|
Post by kasso on Oct 25, 2008 12:58:03 GMT -5
Because of religious similarity a unique affinity exist between Albanians and Bosniaks, which paves the way for an Bosniak-Albanian state. Bosniaks and Albanians should begin an assimilation process through intermarriages etc. and eliminate barriers which constitutes obstacles in creating a homogeneous state.
Demographics
Foreign and hostile elements should be eliminated through moral and legal ways by producing plans which will not breach international law with the goal of creating an ethnic pure state and territory.
We should create a few huge cities near neighbouring countries and populate them with citizens of Serbian and Croatian origin. All the Croatian and Serbian population of BiH should be moved to these cities and should be given to Croatia and Serbia. This way we would solve the demographical problems and we would save a lot of territory.
Education and health
The state should promote health care and education and everything should be free for the citizens.
Albanian language should be adopted as “school language”, while Bosnian language could also be taught in schools.
Corruption
Everyone who commits a crime against corruption laws should be sentenced to lifetime imprisonment.
Media
Freedom of the press should prevail.
Tourism
The state has the responsibility to promote tourism and creating conditions which will increase the numbers of tourists.
Economy
Bosniak-Albanian state should conquer the internet world which would create astronomical incomes to the state.
Military
A huge investment in military is a primary goal and 1/10 of the population should be recruited. We should wage war against states which violates human rights. We could become a superpower.
Infrastructure and electricity
A huge investment in infrastructure is important and as well as in the electricity sector with the goal of becoming self-sufficient.
Waste management is also important so not the tourist numbers decrease.
|
|
|
Post by kapetan on Oct 25, 2008 13:05:27 GMT -5
Neither would want this, not because of hate but because it's ridiculous to deliberatly try to just mash together two peoples. Plus both would complain about losing their culture or ethnicity. If it happend naturaly through history it happend, but that's not the case. Well except for in places like Sandzak.
Religious affinity is a very weak case anyway.
However Albania and Bosnia should be the best of friends in the Balkan, and they already do have very good relations. There is 0 reason for us to be at odds.
BTW in WW2 joining Albania and Bosnia into a "muslim state" was proposed but Croatia got pissed cuz they wanted Bosnia in NDH. Handzar did have a goal of "liberatiing" Albania.
Sauberzweig also ordered that as the Handzar units crossed the Sava River, each commander was to read a prepared message, which emphasized that the "liberation" of "Muslim Albania" was a goal, and appealing directly to the Albanian troops in the Handschar Division.
|
|
|
Post by tito on Oct 25, 2008 13:56:08 GMT -5
Bosniaks and Albanians will be united in EU and Nato, as for Kasso's Greater Bosniak-Albanian State we have Montenegro BTW in WW2 joining Albania and Bosnia into a "muslim state" was proposed but Croatia got pissed cuz they wanted Bosnia in NDH. Handzar did have a goal of "liberatiing" Albania. Sauberzweig also ordered that as the Handzar units crossed the Sava River, each commander was to read a prepared message, which emphasized that the "liberation" of "Muslim Albania" was a goal, and appealing directly to the Albanian troops in the Handschar Division. Where can I get more details about this?
|
|
|
Post by kapetan on Oct 25, 2008 14:52:32 GMT -5
Bosniaks and Albanians will be united in EU and Nato, as for Kasso's Greater Bosniak-Albanian State we have Montenegro BTW in WW2 joining Albania and Bosnia into a "muslim state" was proposed but Croatia got pissed cuz they wanted Bosnia in NDH. Handzar did have a goal of "liberatiing" Albania. Sauberzweig also ordered that as the Handzar units crossed the Sava River, each commander was to read a prepared message, which emphasized that the "liberation" of "Muslim Albania" was a goal, and appealing directly to the Albanian troops in the Handschar Division. Where can I get more details about this? Books. Like "Himmler's Bosnian Division" and such. that part is talking about their activities in Operation Sava..so maybe if you find more info about the operation too
|
|
|
Post by ErmirI on Oct 25, 2008 14:54:40 GMT -5
Looks like Kasso has become another victim of Lazarat weed.
And what Kapetan said is coplete BS. All three fighting forces in WW2 Albania had nothing to do with religion. Albanians have never ever fought around religion.
|
|
|
Post by kapetan on Oct 25, 2008 14:59:42 GMT -5
Looks like Kasso has become another victim of Lazarat weed. And what Kapetan said is coplete BS. All three fighting forces in WW2 Albania had nothing to do with religion. Albanians have never ever fought around religion. You can't read. I'm the first one to say Albanians never fought for religion. I said OTHERS had the idea of uniting them, and just a few Albanian religious figures which obviosly, would be religious men since that's their job. So to them a unified muslim state would be cool. I didn't say Albanians or Bosnians wanted to themsevles.
|
|
|
Post by SKORIC on Oct 25, 2008 15:34:35 GMT -5
You can't read. I'm the first one to say Albanians never fought for religion. I said OTHERS had the idea of uniting them, and just a few Albanian religious figures which obviosly, would be religious men since that's their job. So to them a unified muslim state would be cool. I didn't say Albanians or Bosnians wanted to themsevles. Man Albanians never fought for religion. geeze get it through your head
|
|
|
Post by ErmirI on Oct 25, 2008 16:44:23 GMT -5
Looks like Kasso has become another victim of Lazarat weed. And what Kapetan said is coplete BS. All three fighting forces in WW2 Albania had nothing to do with religion. Albanians have never ever fought around religion. You can't read. I'm the first one to say Albanians never fought for religion. I said OTHERS had the idea of uniting them, and just a few Albanian religious figures which obviosly, would be religious men since that's their job. So to them a unified muslim state would be cool. I didn't say Albanians or Bosnians wanted to themsevles. Gee, calm down dood, i never call anyone a BS-er or anything on the net. My grandfather was a partisan and later Sigurimi member. I know my country's history better than some BS. TM. book you might have read. Chose better next time. The german nazis were (initially) greeted in Albania because they kicked the Italians out and promoted nationalism everywhere, Kosovo and Cameria included. I repeat nationalism, which is above any kind of religion. So no muslim projects were ever heard in Albania, let alone Bosnian liberators/brothers. The "few Albanian religious figures" you mention are fictious as long as you consider them muslim, because at that time Albania had no muslim figures at all, only Catholic ones who were also the most fervent nationalists, that's why they were the most persecuted by Hoxha. Don't mistake people like Hoxha on their names. The "Scanderbeg SS division" unlike the Bosnian one was not muslim or nazi at all. It was comprised of poor peasants willing to kill every serb out there on a vendetta rampage. Albanians have been changing religion whenever it suited us as it matters next to zero to our identity unlike the yugos. Bosnia or bosnians are never mentioned in any Albanian history book let alone a union with you being cool to someone. You contradict yourself twice. And this project not happening because NDH would be upset is very amusing. Handzar and other slav forces were very busy killing each other far-away from Albania. Figure having a chance on "liberating" it. 9/10 albanians from Albania don't even know where Bosnia is located on a map let alone become best friends. Same with other Ex-Yugo reps. Last summer more than 20000 serbs visited Albania and no incidents ever happened although there were at least 10 times more K.Albos around. Friendship and peace are based on civillized behaviour between worst (ex-)enemies, not some mullah's or cetnik priest's wet dreams, otherwise the Balkans will continue to be the Balkans.
|
|
|
Post by meltdown711 on Oct 25, 2008 16:55:53 GMT -5
They were still being greeted in 1944... except by a bunch of mountain bandits living in the mountains of southern Albania...
*Cough* Haxhi Qemali *Cough*
|
|
|
Post by bosanskinovi on Oct 25, 2008 17:25:29 GMT -5
You're not seriously saying that the Albanian SS Division wasnt nazi while the Bosnian were? Seriously stfu
|
|
|
Post by ErmirI on Oct 25, 2008 17:39:42 GMT -5
They were still being greeted in 1944... except by a bunch of mountain bandits living in the mountains of southern Albania... *Cough* Haxhi Qemali *Cough* Who might this bunch of bandits be tosku? Because the majority were anti-nazi (few were real communists) at that time. How it came to be is another story. And as far as Haxhi Qamili is concerned, I remind you that we're talking about WW2, not 1914.
|
|
|
Post by ErmirI on Oct 25, 2008 17:50:58 GMT -5
You're not seriously saying that the Albanian SS Division wasnt nazi while the Bosnian were? Seriously stfu Kind sir, thank you. "Or" is not the same as "nor". I don't know if Handjar was nazi, I think not. As far as I know muslim slavs were mainly victims during the war. On the other side, "Scanderbeg" was not and as I wrote the only thing driving them was the desire for revenge they felt towards the serbs. Religion was not involved, Nazi ideology couldn't be given that you can't instill that on illiterate villagers in such a short time. They would have joined anyone as long as it meant help into crushing serb skulls. Thus it is fairer to say that the Nazis collaborated with the K.Albos.
|
|
|
Post by bosanskinovi on Oct 25, 2008 18:02:01 GMT -5
The Bosnian Handzar soldiers werent exactly rocket scientists either; iliteracy was extremely high among them. They saw joining the division as a chance to protect themselves and their families against cetniks, who were massacring Bosniak civilians throughout WWII. And I fully and completely understand them.
|
|
|
Post by kapetan on Oct 25, 2008 19:18:05 GMT -5
You can't read. I'm the first one to say Albanians never fought for religion. I said OTHERS had the idea of uniting them, and just a few Albanian religious figures which obviosly, would be religious men since that's their job. So to them a unified muslim state would be cool. I didn't say Albanians or Bosnians wanted to themsevles. Gee, calm down dood, i never call anyone a BS-er or anything on the net. My grandfather was a partisan and later Sigurimi member. I know my country's history better than some BS. TM. book you might have read. Chose better next time. The german nazis were (initially) greeted in Albania because they kicked the Italians out and promoted nationalism everywhere, Kosovo and Cameria included. I repeat nationalism, which is above any kind of religion. So no muslim projects were ever heard in Albania, let alone Bosnian liberators/brothers. The "few Albanian religious figures" you mention are fictious as long as you consider them muslim, because at that time Albania had no muslim figures at all, only Catholic ones who were also the most fervent nationalists, that's why they were the most persecuted by Hoxha. Don't mistake people like Hoxha on their names. The "Scanderbeg SS division" unlike the Bosnian one was not muslim or nazi at all. It was comprised of poor peasants willing to kill every serb out there on a vendetta rampage. Albanians have been changing religion whenever it suited us as it matters next to zero to our identity unlike the yugos. Bosnia or bosnians are never mentioned in any Albanian history book let alone a union with you being cool to someone. You contradict yourself twice. And this project not happening because NDH would be upset is very amusing. Handzar and other slav forces were very busy killing each other far-away from Albania. Figure having a chance on "liberating" it. 9/10 albanians from Albania don't even know where Bosnia is located on a map let alone become best friends. Same with other Ex-Yugo reps. Last summer more than 20000 serbs visited Albania and no incidents ever happened although there were at least 10 times more K.Albos around. Friendship and peace are based on civillized behaviour between worst (ex-)enemies, not some mullah's or cetnik priest's wet dreams, otherwise the Balkans will continue to be the Balkans. Dude you're arguing pointlessly. Listen carefully. Certain people PROPOSED THE IDEA. That's all. There's no reason to get into history to prove anything, since I'm not dissagreeing. I'm just saying it's a fact some people had the idea and it was scrapped. You're not seriously saying that the Albanian SS Division wasnt nazi while the Bosnian were? Seriously stfu Kind sir, thank you. "Or" is not the same as "nor". I don't know if Handjar was nazi, I think not. As far as I know muslim slavs were mainly victims during the war. On the other side, "Scanderbeg" was not and as I wrote the only thing driving them was the desire for revenge they felt towards the serbs. Religion was not involved, Nazi ideology couldn't be given that you can't instill that on illiterate villagers in such a short time. They would have joined anyone as long as it meant help into crushing serb skulls. Thus it is fairer to say that the Nazis collaborated with the K.Albos. Lol Don't speak unless you did your research about us either. Handzar didn't give a s**t about Nazi ideas. According to Nazi ideas they were inferior anyway. They joined them cuz they had to join something since they were being killed left and right. Necessity. Someone offers you revenge like you said. Bosniaks joined Partizans and Handzar. Some even joined CHETNIKS for very short amounts of time just to stay alive then run off. I've done my research, I have no reason to lie to you. During training they even had a mutiny. The only SS division that had one in history of WW2. There's a street named after it in France. Unfortunetly they named it "croatian" something since those soldiers at the time were officaly part of NDH. The only people who you can say took the ideology serious was the Croat leadership since Handzar was just 20,000 people and it included Croats and Albanians as well to fill it out since there wasn't enough Bosniaks. Then Skanderbeg was made. And it was a fiasco and emberassment. A failure. Handzar didn't last long either, although they had alot of success against partizans. I don't belive that because you'd have to be an idiot not to know that Bosnia is your fellow Balkan country and seperated only by tiny montenegro. So unless youre saying 90% of Albanians are uneducated idiots..............I'll go ahed and ignore that claim.
|
|
|
Post by meltdown711 on Oct 25, 2008 20:01:33 GMT -5
Partisans.
And as for being disliked by the general population:
The population still had good memories of the very tactful methods used during the Austro-Hungarian occupation in the First World War and this led to the German invasion being well-accepted everywhere. Seeing well-disciplined elite troops behaving in a friendly manner to the civilian population had an engaging effect on this proud mountain people who were themselves wont to bear arms.
- Nazi Diplomat Hermann Neubacher, arrived in Albania at the end of 1943. Thats what he wrote in his memoirs published in 1952
|
|
|
Post by givemebeer on Oct 25, 2008 20:25:40 GMT -5
Would not that be ethnic cleansing? Anyways if you want to assimilate someone into Albanians, your best bet would be south serbia, they have so much old-balkan blood, and you guys have so much slavic blood, that you look more alike, then a Serb from those parts and a Serb from Bosnia... And you should have forced intermarriges Serbo-Albanian, that way you can both have kosovo....
But I like your plan on how to make money, we will give all the people in this great state PC's, and they will click on those adds, where you get like one cent from a 100 clicks, and this would make up most of our BNP
|
|
|
Post by Arthur Kane on Oct 25, 2008 22:53:01 GMT -5
Out of sheer boredom I'll entertain this post. Its ridiculous but also a bit funny and shows a poor imagination but still an imagination. In other words it would be a Theocratic state based on Islamic ritual. Unfortunately, Islamic ritual wouldn't be readily accepted by most people in Albania or Bosnia. Around half of Bosnia's population isn't Muslim and over 1/3 of Albania's population isn't Muslim. On top of this, the so-called Muslims and Christians of these countries are largely secular and some outright atheistic. I say FAIL. How do you forcefully 'eliminate' non desirables and do so morally? The only 'moral option' would be that those who desire to leave may do so voluntarily. Any initiation of force excludes morality. Any attempt to 'ethnically purify' a state always results in immoral methods of doing so and immoral consequences. I say FAIL! How do you 'create' cities in those neighboring regions? How do you do so morally? How do you expel people against their will and claim it as moral? I say FAIL! There is no free lunch. Such 'free' services come with a price tag. Only question is who foots the bill and would they be able to do so voluntarily? If you encourage state enforcement of this then voluntary means is thrown out of the equation. Its merely advocating force. I say FAIL! Then you don't want a state since all the people who run the state do so out of corruption ( theft , murder , rape). You cannot exempt the state from the same moral rules as it's population unless you are a bigot. I say FAIL. Does this include all forms of media or those that are state approved? So in this hypothetical state Serbian broadcast media should be A-OK. I say FAIL! What about private industries? Anytime a state 'promotes' something it comes at an unseen cost and is done so with force. I say FAIL! Economy FAIL! ;D Military A warfare/welfare state based on morality? FAIL! Electricity only accounts for less than 20% of the total energy of most modern countries. This investment , if not voluntary and private, comes through violence initiated by the state. FAIL! Sounds like you want a theocratic warfare orientated internally violent state. My recommendation. Quit wasting forum space and grow up
|
|