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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 16, 2008 8:33:31 GMT -5
we should make Pyrros an honorary Serb, he has more hate against the Bosniaks within him self then all the forum Serbs combined… I don't hate Bosniaks since its hard to hate an Austrian propaganda invention. I might as well start hating the idea of Greater Serbia.
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Jun 16, 2008 12:27:59 GMT -5
^ Why would you start hating the idea of Greater Serbia? It's not an Austrian Invention.
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Post by Ja Ona i Pivo on Jun 16, 2008 12:57:23 GMT -5
^ Why would you start hating the idea of Greater Serbia? It's not an Austrian Invention. ur right MiG, its an aussie dijaspora invention
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 16, 2008 19:12:33 GMT -5
It's not an Austrian Invention. Yes, it is a term used to identify the reasoning behind the pseudo Serb threat in the Balkans and the idea was exploited so as to enslave Bosnia under Austrian yoke easily. Unfortunately for the Austrians everyone believed the pseudo threat except for the Serbs (who mostly turned on the Austrians after they illegally annexed Bosnia under the guise of humanitarian intervention). One of those Serbs happened to be a young anarchist by the name of Gavrilo Princip... the rest is history.
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Demonel
Amicus
I am Jack's regained insanity.
Posts: 833
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Post by Demonel on Jun 16, 2008 20:47:59 GMT -5
You should work on your history. The term was coined by a Serb. Bosnia was given to Austro-Hungarian Empire not Austria since they couldn’t decide on which one would govern it (thus it was controlled by both Austria and Hungary). Both Austro-Hungarian Empire and Ottoman Empire agreed on this as a means of pacification of Bosnia. www.onwar.com/aced/nation/all/austrohun/fbosnia1878.htmTreaty of Berlin was signed on July 13, 1878 (Article XXV concerned Bosnia); on June 5 1878 Narodni Odbor was formed in Sarajevo. Their goal was to fight the Austrian forces. On July 7, 1878, they made Veli pasha the ottoman military commander of Bosnia resign. On July 27, 1878, they renounced the ottoman rule and formed Narodna Vlada. It did not last very long since they were too slow. The commander of the occupational forces Filipovic started a military court in Doboj as the first instance of Austro-Hungarian rule. www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/boshtml/bos127.htmUnder the leadership of Count Aehrenthal, Minister of Foreign Affairs, the Government of the Dual Monarchy found in the Turkish revolution of 1908, a convenient, opportunity for annexation which was their original plan. When Austria proclaimed the annexation of Bosnia and Herzegovina on October 6, 1908, Serbia and Montenegro began to mobilize troops. Both countries considered these two provinces to be under their sphere of influence and were unwilling to surrender these claims to Austria. The Russian government, having been uninformed of its foreign minister's arrangements at Buchlau, ordered Izvolski to oppose Austrian actions and support Serbian claims. As the Serbs continued to arm, Austria was negotiating with several countries to prevent outside support for Serbia. On March 2, 1909, the powers intervened and attempted to convince Serbia to recognized Austrian claims to avoid a war. Nevertheless, a Serbian note to Austria on March 10 failed to recognize the annexation and provoked Austrian ill-will. Serbia lost possible allies, and, when Russia finally responded to German pressure to abandon Serbia on March 22, Serbia realized the futility of its position. On March 31 Serbia recognized Austria's annexation of Bosnia and Herzegovina and the conflict was resolved. P.S. How old was Princip when Bosnia was annexed?
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Post by sweetnugs on Jun 16, 2008 21:37:16 GMT -5
Nicely put Demonel.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 17, 2008 10:18:16 GMT -5
You should work on your history. The term was coined by a Serb. Who? Both Austro-Hungarian Empire and Ottoman Empire agreed on this as a means of pacification of Bosnia. The Annexation of Bosnia-Herzegovina, 1908.It seems that the Austrian and Turkish authorities were less cooperative then you would have us believe. P.S. How old was Princip when Bosnia was annexed? 13 or 14.
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Demonel
Amicus
I am Jack's regained insanity.
Posts: 833
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Post by Demonel on Jun 17, 2008 10:53:09 GMT -5
The term appears in a derogatory manner in a pamphlet authored by a Serbian socialist Svetozar Markoviæ in 1872. The title «Velika Srbija»/Greater Serbia was meant to express the author's dismay at the prospect of expansion of the Serbian state without social and cultural reforms as well as possible ethnic confrontation with neighboring nations, from Croats to Bulgarians. However, the situation has changed in time, as can be seen in writings of Serbian intellectual from Bosnia and Herzegovina Jefto Dedijer at the end of the 19th century. He envisaged Serbia and Montenegro, the two neighboring Slavic states with ethnic kin in Austro-Hungarian territories, as a nucleus for creating a great Serbian state (more spacious than Yugoslavia), that would, in his opinion, unite all Serbs as well as areas with similar Slavic or religious background. It can be seen as having originated in the 19th century with the Serbian minister Ilija Garašanin in his work Naèertanije (1844) and aimed at uniting the Serbian people which at the time was separated among foreign Austria-Hungary and Ottoman empires. The work describes the lands on the Balkans, then inhabited mostly or partially by Serbs but ruled by the empires, and included Macedonia, Kosovo, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Vojvodina, as well as parts of Romania, Bulgaria and Hungary. Garašanin's plan proposes methods of spreading Serbian influence in these countries, mainly by propaganda efforts and by network of pro-Serbian agitators- in order to achieve optimal situation for Serbian national interests when the Ottoman empire finally collapses.
P.S. You should also work on your English while you are at it. If you read my post several times you will see that i wasn't talking about anexation of BiH from 1908 in the first part of my post but about the occupation of Bosnia in 1878.
If Princip was 13/14 at the time of anexation it means that he wasn't even born when Bosnia was occupied by the dual monarchy.
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