 11, 2012 10:06:54 GMT -5
^Step away from the slavic dick sir. Remember you are a 40+ year old man. "Applause"
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