MiG
Amicus
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Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Apr 21, 2008 14:29:46 GMT -5
Ok guys, here's the deal. Give me a map of what the Balkans SHOULD look like (in your opinion), or just what you think is fair.
You may choose to give details as to why it should look like that, and you may not. No discussing nationalism please (If the map is nationalistic, then explain why it should be the way it is)
Thank you, and lets see some maps. ;D
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Post by Toskaliku on Apr 29, 2008 23:27:03 GMT -5
Personally I think that this is fair and balanced: Except keep Montenegro independent if it wishes to stay so... Kosova and parts of Macedonia should also be readjusted to fit the ethnic reality,
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Apr 30, 2008 23:19:55 GMT -5
^ Yeah I remember seeing that map somewhere. Not a bad suggestion at all.
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Post by radovic on May 11, 2008 13:41:52 GMT -5
Personally I think that this is fair and balanced: Except keep Montenegro independent if it wishes to stay so... I don't think Montenegro would be in such a scenario, the pro-union Montenegrins and Serb nationalists view a unification of RS and Serbia as the easiest way to incorporate Montenegro as a part of Serbia and not a seperate republic -- they advocate that RS section of Hercegovina go to Montenegro should Montenegro incorporate it's self directly into Serbia.
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Post by markosijekira on Jun 25, 2008 1:59:40 GMT -5
I think this should be the new map of the balkans ;D
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Japodian
Senior Moderator
Aber dojde donke
Posts: 117
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Post by Japodian on Jun 27, 2008 5:55:11 GMT -5
I think people should, especially Kosovo Albanians, leave Bosnia and Herzegovina in peace... If you are so eager to divide something, divide yourselves, leave my Bosnia in peace she needs... Svi zinuli na Bosnu i Makedoniju, majke ti...
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Post by Toskaliku on Jun 28, 2008 0:39:20 GMT -5
Your Bosnia is a failure, its best divided then as it is today... under the constant watch of others.
And that isnt an Albanian made map. Albanian maps would have included Presheva inside Albania.
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Japodian
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Aber dojde donke
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Post by Japodian on Jul 2, 2008 20:03:26 GMT -5
Your Bosnia is a failure, its best divided then as it is today... Bosnia is my fatherland and not your care to divide... If you want to start flames start them in your house... Bosnia has a long period the recover from crimes done by their neighbors interests... Albania should have this, Albania should have that... Come on, get a grip and finally realize that you can't have ethnically clean countries anywhere without the major wars with many victims, deaths and losses... Especially here in Balkans... Actually while politics is a w**re history is a b***h and you will try to divide and divide, try to take each others land, lose in that option, while someone will take your economy, buy and own your land, make most of your workers poor and ineffective, import foreign workers from various cheaper countries, change your laws to fit their own and in the end all of us will end like this...
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Post by Toskaliku on Jul 2, 2008 20:24:04 GMT -5
I think this should be the new map of the balkans ;D What German girls with our flag in the place where their s**t comes out of? Its not like youll get to fk any of these girls, so there is no point in ogling them. Its in my interest to see such tests fail in order to support my own interests. This is how things work, just like its in your interest to be against mine. Its how it all works out, so there is no point in playing the emotion card...
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Post by kapetan on Jul 7, 2008 14:57:51 GMT -5
Heh.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 7, 2008 14:58:46 GMT -5
I think this should be the new map of the balkans ;D What German girls with our flag in the place where their s**t comes out of? Its not like youll get to fk any of these girls, so there is no point in ogling them. Its in my interest to see such tests fail in order to support my own interests. This is how things work, just like its in your interest to be against mine. Its how it all works out, so there is no point in playing the emotion card... LOL since when is it in Bosnian's interest for Albania or Kosovo to fail? Go ahed. Wipe out Serbia. We really care.
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Japodian
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Aber dojde donke
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Post by Japodian on Jul 8, 2008 7:33:52 GMT -5
Yeah, this is how things work while it suits you, but when the tide of history change you will start whining. You stance is a simple demonstration that Kosovo Albanian policy is not just the enemy to the Serbs, but to the Bosniaks and Bosnians in general also. It was enough for me to show to the my fellow Bosnians [be it Bosniak, Serb or Croat] who love their historic Slavic land of Bosnia [which dates as a state 1000 years ago, not like Albania which actually exists for only mere 96 years] that there is actually no political difference between separatist in BiH and Tachi in terms of BiH division... Both are the enemies of BiH.
Any of proposed maps is a simple showcase of somebodies aspirations, while my EU showcase is not my wish but a simple logical deduction chain, showing that people making them are in their mind the slaves of imperialistic propaganda put upon them. Nobody even had a single thought about economy, people benefit, liberties, national growth and so on...
Especially the Greater Albania/Serbia/Croatia case in the first map which shows the aspiration for imperialistic growth without any economical background which are always historically doomed to failure...
Please do not now bombard me with typical Kosovo Albanian and Albanian history propaganda about your "ancient history" since I have passed a long walk in those lands and know quite enough not to be made an idiot by some pseudohistorian bulls**t.
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Japodian
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Aber dojde donke
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Post by Japodian on Jul 8, 2008 7:49:16 GMT -5
@kapetan:
Jednostavno tužno! Jad i bijeda balkanskog poluotoka!
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Post by Toskaliku on Jul 8, 2008 13:02:48 GMT -5
I support self-determination, thats all. Im neither an enemy nor a friend. My interest is simply that all people who seek self-determination should have a right to it, whether its in Kosova or Bosnia. My interest is simply in the well being of the Albanian people, my people, I couldnt care less about the anyone else, so Im not really all that determined to be qualified as an "enemy", call me "indifferent".
Stop speaking about Alb history as if you knew any of it. Bosnia, if counted as a state like Albania, is in fact far more recent. In fact, when did your Slav-love wars occur? In the 90's?
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Post by kapetan on Jul 8, 2008 14:54:41 GMT -5
Why the f**k are you picking a fight with a Bosniak insted of people whom actualy tried to stop Kosovo independance. Shut up.
And I suggest you check some facts before saying dumb s**t like Bosnia didn't exist before the 90's. There was a Medieval state of Bosnia long before any of this.
As for "Slavic land"...f**k that too. This is Bosnian land first. Balkan land. If I did wonna be united in anything common it would be that. Balkan. All that corny "pan-slavic" bulls**t is out the window. It didn't work before, it doesn't work now.
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Post by Toskaliku on Jul 8, 2008 19:54:12 GMT -5
I will say this, my view differs from the average Albanian. The average Albanian wants Kosova independent while forcing a united Bosnia just to piss of Serbs. I say its a mistake. Instead of focusing on pure inat, we should think that perhaps there is a way of appeasing the other side as well so they end the problems with us and we can finally move on.
If Bosnia can be divided for the sake of the Albanian people finally being able to move on and stop having relations with the Slavs to the north, then I say cut it how many times you like.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 9, 2008 0:32:26 GMT -5
I will say this, my view differs from the average Albanian. The average Albanian wants Kosova independent while forcing a united Bosnia just to piss of Serbs. I say its a mistake. Instead of focusing on pure inat, we should think that perhaps there is a way of appeasing the other side as well so they end the problems with us and we can finally move on. If Bosnia can be divided for the sake of the Albanian people finally being able to move on and stop having relations with the Slavs to the north, then I say cut it how many times you like. You think if RS gained independance Serbs would leave you alone? Lol Don't be so naive. They will hate you for all time, and they will also claim Kosovo for all time. NOTHING will stop that. They will ALWAYS eventualy try and try to take it. It's not in any Balkan man's blood, especialy there's, to let that shit go. They can't even get over battles that happend 600 years ago. So if you think giving Serbs more power and gassing them up is somehow going to benefit you....you're sadly mistaken. And the other side of that type of thinking is not that you'd only make a mistake there with them, but you'd gain a new enemy in Bosniaks, who have traditionaly supported you, and vice versa.
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Post by Toskaliku on Jul 9, 2008 1:33:30 GMT -5
Many Serbs have stated in the past that they wouldnt mind Kosova separating so much if RS could get the same treatment.
Oh and btw, there is little Albania nor any Albanian could do, nor wish for to, help in the breakup of Bosnia. This is just something I am wishing. But the threat, about gaining an enemy in Bosniaks, is not something Albanians should particularly fear. Bosnians and Bosnia is a paper entity, no real power and no real strength. Nothing in Albania was ever decided through the help of any Bosniaks.
And I have met plenty of Bosniaks, Muslim ones, recently who have showed themselves against Kosova since it looked to make more trouble for their own country.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 9, 2008 1:45:13 GMT -5
Many Serbs have stated in the past that they wouldnt mind Kosova separating so much if RS could get the same treatment. Oh and btw, there is little Albania nor any Albanian could do, nor wish for to, help in the breakup of Bosnia. This is just something I am wishing. But the threat, about gaining an enemy in Bosniaks, is not something Albanians should particularly fear. Bosnians and Bosnia is a paper entity, no real power and no real strength. Nothing in Albania was ever decided through the help of any Bosniaks. And I have met plenty of Bosniaks, Muslim ones, recently who have showed themselves against Kosova since it looked to make more trouble for their own country. Except those Bosniaks who gave you weapons and training. Except those Bosniaks who fought in KLA. Except those Bosniaks who did support your independance (majority did). As you said, your view is hardly the avarage Albanian view. If you're stupid enough to isolate yourself and ditch the support of someone who's done nothing to you, that's on you. I know plenty of Albanians who even personaly thanked me for Bosnian support in Kosovo war, as if I had done something to help them myself.
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Post by diurpaneus on Jul 9, 2008 10:35:52 GMT -5
here is a good map of the Balkans
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