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Post by kasso on Feb 2, 2008 16:39:22 GMT -5
The question is simple but the answer can be perhaps complicated. Do Greeks or the average Greek hate Albanians and why?
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Kanaris
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Post by Kanaris on Feb 2, 2008 17:20:30 GMT -5
I will try to be as sincere as possible.....
My last year trip to Greece made me realize how some view and treat outsiders in Greece.... one of them being the Albanians... on the average of what I witnessed mainly in the village I was living and in general around the island... Albanians are viewed at with contempt... not very easily trusted or liked.... this was mainly from uneducated islanders who for some never having met an Albanian themselves took for granted what others would tell them... so they would quickly be prejudiced against them for no other reason then what an acquaintance or friend told them. The good news is the educated youth doesn't share this perception and that IMO.... will lead to a better understanding between Greeks and Albanians for the future.
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Post by Teuta1975 on Feb 3, 2008 10:16:44 GMT -5
yes...good answer Canaris...and a true one. I would also add that only a small part of Greeks do not see Albanias with contempt. All Greeks have been in contact with Albanians in one way or another. And from my experience in Greece I had the impression Greeks see Albanians with contempt not only for being illegal and commiting crimes, but also for doing jobs that Greeks refuse to do such as cleaning ladies or other. I believe the new generation is different. Also lots of time has passed. I hope when I go to Greece again, nobody will tell me "you're different from other Albanians", which I found very humiliating 10 years ago...
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Post by Kassandros on Feb 3, 2008 11:42:19 GMT -5
I like Albanians of Greece. In the begging they were just as.sholes who came from the villages to the town with that "I am smart" and "I'll get rich soon" attitude. That guide most of them in the prison. The ones who stayed outside of that attitude and the ones who were born in Greece have tottaly different style from the first ones, and they have assimilated in the common way of life. That makes me now like the Albanians of Greece.
I say the Albanians of Greece, because they are one step beyond the Albanians of Albania I believe. Also the Albanians of other countries just heave in mind what Hotja used to tell them about the "bad" Greeks and rumors. These Albanians I believe they are too one step behind the Albanians of Greece. I cant say "I like them".... just... I dont have the mood to wait again for that step...
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Post by leandros nikon on Feb 3, 2008 13:34:52 GMT -5
Such an idiotic thread...no one should answer...especially when the author is a greek hater himself...
Anyway,we do hate albanians after all,many of us here in Greece...
BECAUSE they are too many and they have too many kids...it feels like we have become an albanian colony somehow...the percentage of albanians in the island of Zakynthos exceed 25 or even 30%...
BECAUSE of the numerous crimes they have commited...during the first ten years they had killed hundreds of greeks,many times for no reason at all...it seemed that if an albo felt insulted he had the right to take the life of a poor greek victim without any second thought...luckily greek law enforcement has chanced this situation atleast concerning tha murders...
BECAUSE of the typical albanian arrogance,rudeness,ungratefullness,needless to say more...
BECAUSE of the stolen jobs...albanians were supposed to remain at the countryside and work at the fields,gathering fruits and olives etc...well they dont...they stay in the countryside for a couple of years and then they usually move to the cities...and new alboz from albania will arrive and replace them...for a couple of years only bcz they too will move to the city and steal a greek's job...
BECAUSE of the military cooperation with Turkey,having at least one turkish military base in Albania-frigates and submarines-and God only knows what other secret agreement has been made...
BECAUSE during the otthoman occupation greeks were slaves,gavurs,infidels,second class citizens, while albanians were buddies of the turks and their helping hand and certainly opressors of the enslaved greeks...Also because of the cham treason and albanian support towards the italian fascists in WWII...
BECAUSE of the greek flags that were burned in ATHENS by albanian immigrants.i know about three incidents,who knows how many more...
BECAUSE albanians claim greek land and threat greeks that "after kosovo and macedonia your turn comes!!!"Because of the albanian forums and youtube videoclips,the chameria songs and great albania maps...
anyway,i repeat that if only a hundred of thousands had come to greece everything would be nicer...they should go elsewhere too,we cant have so many...
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Post by areianos on Feb 3, 2008 14:45:46 GMT -5
Albanians are renting two of my properties in Greece with a Russo-Pontian renting the other one. The two young Albanian families always pay their rent on time whereas the Russo-Pontian can take weeks to get one week rent out of him.
Albanians are like un cultured wild thingies but in general are ok.
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Post by chalkedon on Feb 3, 2008 14:58:49 GMT -5
the albanians ( especially the ones growing up here ) are not a problem. They are being assimilated into greek mainstream life ( and they like it ! ) they get paid well and in cash...i was at parnassos today snowboarding, I spotted albos on the resort skiing !! I thought hell froze over ;D try to provoke an alb after 10 to 15 yrs of living in greece what he thinks of it ;D ;D and try to critisize greece after having those opportunities he didnt have in his own home land. they could lose the crime though.......
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Post by leandros nikon on Feb 3, 2008 15:06:25 GMT -5
what about imperialism?will they quitt claiming northwestern greece 10 to 15 years later???
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Post by areianos on Feb 3, 2008 15:18:29 GMT -5
Who knows.?
I think majority[?] of them just wanted to run away from Albania first.
If they try to claim NW Greece - well the Greek army needs some practice so its not all that bad and in turn can drive them right up to Moschopolis - Beration line and seal the borders.
So it can back frire on them.
I think a good 10-15% of Albanians in Greece are problematic and that is some 50-60,000 and this is a big number to contend with.
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Post by BibleRiot on Feb 3, 2008 15:29:37 GMT -5
Leandros, you're right to be honest, but perhaps you've been misinformed by the press about a few things. What follows is very unemotional, from somebody who isn't involved, so please don't think I'm attacking you for what you said ... I'm just suggesting there are other ways of looking at things. Firstly, are there any real statistics showing that Albanians account for a proportion of crime disproportionate to their numbers? Here in the UK, Blacks are less than 3% of the population and account for about 10% of the attributable crime – so clearly there's a problem of some sort, be it socio-economic, cultural or whatever. www.homeoffice.gov.uk/about-us/news/race-related-crime-statsThe little published research I have seen suggests that this is not the case concerning Albanians in Greece, despite the impression created by the media, but I'm open to correction if you can show otherwise. Secondly, the Greek countryside would be unable to produce economically were it not for the Albanian labour input. Greeks would not take these jobs at these wages and the wages would not rise if the Albs were not there – the jobs would simply disappear or Greece would have to secure other sources of immigrant labour. Or Greek yoghurt would be a thing of the past. In other sectors, especially construction, that are also reliant on cheap, poorly unionised and less regulated labour, it is possible that fewer immigrants would force employers to raise wages to a level at which Greeks would take them .... but that's a faulty equation for the economy as a whole. Cheap Albanian labour, which another state has paid to raise, educate and bring to a productive age, is a bargain for the Greek economy. The jobs lost to Greeks in construction are compensated for by the increased profits circulating through Greek society of both the construction firms and their customers, who have benefited from lower production prices than would have otherwise been available. Those latter profits get reinvested to generate more jobs in sectors more attractive to Greek workers than construction. Thirdly, Greece has a serious demographic problem. Without immigrants, or measures geared to promote a much higher birth-rate, Greeks won't have pensions in 30 years time, because there won't be enough young people working to generate the required surplus. If Greece has to have immigrants, aren't Albs preferable to Nigerians or Pakistanis? Fourthly, remember that Greece and Serbia tried to annihilate Albania as an independent entity back in 1912. Albanian military cooperation with Turkey is partly the result of the irresponsible behaviour of a few Greek MP's who never miss an opportunity to raise the stakes over 'Vorio-Epirus'. In contrast, Alb representatives really don't want to know about the Cham issue. It is also an example of the complete Balkan idiocy of the Albanian government, seriously neglecting the interests of its emigrant workforce, but that's another issue. And as for burnt flags and the Internet loonies, well, is it really worth getting upset about a handful of morons? Fifth, what happened in Ottoman times, WW II, etc..... We're in the EU. The French and the Dutch have learnt to live with the Germans, and the last two actually like each other these days (the Dutch are less forgiving). The Brits tolerate the French and vice-versa. Albania will eventually join. Turkey won't. That's more relevant that the posturing represented by that naval base. I think it would have to go before Albania came close to membership. So fair enough, hate Albanians for their arrogance, manners, attitudes, whatever. But with the greatest of respect, perhaps it's worth thinking twice before wishing they weren't there, because the consequences might be worse than you imagine.
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Post by kasso on Feb 3, 2008 15:30:39 GMT -5
leandros nikon,
If you consider this thread idiotic why do you participate in the discussion?
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Post by Arxileas on Feb 3, 2008 15:59:56 GMT -5
I sence another Bulkan war just around the corner coming soon.......The signs are there.
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rex362
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Pellazg
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Post by rex362 on Feb 3, 2008 16:42:17 GMT -5
oh no .....I dont have time to cross the Atlantic .....again "The signs are there." signs shmigns .....what signs
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Post by leandros nikon on Feb 3, 2008 18:03:16 GMT -5
i wish i could share your optimism,BR but right now i cant...
i hope that they will be assimilated some day...
i insist that they should not be so many,we have learned nothing from our neighbors experience...
we will just have to wait and see...the number of murders that they commit has been seriously reduced and that is something positive at least...on the other hand i must say that the media did not influence my opinion about them as much as the albanian animosity that i note towards greece all these years and in several webpages...do you believe that i have never read anything possitive towards the greek people,anything at all... BR,please understand that we need immigrants in Greece,not albanians alone...and realise that their chauvinism might get extremely dangerous if they get the support that they need...... just a hint for now...if you google the phrase "free chameria" right now,you will have 230 results...chance the phrase into "free north epirus" and you get 6 results only!
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Feb 3, 2008 18:45:27 GMT -5
Do Greeks hate Albanians? I like Albanians... I'm back
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Feb 3, 2008 18:50:18 GMT -5
Hu? you have back from army? welcome to hell Patrino even your post is about simpaty of albanians ;D
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Kanaris
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Post by Kanaris on Feb 3, 2008 18:52:36 GMT -5
Patrinos, is that really you? Prove it...
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Feb 3, 2008 18:55:30 GMT -5
yeah how you can prove it? ofcourse, you can prove only if you post your pic's during army
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Feb 3, 2008 18:57:43 GMT -5
Patrinos, is that really you? Prove it... I love ta Albana ;D prijesdardanian????Who are you ore alvane?
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Feb 3, 2008 18:59:11 GMT -5
Kalos se vrika Kanari!
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