|
Post by radovic on Jun 3, 2008 14:29:20 GMT -5
"U.S. to help Serbia on European path" 3 June 2008 Cameron Munter (FoNet, archive)
U.S. Ambassador to Serbia Cameron Munter says the U.S. wants to help Serbia on its path to the EU, and expects Serbia to have a pro-EU government.
“The U.S. is prepared to help Serbia’s pro-European orientation, and I believe that is what Serbia’s citizens want,” said Munter during a presentation of a U.S. exchange program entitled "Community Connections".
^ "European path" implies joining EU. The U.S. can not help in thias as the U.S. is not an EU member. Unless of course everything Le Pen in Frances says of the EU being an American puppet is true.
|
|
Panos
Membrum
Epicurus: Founder of Secularism & Developer of the Scientific Method
Posts: 69
|
Post by Panos on Jun 3, 2008 18:53:13 GMT -5
Why do people hate America so much?
Ok, they pretty much are the new Rome, everyone hates the guys that are so powerful they are ultimately responsible to no one - but as far as superpowers go we are much better off with America behind the wheel than France, Germany, Russia or China.
Apart from Kissinger, who wont travel anywhere without consulting a lawyer and has asked for his files to be unsealed only after his death, America has had no war criminals in its recent past.
The war in Iraq was necessary and yielded 2 benefits. 1) Had America not gone to Iraq and ended the Saudi monopoly on oil, unemployment in the EU would be on average 20% and the economies of the developed world would be in deep recession; & 2) Women would still be treated as mere chattel & the Kurds, who still are happy to see an American presence in Iraq, would be victims of gruesome frequent attacks.
This is a war against Islam, and it is a necessary one.
As to the EU being a puppet, it has a similar secular constitution and is founded on similar western ideology as America, so it would be expected that similarities would exist. America being the only world power, naturally has some influence on the actions others take - after all, you would be a fool to alienate yourself unnecessarily from the American economy.
|
|
|
Post by vinjak on Jun 3, 2008 19:26:02 GMT -5
America has had no war criminals in its recent past.
It has but they prosecuted in the U.S. and there forces are imune from any international law.
The danger of only one Superpower is evident they act without the need to consult or abide by laws that where established to stop chaos and thus are open to many a mistake.
Russia on its own as a superpower would also do the same so it is in everyones interest that there are 2 oposing Powers we need that type of balance.
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Jun 3, 2008 23:38:03 GMT -5
Panos, your idols - NATO, while fighting the evil, fighting crime, breaking the monopoly of oil (which monopoly, ever heard of Venezuela, Sakhalin, Russia??), and helping women of iraq, they also .... MURDERED 300,000 iraqis as well!!! Also 10,000 of their own (i guess most of them *proud* black or latino americans) were killed. Panos, how old are you and where do you live? If you live in greece, then our educational system has big problems.
|
|
|
Post by Toskaliku on Jun 3, 2008 23:56:26 GMT -5
4,000. Most of them are white rural Americans. The bulk of America's army still comes from the rural central America.
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Jun 4, 2008 1:52:16 GMT -5
4,000. Most of them are white rural Americans. The bulk of America's army still comes from the rural central America. + 4000 brits + the ones who have permanent cyco problems (effectively dead as well) = 10,000
|
|
|
Post by panagiotopoulos on Jun 4, 2008 2:10:56 GMT -5
Pyrros, Stop being so negative all the time.
|
|
|
Post by zgembo on Jun 4, 2008 2:39:43 GMT -5
The war in Iraq was necessary and yielded 2 benefits. 1) Had America not gone to Iraq and ended the Saudi monopoly on oil, unemployment in the EU would be on average 20% and the economies of the developed world would be in deep recession; & 2) Women would still be treated as mere chattel & the Kurds, who still are happy to see an American presence in Iraq, would be victims of gruesome frequent attacks. I don't think I understand. Iraq, under Sadaam, was one of the most secular Muslim states. Those in power now will be more 'traditional' in the Islamic treatment of women. They are after all a more democratic reflection of the prevelant mentalities in Iraq. How is Saudi (and OPEC) control over the oil market influenced by USA controlling Iraq? I don't hate America at all, I actually admire the country and its people. I do hate American foreign policy though, as does the vast majority of the world (beneficiaries of it being the lone exceptions).
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Jun 4, 2008 2:58:09 GMT -5
Pyrros, Stop being so negative all the time. says the guy with karma -12? Negative about who? It depends, what is negative for some people is positive for others, and since we are talking about against murdering 300,000+ ppl, i guess i am the positive one. Also, panos, panagiotopoulos, go find alternative places to express your anti-slav feelings.
|
|
|
Post by Toskaliku on Jun 4, 2008 3:05:20 GMT -5
4,000. Most of them are white rural Americans. The bulk of America's army still comes from the rural central America. + 4000 brits + the ones who have permanent cyco problems (effectively dead as well) = 10,000 The number isnt nearly that high for the Brits. A 2006 article had 100 dead troops. The number no doubt rose since then, but nowhere near 4000 Brits. Your numbers are still way off...
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Jun 4, 2008 3:40:52 GMT -5
My numbers are far more accurate than those of the creator of the Albanian nation: Bill Clinton, who claimed that the bad serbs killed 100,000 albs.
Also, "The bulk of America's army still comes from the rural central America." in case you didnt notice Central america is Mexiko, Panama, etc...
|
|
|
Post by chalkedon on Jun 4, 2008 3:54:15 GMT -5
Pano..The US blows..
I would prefer any other country that you stated above " behind the wheel " btw..i was born and raised in the US w/ polish ancestry so you can imagine that I wasnt a typical greek with the typical anti US attitude. I just got disgusted on how the US operates on my own and witnessing the injustices they commit on a daily basis while touting the protection of human rights and bla bla bla...
Your privacy and freedom are being raped on a daily basis...and the so called defender of freedom ( USA ) has to be one of the worst countries that employ espionage on their own citizens..
This all started to happen in the 90's...before then, i was also proud to be an american.
I hope the mexicans take over..just so they know how it feels
|
|
Panos
Membrum
Epicurus: Founder of Secularism & Developer of the Scientific Method
Posts: 69
|
Post by Panos on Jun 4, 2008 4:31:13 GMT -5
The war in Iraq was necessary and yielded 2 benefits. 1) Had America not gone to Iraq and ended the Saudi monopoly on oil, unemployment in the EU would be on average 20% and the economies of the developed world would be in deep recession; & 2) Women would still be treated as mere chattel & the Kurds, who still are happy to see an American presence in Iraq, would be victims of gruesome frequent attacks. I don't think I understand. Iraq, under Sadaam, was one of the most secular Muslim states. Those in power now will be more 'traditional' in the Islamic treatment of women. They are after all a more democratic reflection of the prevelant mentalities in Iraq. How is Saudi (and OPEC) control over the oil market influenced by USA controlling Iraq? I don't hate America at all, I actually admire the country and its people. I do hate American foreign policy though, as does the vast majority of the world (beneficiaries of it being the lone exceptions). Iraq under Saddam was only relatively secular. He espoused some secular ideas, but only under the delusion of pan-Arab grandeur. No real secularist would of undertaken the actions he took against Kuwait or the Kurds. Even though he may of been secular, he still could not curb the Sh'ia influence on society. Even though he abolished the Sharia courts, the mosques simply picked up the slack. I hope you are not suggesting Saddam was a good leader and should still be there today. Irrespective of the fact he was backed by the US once, doesn't change the terrible things he did. He broke the genocide convention; broke the non-proliferation treaty; invaded, annexed & engaged in acts of hostility to sovereign nations regularly & gave safe housing to international bad guys. As to the war and the benefits to the global economy, America opened another supply chain for oil ending the price dictatorship of the Saudi oil monopoly. Without the Iraqi oil in the market, prices could be up to 80% higher than they are today. Given how reliant western markets are on oil, had Iraqi oil not been available it's obvious what the consequences would of been.
|
|
|
Post by Novus Dis on Jun 4, 2008 4:35:59 GMT -5
No real secularist would of undertaken the actions he took against Kuwait or the Kurds. I think you're confused about what "secular" means.
|
|
Fender
Commanding Moderator
Hardarse
Posts: 2,653
|
Post by Fender on Jun 4, 2008 5:45:10 GMT -5
Why do people hate America so much? Ok, they pretty much are the new Rome, everyone hates the guys that are so powerful they are ultimately responsible to no one - but as far as superpowers go we are much better off with America behind the wheel than France, Germany, Russia or China. Apart from Kissinger, who wont travel anywhere without consulting a lawyer and has asked for his files to be unsealed only after his death, America has had no war criminals in its recent past. The war in Iraq was necessary and yielded 2 benefits. 1) Had America not gone to Iraq and ended the Saudi monopoly on oil, unemployment in the EU would be on average 20% and the economies of the developed world would be in deep recession; & 2) Women would still be treated as mere chattel & the Kurds, who still are happy to see an American presence in Iraq, would be victims of gruesome frequent attacks. This is a war against Islam, and it is a necessary one. As to the EU being a puppet, it has a similar secular constitution and is founded on similar western ideology as America, so it would be expected that similarities would exist. America being the only world power, naturally has some influence on the actions others take - after all, you would be a fool to alienate yourself unnecessarily from the American economy. Panos 2 reasons why Iraq was invaded. 1. To secure oil resources 2. Just as important and the main reason why they invaded Iraq was because Saddam decided to dump the US dollar in favour of the Euro when trading oil. This has an obvious affect on the US currency. This is why the US now wants to invade Iran because it to, has dropped the US dollar in favour of the Euro, as well as Russia and now China are in the throws of seling off the US dollar, also in favour of the EURO. This is how the sub prime saga in the US came to be. As the US dollar weakened, sub prime loans suddenly became expensive. You will notice that at about the same time, price of oil has gone through the rough. This has been done artificially by the US to ensure that the remaining countries still using the US dollar, will somehow boost the value of its currency. All the US have done is to ensure that the world economy will grind to a halt and any countries not reliant on the US dollar, will be king.
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Jun 4, 2008 6:07:26 GMT -5
Nice analysis Fendz!
|
|
|
Post by Novi Pazar on Jun 4, 2008 7:14:42 GMT -5
Fends, bullseye!.
|
|
Panos
Membrum
Epicurus: Founder of Secularism & Developer of the Scientific Method
Posts: 69
|
Post by Panos on Jun 4, 2008 7:35:18 GMT -5
Why do people hate America so much? Ok, they pretty much are the new Rome, everyone hates the guys that are so powerful they are ultimately responsible to no one - but as far as superpowers go we are much better off with America behind the wheel than France, Germany, Russia or China. Apart from Kissinger, who wont travel anywhere without consulting a lawyer and has asked for his files to be unsealed only after his death, America has had no war criminals in its recent past. The war in Iraq was necessary and yielded 2 benefits. 1) Had America not gone to Iraq and ended the Saudi monopoly on oil, unemployment in the EU would be on average 20% and the economies of the developed world would be in deep recession; & 2) Women would still be treated as mere chattel & the Kurds, who still are happy to see an American presence in Iraq, would be victims of gruesome frequent attacks. This is a war against Islam, and it is a necessary one. As to the EU being a puppet, it has a similar secular constitution and is founded on similar western ideology as America, so it would be expected that similarities would exist. America being the only world power, naturally has some influence on the actions others take - after all, you would be a fool to alienate yourself unnecessarily from the American economy. Panos 2 reasons why Iraq was invaded. 1. To secure oil resources 2. Just as important and the main reason why they invaded Iraq was because Saddam decided to dump the US dollar in favour of the Euro when trading oil. This has an obvious affect on the US currency. This is why the US now wants to invade Iran because it to, has dropped the US dollar in favour of the Euro, as well as Russia and now China are in the throws of seling off the US dollar, also in favour of the EURO. This is how the sub prime saga in the US came to be. As the US dollar weakened, sub prime loans suddenly became expensive. You will notice that at about the same time, price of oil has gone through the rough. This has been done artificially by the US to ensure that the remaining countries still using the US dollar, will somehow boost the value of its currency. All the US have done is to ensure that the world economy will grind to a halt and any countries not reliant on the US dollar, will be king. There is very little truth in what you are saying. Iran is a nation that has a Government which has stated that Israel should be wiped off the map, that prints Anti-Semitic propaganda regularly, that believes an apocalypse with Israel will bring about the coming of their messiah and that decreasing interest rates decreases inflation. On top of these stupid beliefs, Iran is also working toward the development of nuclear weapons, no doubt to achieve its goals of bringing on judgement day. Not only that, citizens are banned from owning satellites, Sharia law is in full effect and all non-Muslims and non-Persians live out in chanty towns or are in exile in Europe or the USA. The invasion of Iran would primarily be because it is run by a crackpot & as a nation is a threat to world peace. You would need to have some other agenda to say this was not the prime motive of a military operation in Iran. Iraq on the other hand was invaded to end the Saudi monopoly on oil, and to diminish Saudi revenues as Saudi Arabia is the prime supporter of islamic terrorism. September 11 was orchestrated largely by Saudi nationals. The whole premise of WMDs was either faulty intel or a blatant lie, neither of which changes the fact that Saddam had to go and that the Saudi oil monopoly had to end for the survival of the world economy. In your post you've ignored a lot of humanist aid to the Kurds, who still welcome the US in Iraq. I am not accusing you (at this stage), but it does appear that you have an anti-American agenda. Will you concede that some good humanitarian work has been done, especially in the Kurdish areas, by the US? As to the sub-prime (a topic which I have intimate knowledge), it has nothing to do with the alleged abandonment of the USD, and everything to do with economic mismanagement. The Sub-prime existed to give people with poor credit ratings (who have usually defaulted in the past), credit. This in itself was a problem. The weakening USD was caused by over-printing and global economic slow down, this meant the value of a dollar to repay loans was less; and more dollars were needed to repay the same monthly interest expense. On top of this, interest rates were rising. This meant the repayments on interest were higher. This was compounded on the fact that the USD was weakening. Most people defaulted on their loans and this further damaged an already damaged economy. This phenomena is known as stagflation and is very damaging.
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Jun 4, 2008 8:39:20 GMT -5
"I am not accusing you (at this stage), but it does appear that you have an anti-American agenda. "
Panos, how would it seem to your american eyes, if NATO, bombed the shit out of our country, just because we dont acknowledge ths turkish minority in Xanthi? If suddenly CNN, BBC start intensive media war against greece? How would it seem if NATO signed a peace agreement for UN presence in Xanthi, but within the borders of Greece, and then after 10 years pushed to turks to unilaterally declare independence?
Would you be so pro-NATO then? I guess not.
P.S. Just to save some ink here, yes albs in Yugoslavia enjoyed one of the most broad autonomies (in the most liberal/modern country of the south and/or east and/or central europe).
P.S.2 How do you feel about the criminal, illegal, unacceptable aggression of NATO against the aforementioned country?
|
|
|
Post by Toskaliku on Jun 4, 2008 11:44:23 GMT -5
I meant the center of the US.
|
|