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Post by Kassandros on Feb 27, 2009 18:51:38 GMT -5
benzino... read first about Dorians... and then you can make a comment. Read about them.. learn about them... and then talk. This forum is full of bla bla bla. We dont need one more to bla bla bla. READ and then SPEAK.
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rex362
Senior Moderator
Pellazg
PELASGIANILLYROALBANIAN
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Post by rex362 on Feb 27, 2009 18:55:38 GMT -5
bla bla bo blah
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Post by Kassandros on Feb 27, 2009 19:26:12 GMT -5
benzino as you understand.. you give the bad example to guys like Rex...
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Post by Teuta1975 on Apr 12, 2009 1:24:01 GMT -5
benzino as you understand.. you give the bad example to guys like Rex... lol...does Rex need a bad example?
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Post by kartadolofonos on Apr 15, 2009 20:41:05 GMT -5
Thank you Saint Kosmas Aitolos who said learn to your children to speak greek and stop to speak the varvaric language !
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bato2
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Art Changed The World
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Post by bato2 on May 22, 2009 7:36:59 GMT -5
Arvanitika Modern Albanian Arvanitic culture and history
Arvanites - Arvanitic culture and history The Arvanites, like the Vlachs in Greece, have gradually developed a Greek national consciousness and identify themselves as Greeks. Some have argued that Arvanites are descended from early inhabitants of Greece (Pelasgians). They are linguistically related to Albanians. Arvanites - Origin and history of the name We first learn of the ancestors of the modern Albanians, as the Arbanites of Arbanon, in Anna Comnena's account (Alexiad, IV). The account discusses about the troubles in the region of Arbanon caused by the Normans during the reign of her father, Emperor Alexius I Comnenus (1081-1118). In the History, written in 1079/1080 A.D., Byzantine historian Michael Attaliates was the first to refer to the Albanoi as having taken part in a revolt against Constantinople in 1043 A.D. and to the Arbanitai as subjects of the Duke of Dyrrachium. The terms Arvanitika and Arvanitic derive from the word Arvanitai (Αρβανίται); the etymology according to Yannis Koulakis' dictionary (ISBN 960-239-135-9) of the Greek adjective Arvanitika is from the root Arvanit- of the term Arvanitis. According to one theory, the word "Arvanitis" is cognate with the word "Albanian"; the Greek consonant β has changed in pronunciation from to [v]. For the "l/r" conversion (rhotacism). See also the history of the toponym Albania.
According to Kollias, some Arvanites of the northwestern Greek region of Epirus traditionally also use the word Shqiptár (Σ̈κ̇ιπτάρ) to identify themselves, without claiming an Albanian national consciousness. The word Shqiptár is used as well in a few villages of Thrace, where Arvanites migrated from the mountains of Pindos during the 19th century. On the other hand, this word is totally unknown among the main body of the Arvanites in southern Greece.
Arvanites - Trivia
* Arvanitissa is the feminine of Arvanitis in Greek. o A church in Chios is dedicated to "Panagia Arvanitissa". * Arvanites refer to their place of origin as Arvanitia (today southern Albania and NW Greece). Sometimes they apply this term to the whole of Albania and/or Epirus. o Arvanitia is also an alternate name for Akronafplia, Nafplion's Acropolis. * Arvanites of Epirus named the north wind Arvanitis. * Ouzo Plomari, Isidoros Arvanitis, 1894 (Ούζο Πλωμαρίου, Ισιδώρου Αρβανίτου, 1894) (note: Plomari is a town of Lesvos).
Arvanites - Phara
Phara (φάρα) is a descent model, similar to Scottish clans. Arvanites were organised in phares (φάρες) mostly during the reign of the Ottoman Empire. The apex was a warlord and the phara was named after him (i.e. Botsaris' phara). In an Arvanitic village each phara was responsible to keep genealogical records (see also registry offices), that are preserved until today as historical documents in local libraries. Usually there were more than one phares in an Arvanitic village and sometimes they were organised in phratries that had conflict of interests. Those phratries didn't last long, because each leader of a phara desired to be the leader of the phratry and would not be lead by another.
Arvanites - Arvanitic songs
Although they are almost fully assimilated into Greek society, some distinct Arvanitic cultural characteristics are still identifiable.
There are 4 music CDs featuring Arvanitic songs although the lyrics are often in Greek. There are no mass media in Arvanitic, although some local radio stations have occasionally broadcast Arvanitic songs. During the last decades there have been made some attempts to document Arvanitic songs, the most recent by Thanasis Moraitis (Thanas Moraiti).
Arvanitic songs share similarities with Arbëresh, Albanian and Greek Epirote music.
Arvanites - Ancient Greek inscriptions
Two archaeological discoveries, and in particular a Corinthian chrism from the 7th century BC and a clay wine-pitcher dating back to 725 BC, have been interpreted by the author Nikos Stylos[2] as Arvanitic inscriptions.
LINK www.experiencefestival.com/a/Arvanites_-_Arvanitic_culture_and_history/id/4809685
Language LINK upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/36/Arvanitic.png
Arvanites (Joshua Poject) Ethnic Tree Affinity Bloc: Eurasian Peoples People Cluster: Albanian People Name General: Arvanites Ethnic Code: CEW13
www.joshuaproject.net/peopctry.php?rog3=GR&rop3=100537
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Post by Arxileas on May 22, 2009 20:02:50 GMT -5
^ Meh ! nothing new...Now donnie, can you comprehend the fact that they wanted nothing to do with you for many centuries now ? It isn't right to claim a group of people who don't identify them self's as anything else BUT Greeks...
Do you need help about understanding this ?
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Post by Duke John on May 26, 2009 17:29:50 GMT -5
why do arvanites speak same language as me?
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Kanaris
Amicus
This just in>>>> Nobody gives a crap!
Posts: 9,587
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Post by Kanaris on May 26, 2009 19:11:56 GMT -5
^Because as Greeks born in your area of the woods learned your language.... just like my kid born in Canada learned to speak English.... but he is still a Greek.... capiche?
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Post by leshte on May 26, 2009 19:31:08 GMT -5
^^^ So the Arberesh of Italy are Italians that learned Albanian? The Greeks by the Arberesh villages in Italy, are Italians that learned Greek?
Today most Arvanites have a Greek consciences and that is fine and good. Their origin is Albanian sipmle as that. They're the branch that decided to go south instead of the direction of the boot.
P.S Since with your theory you imply they're Greeks that learned Albanian cuz they were surrounded by Albanian than wouldn't that make Epirus Albanian? Just following your way of reasoning here.
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Post by Teuta1975 on May 26, 2009 21:52:54 GMT -5
^Because as Greeks born in your area of the woods learned your language.... just like my kid born in Canada learned to speak English.... but he is still a Greek.... capiche? I think Leshte is right...like your kid, Arvanites' kids learned to speak Greek...but they are still Arvanites...
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on May 27, 2009 4:51:28 GMT -5
Why do we epirots have surnames that we cant translate? Because they were given to us by our rulers (Turkalbanians = Muslim Albos who ruled epiros on behalf of the ottoman empire).
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donnie
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Nike Leka i Kelmendit
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Post by donnie on May 27, 2009 5:11:00 GMT -5
Why do we epirots have surnames that we cant translate? Because they were given to us by our rulers (Turkalbanians = Muslim Albos who ruled epiros on behalf of the ottoman empire). Can you give examples?
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on May 27, 2009 5:32:42 GMT -5
Tsiotras, Thatsis, Gitas, Ritas,etc... 95% of them have only two syllabes. Also the majority ends in "-as" or "-is" and not so many in "-os". However in Zagori region, -opoulos and -idis are very common. (talking about natives exclusively, Minor Asians/Pontians are another story). If i was president of Greece or smth, i would clearly write down all historic data about Greek toponyms and surnames, and then hellenize the sh1t out of them.
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Post by chalkedon on May 27, 2009 7:27:53 GMT -5
If i was president of Greece or smth, i would clearly write down all historic data about Greek toponyms and surnames, and then hellenize the sh1t out of them. I couldnt agree w/ you more on this one. I also dont know why we voted down katharevousa back then. I think this dimotikio language is holding back our intelligence. I believe the more we talk like our ancestors...the more we become like them. this turkish,vlach,latin influence in dimotiko is making our ppl tempelides...add greeklish and the outcome is greek kids today.
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Post by chalkedon on May 27, 2009 7:29:10 GMT -5
also...what is up with kaimatsalan ?!?! That definitly is not greek and should be changed asap.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on May 27, 2009 8:17:03 GMT -5
If i was president of Greece or smth, i would clearly write down all historic data about Greek toponyms and surnames, and then hellenize the sh1t out of them. I couldnt agree w/ you more on this one. I also dont know why we voted down katharevousa back then. I think this dimotikio language is holding back our intelligence. I believe the more we talk like our ancestors...the more we become like them. this turkish,vlach,latin influence in dimotiko is making our ppl tempelides...add greeklish and the outcome is greek kids today. +10000 As i said before about you, we need 9,000,000 chalkedons in this country. I am proud you exist my man!! Our ideas are like 99.99% overlapping!
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donnie
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Post by donnie on May 27, 2009 9:16:33 GMT -5
Tsiotras, Thatsis, Gitas, Ritas,etc... 95% of them have only two syllabes. Also the majority ends in "-as" or "-is" and not so many in "-os". However in Zagori region, -opoulos and -idis are very common. (talking about natives exclusively, Minor Asians/Pontians are another story). If i was president of Greece or smth, i would clearly write down all historic data about Greek toponyms and surnames, and then hellenize the sh1t out of them. You're out late, since this reform was already initiated 1935. Villages with Albanian & Slav names were changed to Greek, such as Kuqi into Erithro etc. Perhaps Epirus as a region, with more archaic forms of non-Hellenic toponymy, was left alone. I do not know. Or maybe these are their actual names, added with a "s" to make them appear more Greek. Remember that a considerable part of Epirus was Albanian-inhabited historically, and sure enough some of them were Hellenized ... but their surnames survived. The same is seen with Arvanites, such as the surname Kriezis from Kryeziu ("black head"). In 1583, there was the great registration of the district of Ioannina. The Muslim element in Epirus was quite insiginificiant back then, and the process of "turning" local names, if it ever occured, had yet to be properly initiated. Here follow the names of the heads of families of the villages Murich and Flambur; Mekshe Marte, Teodor Mekshe, Lek Nika, Lek Meksha, Jani Capari, Gjon Capari, Jani Kallgare, Istathi Jani, Gjon Ishtamadhi, Jorgji Gjoni, Niko Jorgji, Ishtamadh Kati, Dimo Deda, Jani Dime, Marko Jani, Nik Teodori, Miha Biri, Jani Luzi, Nik Miha, Ded Capuga, Jorgji Nika, Nik Ishtamadhi, Gjin Akshemo, Lek Akshemo, Martin Dime, Jorgji Akshemo, Jorgji Sopesi, Miho Marko, Anastas Dime. By the sound of these names, they seem in most cases indistinguishable from the more northern (Albanian Orthodox) population. PS In regards to toponymy, I agree with you. I am of the opinioon that Albania too should change its Slav toponymy to Albanian forms. But surnames are a different matter and is the decision of each family/individual to decide, not you or your politicians.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on May 27, 2009 9:37:47 GMT -5
"Or maybe these are their actual names, added with a "s" to make them appear more Greek. Remember that a considerable part of Epirus was Albanian-inhabited historically, and sure enough some of them were Hellenized ... but their surnames survived."
Thats BS. When someone decides to forcefully hellenise a group of non-greek ppl, 1st thing to do would be change their names. Besides that, we have arvanites with names like "Pankalos" (fully greek), and we have true greeks(e.g. sarakatsans) with names like "Tsotras-Siouras-Sioufas-Tsiatouras,etc..."...
The forceful helenization theory is stupid. Vlahs were always allowed to speak vlah, arbos to speak arvanitika.
Accept the fact, that our lands are FULL of ppl who ARE and WANT to be greeks.
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Post by Duke John on May 27, 2009 11:42:40 GMT -5
Tsiotras, Thatsis, Gitas, Ritas,etc... 95% of them have only two syllabes. Also the majority ends in "-as" or "-is" and not so many in "-os". However in Zagori region, -opoulos and -idis are very common. (talking about natives exclusively, Minor Asians/Pontians are another story). If i was president of Greece or smth, i would clearly write down all historic data about Greek toponyms and surnames, and then hellenize the sh1t out of them. oh wow Thaqi!
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