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Post by theblackswans on Dec 12, 2007 23:47:20 GMT -5
Sure we all want peace, that goes without saying; but we know what result will be next time; just like last time. Know who you can trust. When I was in BiH last year I visited one of the largest military organizations from the war in Bosnia in the 1990's. The headquaters were quite active for an organization that has been disbanded for 10 years. There was a lot of plans, a lot of cash and a lot of people around there. Bosnia has more supporters around the globe today than the 1990's don't underestimate that!
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Post by Marshall_Stanko on Dec 13, 2007 1:15:39 GMT -5
Which is why Wars are always happening. International laws are there to protect individual people and countries from agressors.
Lost Kosovo ?? How ?? When ??
I just checked the world map and i can't find the country Kosovo nowhere on the map, all i can see is a map of Serbia and Kosovo being part of Serbia.
And tell me what is wrong wth waving your own countries flag in your own country and by sticking the three fingers up??
Do you even know what the three fingers symbol means ?? Let me tell you what it means, it means the Father, the Son and the Holly spirit. Now tell me what is wrong with that??
And if Kosovo is lost, then why does the Resolution 1244 which was signed by both Serbia, Albania, UNMIK and America and why does it guarentee's Serbias sovereignty and territorial integrity over Kosovo ??
Right. Which is why noone did anything and it took them almost 5 years to do something about the war in Bosnia and after the war ended, the international community gave the Serbs half of BIH which is now known as today Republika Srpska.
Nobody gives a shit about Bosnia or the Balkans. They will only do something when it's in the best interest of them and if it benefits the west, apart from that nobody cares about Bosnia.
Which is why the Dayton Peace Accord and the Resolution 1244 has been signed to guarentee it's existence and to guarentee Serbia's sovereignty over Kosovo ?
LOL and what is this so called largest militiary organization called?? Apart from NATO.
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Post by Marshall_Stanko on Dec 13, 2007 1:19:03 GMT -5
The question cannot be anymore clearer. I am still waiting for you to answer my question.
Just face it, your statement is abit too contradictory and you contradicted yourself on this topic by trying to set double standards. If Kosovo leaves, RS leaves aswell.
I want you to answer my question now TV.
So whats your point?
Does a state and a federal state shar the same citizenships or do they have seperate citizenship ??
For example, Australia as a whole, does NSW also hold a seperate citizenship and do the people of NSW and Victoria have a dual-citizenship with Australia?
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 13, 2007 3:32:34 GMT -5
^^^Oh ok so RS is merley at state of which country ? ? ?
I still don't know what your question is unless you clearly ask it to me (please do ask me, I am more than willing to answer it), and do not know what I have contradicted on. Again what had Kosovo got to do with any of my comments on RS, or perhaps you like complicating matters or quite simply you are being a smart ass?
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Dec 13, 2007 12:40:08 GMT -5
Illyria: He wants to know, why should Kosovo leave Serbia, if RS cannot leave Bosnia.
Stanko: Why do you complicate things man?
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 13, 2007 19:02:07 GMT -5
I won't answer that question as it's pretty obvious and again I did not mention Kosovo; so I don't know why he's comparing the two. But perhaps it's better to keep RS intact, you know 2 countries in one ROFL. What a joke.
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Post by Marshall_Stanko on Dec 13, 2007 23:18:28 GMT -5
Illyria: He wants to know, why should Kosovo leave Serbia, if RS cannot leave Bosnia. Stanko: Why do you complicate things man? Because her statement is contradictory. She advocates for the abolishment of RS and why on earth does RS holds presidential elections yet when being asked does the same question applies to Kosovo she fails to address it. If she wants RS abolished then thats fine but the same must apply for Kosovo and other regions around the world where as she is advocating for one but allowing for the other to seperate, in other words setting out double standards. You even stated that you are more then happy to answer the question but since you wont, can you just answer me this, does the same rule applies for Kosovo aswell as for RS
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Post by avenger on Dec 13, 2007 23:38:07 GMT -5
The U.S. made one of its biggest mistakes by getting involved with Bosnia. This actually applies to the former Yugoslavia as a whole.
Here you have an amalgam of bickering nationalities and you tell them they should live together. It is my opinion that in the case of Bosnia if all the people do not truly feel Bosnian then the state is lost from its inception. Bosnia can only exist as a coherent and independent country (which it is not) only if people have a united Bosnian conscious.
It is a unique country indeed. A country of three presidents and three legislative bodies based on ethnicity, no wonder it takes foreign intervention to keep the country together. Much like Iraq, we cannot expect that country to function as a united nation when local nationalities fight eachother. Again it took an authoritarian figure to keep Iraq in line and we did not merely depose Saddam but sadly, we just took his place and arn't even really doing a good job at it. Whats even worse , our flawed foreign policy contributed to the decayed state of these nations. Just goes to prove that non interventionalism is the best policy.
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Dec 13, 2007 23:43:43 GMT -5
Dude, cities hold elections for Mayor. RS is a part of Bosnia, administered by Serbs for Serbs, Croats, and Bosniaks, who are all constitutional natives of Bosna i Hercegovina. It is an entity. Obviously it needs a leader to represent it's citizens, like any other Province/Entity/State.
Why couldn't you just ask her plain and simple, instead of running loops?
Dude, the international community is based on double standards. The UN was created as a movement to contain the spread of communism. Shit, if it wasn't for the US funding France in the late 40's and early 50's, it would have became communist. It is all for the benefit of the West, to keep them united and rich, and the rest of the world poor and divided, easy to manipulate along their lines of division. Plus, RS and Kosovo aren't the same dude. NO situation is EVER the same. Understand? You cannot compare RS, Kosovo, Chechnya, Dagestan, Abkhazia, Nagorno-Karabakh, East Timor, Tetovo, Transnistria, Kurdistan (N.Iraq), N. Ireland, Basque, Western Sahara (SADR), T.R.N. Cyprus, etc. etc. I'm sure you get the point.
You cannot compare any entity/self-state/seperatist state/group as the same. It's never the same. Ever.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 14, 2007 0:55:40 GMT -5
I'll say it again, I don't discuss Kosovo in the Bosnia forum.
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Post by theblackswans on Dec 18, 2007 0:32:46 GMT -5
The U.S. made one of its biggest mistakes by getting involved with Bosnia. This actually applies to the former Yugoslavia as a whole. Here you have an amalgam of bickering nationalities and you tell them they should live together. It is my opinion that in the case of Bosnia if all the people do not truly feel Bosnian then the state is lost from its inception. Bosnia can only exist as a coherent and independent country (which it is not) only if people have a united Bosnian conscious. It is a unique country indeed. A country of three presidents and three legislative bodies based on ethnicity, no wonder it takes foreign intervention to keep the country together. Much like Iraq, we cannot expect that country to function as a united nation when local nationalities fight eachother. Again it took an authoritarian figure to keep Iraq in line and we did not merely depose Saddam but sadly, we just took his place and arn't even really doing a good job at it. Whats even worse , our flawed foreign policy contributed to the decayed state of these nations. Just goes to prove that non interventionalism is the best policy. uhh have you heard of America, the begining of our nation not everyone waved the flag and associated themselves as Americans. Also 80 years after it's inception we had a brutal civil war. The French, British Spanish and so many others didn't all see the country in the same light. Bosnia was not destined to fall apart in a brutal ascention to hell. It was created by agression by Croatia and Serbia as well as poor decisions by the international community and the Bosnian government. Yugoslavia could have broken apart with out the bloodshed. To think otherwise is to make an excuse for the criminals who created the situation intentionally.
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Anthologic
Amicus
"Lord of all Reality"
Ha!
Posts: 1,237
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Post by Anthologic on Dec 18, 2007 23:45:10 GMT -5
Oh don't be so naive MiG, plenty here want to do just that; we saw what happened before when everything was friendly...turns out they had their own agendas. Yes, very accurate representation of the past 50 years. Bosnians, Croats, Slovenes, Serbs, etc. ALL wanted to consolidate their power the whole time. We both know that wasn't quite the case. Besides, wouldn't it be good for all three economies of bosnia was just integrated into Serbia and Croatia? My knowledge of politics and economy isn't as vast as physics, BUT I do recall the same thing helped East Germans at one point in history.
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Anthologic
Amicus
"Lord of all Reality"
Ha!
Posts: 1,237
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Post by Anthologic on Dec 18, 2007 23:48:48 GMT -5
You are not aware that the U.S. caused the economic collapse of Yugoslavia to incite the collapse of communism, with or without a war?
Some credit should go to the inept politicians and the entire bureau filled with nepotism in Yugoslavia... but it was America that was the spark.
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