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Post by Novus Dis on Jul 16, 2008 23:01:19 GMT -5
LMAO.
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Post by sweetnugs on Jul 16, 2008 23:21:27 GMT -5
Do Serbs in RS hate themselves for having these same exact CIPS cards where nothing indicates that RS exists?
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Post by Novus Dis on Jul 17, 2008 2:55:44 GMT -5
Do Serbs in RS hate themselves for having these same exact CIPS cards where nothing indicates that RS exists? No. We call ourselves Bosnians and if Sarajevo wasn't polluted we would call it our capital.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 17, 2008 3:02:27 GMT -5
Do Serbs in RS hate themselves for having these same exact CIPS cards where nothing indicates that RS exists? No. We call ourselves Bosnians and if Sarajevo wasn't polluted we would call it our capital. polluted? with what exactly? And I'm glad you call yourselves Bosnians, that's a step forward
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Post by Novus Dis on Jul 17, 2008 5:47:38 GMT -5
polluted? with what exactly? Arabic chants. Air pollution. And I'm glad you call yourselves Bosnians, that's a step forward We stay true to ourselves. Its not like we're going to make a pseudo ethnicity like the "Bosniaks" did.
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Post by sweetnugs on Jul 17, 2008 17:06:54 GMT -5
polluted? with what exactly? Arabic chants. Air pollution. And I'm glad you call yourselves Bosnians, that's a step forward We stay true to ourselves. Its not like we're going to make a pseudo ethnicity like the "Bosniaks" did. I'm an agnostic and I don't quite get why would anyone be bothered by Arabic Chants or Church Bells. Your parents really hit a brick wall with raising you to be an ignorant little clown. Please don't marry and have children, we have enough bastards in this world. Castrate yourself if you will, it would help the rest of normal people in this world. And you stay true to yourself? Really!? You used to be pagan b***h, what happened to staying true to your roots? You adopted a religion, just like Bosniacs, Croats and others did. Why do you think Serbs are so special? You're just like everyone else and the sooner you stop thinking like a crazy person, the better this world will be. And we all see how true and badass Serbs are, Kosovo was taken away from you and you hardcore heroes have nothing left but to b***h on the Internet and carry on some retarded half ass cyber war. Very true indeed!
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Post by kapetan on Jul 17, 2008 17:17:57 GMT -5
polluted? with what exactly? Arabic chants. Air pollution. And I'm glad you call yourselves Bosnians, that's a step forward We stay true to ourselves. Its not like we're going to make a pseudo ethnicity like the "Bosniaks" did. Well funny since churches, synogoes and mosques all co-exist in Sarajevo with no problem, unlike most places. And hey we figure, we're allowed our Muslim chants in the city we built, when Belgrade was still a villige. Population of belgrade in the mid 1800's = 12 thousand population of sarajevo = 60,000 (AFTER wars and plagues before that it was over 80,000). every person who came through remarked about its hospitality and goods which came from everywhere from persia and india to poland and africa.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jul 17, 2008 17:20:05 GMT -5
Serbs converted to Orthodox Christianity naturally without pressure from the ERE.
Turks gave Serbs in Bosnia had two choices when they arrived: convert or lose your land.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 17, 2008 17:24:08 GMT -5
Serbs converted to Orthodox Christianity naturally without pressure from the ERE. Turks gave Serbs in Bosnia had two choices when they arrived: convert or lose your land. LMFAO wow what a lie. Orthodox Monks themsevles remarked that people were volonterily converting. There has never been ANY proof of any forceful mas conversions in Bosnia besides the practise of taking kids to raise them as soldiers. before islam the catholic and oprthodox church were competing for who would get the Bosnians since they weren't particularly religious and didn't know much. One visitor remarked the priests didnt even know how to write or preform a baptism. during ottoman times is when the orthodox church GREW MOST in bosnia. They built you f**kin churches and even schools. The Bosnian Franciscans (and the Catholic population as a whole) were protected by official imperial decree, although on the ground these guarantees were often disregarded and their numbers dwindled.[1] The Orthodox community in Bosnia, initially confined to Herzegovina and Podrinje, spread throughout the country during this period and went on to experience relative prosperity until the 19th century
Ottoman rule also changed the ethnic and religious makeup of Bosnia and Herzegovina. Many Catholic Bosnians retreated to Croatia, which was controlled by Habsburg Austria after the Ottoman conquest of most of the Kingdom of Hungary, and to Dalmatia, which was controlled by the Republic of Venice after the fall of Hungary. Orthodox Serbs and Vlachs from Herzegovina and the neighboring Sanjak of Smederevo (Belgrade Pashaluk) migrated into parts of Bosnia. Many Vlachs later assimilated into the local Serb, Bosniak, and Croat populations. The Ottoman period also saw the development of a Sephardic Jewish community in Bosnia, chiefly in Sarajevo. The Sephardic Jews were persecuted in and expelled from Catholic Spain at the end of the fifteenth century, and many resettled in the Ottoman Empire because of its tolerance towards other religions (especially towards People of the Book), mainly in and around Istanbul. The first synagogue was built in Sarajevo in 1581.
Your serbian propaganda has you thinking you it was some 500 year long holocaust lmao. all historical proof goes against that, but serbs find it necesery to belive it cuz it fuels their nationalism. In fact only at the decline of the ottoman empire did Muslims start to feel animosity towards the christians due to political reasons, taxes and russia sticking it's nose into everyones business.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jul 17, 2008 17:25:58 GMT -5
At first I thought you were different but it turns out you're as delusional as all the other Muslims on this forum.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 17, 2008 17:28:53 GMT -5
At first I thought you were different but it turns out you're as delusional as all the other Muslims on this forum. No you're just a blinded fuckin radical. I have no love towards trks or anyone, i'm just stating FACTS. every single book i've read about the ottoman empire and bosnia (none of which were written by any balkan people) says exactly what i just did. i just pasted shit from wiki as well. you just cant accept facts and are desperatly holding onto your delusion cuz that way your nationalism is stronger.
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Post by sweetnugs on Jul 17, 2008 17:29:09 GMT -5
At first I thought you were different but it turns out you're as delusional as all the other Muslims on this forum. hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha coming from you, thats absolutely genius!
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Post by kapetan on Jul 17, 2008 17:34:25 GMT -5
Yea I'm like all the rest as soon as we dissagree on a topic. That's really logical. It's either your way or the highway anyone who doesn't agree shouls die. I'd hate to be your fuckin' friend in real life, cuz one day they'll dissagree with you and you'll freak out like a bitch.
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Post by sweetnugs on Jul 17, 2008 17:35:55 GMT -5
Haha daj jarane znas kako ide kod radikalni Srba, ako ne mislis kao oni onda mora da si lud. Ovaj decko je puko davnih dana, malo je zalosno kad skontas sta nacionalizam kroz familiju radi. Djeca ispadose sa manjkom pameti, kulture i prirodnog ponasanja.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 17, 2008 17:37:57 GMT -5
lmao During the first centuries of control over Balkans by the Ottoman Empire, the Christian population, and especially the Orthodox Christians (who were not under the protection of*great Power of that time, as were the Catholics, until the rise of Imperial Russia), faced various degrees of tolerance, both from local Ottoman authorities and from the Sultan. The Ottoman Empire was, in principle, tolerant towards Christians and Jews, but not polytheists, in accordance with Sharia law. Forced conversion is counter to Sharia law, and was not standard practice, so was not practiced. Though far short of modern standards, Ottoman tolerance was particularly constructive compared to the contemporary situation in Europe. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_Ottoman_EmpireThe main idea behind Ottoman law system was "Confessional community". Ottomans tried to give choice to the person, opposed to forced classifications. Muslims-Jews-Christians should not enforce their view on another. However, there were gray areas where these circles intersect. The Ottoman Empire decreed that people of different millets should wear specific colors of, for instance, turbans and shoes—a policy that was not, however, always followed by Ottoman citizens Now of course a Serb will post some specific incident where some Serb suffered under Ottomans empire, as if people didn't suffer all over the world under anyone.
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Zvone
Amicus
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Posts: 525
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Post by Zvone on Jul 17, 2008 17:41:20 GMT -5
Another example would be the Moors. Religion is politically based, the people that did convert did it out of benefit to their social ranking, wealth, prestige, etc. But, in most cases, they were not forced conversion unlike the Inquisition and similar campaigns.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jul 19, 2008 8:02:19 GMT -5
No you're just a blinded f**kin radical. HA! I have no love towards trks or anyone, i'm just stating FACTS. every single book i've read about the ottoman empire and bosnia (none of which were written by any balkan people) says exactly what i just did. i just pasted s**t from wiki as well. you just cant accept facts and are desperatly holding onto your delusion cuz that way your nationalism is stronger. What facts? All you have given me is baseless claims.
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Post by kapetan on Jul 19, 2008 15:41:25 GMT -5
Baseless claims? did you just read all I pasted? It can easily be foudn on wiki. The FACT, that the Ottoman Empire was nowhere near as bad as the Serbian people like to belive today. The FACT that granted that you convert to Islam, anyone of any background could become Grand Vizier, the 2nd most powerful position in the whole Empire, behind the Sultan. Tha fact that this actualy has happend. The fact that people lived better under the Ottoman Empire most of the time then in the rest of Europe which had religious persecution out the ass. The fact that Christians, Jews and Muslims co-existed in Bosnia in such a manner that most foreigners were impressed and wrote about it. I mean how can I prove to you these facts? By showing you info right? But what good is that if you just declare everything lies? So who exactly do I need to get to explain this to you? It's general history. The History channel had a program about this exact topic it can be found on youtube. So once again. The Bosnian Franciscans (and the Catholic population as a whole) were protected by official imperial decree, although on the ground these guarantees were often disregarded and their numbers dwindled.[1] The Orthodox community in Bosnia, initially confined to Herzegovina and Podrinje, spread throughout the country during this period and went on to experience relative prosperity until the 19th century
Ottoman rule also changed the ethnic and religious makeup of Bosnia and Herzegovina. Many Catholic Bosnians retreated to Croatia, which was controlled by Habsburg Austria after the Ottoman conquest of most of the Kingdom of Hungary, and to Dalmatia, which was controlled by the Republic of Venice after the fall of Hungary. Orthodox Serbs and Vlachs from Herzegovina and the neighboring Sanjak of Smederevo (Belgrade Pashaluk) migrated into parts of Bosnia. Many Vlachs later assimilated into the local Serb, Bosniak, and Croat populations. The Ottoman period also saw the development of a Sephardic Jewish community in Bosnia, chiefly in Sarajevo. The Sephardic Jews were persecuted in and expelled from Catholic Spain at the end of the fifteenth century, and many resettled in the Ottoman Empire because of its tolerance towards other religions (especially towards People of the Book), mainly in and around Istanbul. The first synagogue was built in Sarajevo in 1581.
During the first centuries of control over Balkans by the Ottoman Empire, the Christian population, and especially the Orthodox Christians (who were not under the protection of*great Power of that time, as were the Catholics, until the rise of Imperial Russia), faced various degrees of tolerance, both from local Ottoman authorities and from the Sultan.
The Ottoman Empire was, in principle, tolerant towards Christians and Jews, but not polytheists, in accordance with Sharia law. Forced conversion is counter to Sharia law, and was not standard practice, so was not practiced. Though far short of modern standards, Ottoman tolerance was particularly constructive compared to the contemporary situation in Europe.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_Ottoman_Empire
The main idea behind Ottoman law system was "Confessional community". Ottomans tried to give choice to the person, opposed to forced classifications. Muslims-Jews-Christians should not enforce their view on another. However, there were gray areas where these circles intersect.
The Ottoman Empire decreed that people of different millets should wear specific colors of, for instance, turbans and shoes—a policy that was not, however, always followed by Ottoman citizens.OTTOMAN EMPIRE HISTORY CHANNEL SPECIAL PART 1 PART 2 PART 3
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Post by Novus Dis on Jul 19, 2008 20:20:38 GMT -5
Baseless claims? did you just read all I pasted? It can easily be foudn on wiki. The FACT, that the Ottoman Empire was nowhere near as bad as the Serbian people like to belive today. The FACT that granted that you convert to Islam, anyone of any background could become Grand Vizier, the 2nd most powerful position in the whole Empire, behind the Sultan. Tha fact that this actualy has happend. The fact that people lived better under the Ottoman Empire most of the time then in the rest of Europe which had religious persecution out the ass. The fact that Christians, Jews and Muslims co-existed in Bosnia in such a manner that most foreigners were impressed and wrote about it. I mean how can I prove to you these facts? By showing you info right? But what good is that if you just declare everything lies? So who exactly do I need to get to explain this to you? It's general history. The History channel had a program about this exact topic it can be found on youtube. So once again. The Bosnian Franciscans (and the Catholic population as a whole) were protected by official imperial decree, although on the ground these guarantees were often disregarded and their numbers dwindled.[1] The Orthodox community in Bosnia, initially confined to Herzegovina and Podrinje, spread throughout the country during this period and went on to experience relative prosperity until the 19th century
Ottoman rule also changed the ethnic and religious makeup of Bosnia and Herzegovina. Many Catholic Bosnians retreated to Croatia, which was controlled by Habsburg Austria after the Ottoman conquest of most of the Kingdom of Hungary, and to Dalmatia, which was controlled by the Republic of Venice after the fall of Hungary. Orthodox Serbs and Vlachs from Herzegovina and the neighboring Sanjak of Smederevo (Belgrade Pashaluk) migrated into parts of Bosnia. Many Vlachs later assimilated into the local Serb, Bosniak, and Croat populations. The Ottoman period also saw the development of a Sephardic Jewish community in Bosnia, chiefly in Sarajevo. The Sephardic Jews were persecuted in and expelled from Catholic Spain at the end of the fifteenth century, and many resettled in the Ottoman Empire because of its tolerance towards other religions (especially towards People of the Book), mainly in and around Istanbul. The first synagogue was built in Sarajevo in 1581.
During the first centuries of control over Balkans by the Ottoman Empire, the Christian population, and especially the Orthodox Christians (who were not under the protection of*great Power of that time, as were the Catholics, until the rise of Imperial Russia), faced various degrees of tolerance, both from local Ottoman authorities and from the Sultan.
The Ottoman Empire was, in principle, tolerant towards Christians and Jews, but not polytheists, in accordance with Sharia law. Forced conversion is counter to Sharia law, and was not standard practice, so was not practiced. Though far short of modern standards, Ottoman tolerance was particularly constructive compared to the contemporary situation in Europe.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_Ottoman_Empire
The main idea behind Ottoman law system was "Confessional community". Ottomans tried to give choice to the person, opposed to forced classifications. Muslims-Jews-Christians should not enforce their view on another. However, there were gray areas where these circles intersect.
The Ottoman Empire decreed that people of different millets should wear specific colors of, for instance, turbans and shoes—a policy that was not, however, always followed by Ottoman citizens.OTTOMAN EMPIRE HISTORY CHANNEL SPECIAL PART 1 PART 2 PART 3 Lets have a look at your source...
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Post by kapetan on Jul 19, 2008 20:41:50 GMT -5
My source was wikipedia which shows it's sources on the bottom.
The other thing was a special on History channel about the Ottoman Empire, which I doubt you even watched. It had, you know, actual historians and experts in the field.
Also I hope you realize pointing out negatives in Otoman life (which there certinly was, since taxes were highest during war time, which was usual) doesn't mean it was WORSE then in other places. Yes there was limits on minorites. Show me one place where there wasnt at the time? While Europe was drowning it's Roma population by the hundreds and drivin them out by the thousands the Ottomans gave them a tax like anyone else.
Everyone knows Muslims were the top of the ladder in the Ottoman Empire dips**t. However they showed more tolerance to other groups. more then anyone in Europe was doing. As the Spanish inquisiton and other things clearly show. Ottoman Empire welcomed those Jews driven out of Spain. Those same Catholics declared crasades on everyone from Muslims to pagan Slavs in case you didn't know.
And if you watch the video a bunch of different historicans will say the same. Holla.
But you're too arrogant for the History Channel, after all it's a channel dedicated to anti-serb conspiracies!!!
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