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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Dec 17, 2008 21:47:15 GMT -5
What do you guys think of the current Wikipedia article? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_KosovoIt pretty much shows that Serbs were a massive majority in Kosovo before the Turks came along. The records of our mortal enemies (the Turks) even show us as a majority. What do the Albanian's think? Is this article all just lies? -------------------------- The earliest referenced records on Kosovo's demographics (the Decani Charter) shows a massive Serbian majority... The Decani Charter from 1330 contained a detailed list of households and chartered villages in Metohija and northwestern Albania: 3 of 89 settlements were Albanian, the other being Serb. Subsequent records on Kosovo's demographics are held by the Turks eg; 1455: Turkish cadastral tax census of the Brankovic dynasty lands (covering 80% of present-day Kosovo) recorded 480 villages, 13,693 adult males, 12,985 dwellings, 14,087 household heads (480 widows and 13,607 adult males). Totally there were around 75,000 inhabitants in 590 villages comprising modern-day Kosovo. By ethnicity: 13,000 Serb dwellings present in all 480 villages and towns 75 Vlach dwellings in 34 villages 46 Albanian dwellings in 23 villages 17 Bulgarian dwellings in 10 villages 5 Greek dwellings in Lauša, Vuèitrn 1 Jewish dwelling in Vuèitrn 1 Croat dwelling Approximately 90% Serbs in the mid 15th century.
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tyson
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Post by tyson on Dec 18, 2008 2:26:45 GMT -5
i have no doubt in my mind that kosovo was mainly populated by serbs before the ottoman conquest of kosovo.
the demographic change only started to happen after ottoman conquest of kosovo.
muslim albanian muhajirs from northern albania migrated to kosovo, while serbs were fleeing kosovo from the turks. albanians also assimilated very large amounts of slavic muslims, aswell as turks. albanian numbers just continued to expand from high birthrates, whereas serb numbers kept dropping, and they even tried to get serbs and montenegrins to move to kosovo, but that was a failure, coz their numbers still dropped due to low birth rates. albanians essentially won the demographic battle for kosovo.
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Post by meltdown711 on Dec 18, 2008 3:04:29 GMT -5
Most colonists left when they realized the poverty in constrast to Belgrade as well... that was one of the primary reasons for Serb emigration.
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Post by fazlinho on Dec 18, 2008 5:59:19 GMT -5
What do you guys think of the current Wikipedia article? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_KosovoIt pretty much shows that Serbs were a massive majority in Kosovo before the Turks came along. The records of our mortal enemies (the Turks) even show us as a majority. What do the Albanian's think? Is this article all just lies? I think that it is insane talking about who was first, as we Slavs came from Russia theoretically we couldn't claim BiH, Cro, Serbia, Slovenia, Macedonia etc... But obviously we can, and we do, and we don't intend to give up these lands.
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tyson
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Post by tyson on Dec 18, 2008 9:03:53 GMT -5
Most colonists left when they realized the poverty in constrast to Belgrade as well... that was one of the primary reasons for Serb emigration. So Serbs are the colonizers and Shqiptars the natives because Serbs have been in Kosovo longer than Shqiptars. That makes sense if you're an idiot, I suppose. Now GTFO, you Parasitic s**t eater. Mega Serbatron 1.389, u silly boy..... he is talking about the serbs and montenegrins who migrated there during the first yugoslavia to bulster up the numbers of serbs & slavs there. the government made an initiative to get serbs and montenegrins to migrate to kosovo to help shift the demographics of kosovo into the serbs favor over the albanians.
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Post by ilirdardani on Dec 18, 2008 9:08:46 GMT -5
i have no doubt in my mind that kosovo was mainly populated by serbs before the ottoman conquest of kosovo. the demographic change only started to happen after ottoman conquest of kosovo. muslim albanian muhajirs from northern albania migrated to kosovo, while serbs were fleeing kosovo from the turks. albanians also assimilated very large amounts of slavic muslims, aswell as turks. albanian numbers just continued to expand from high birthrates, whereas serb numbers kept dropping, and they even tried to get serbs and montenegrins to move to kosovo, but that was a failure, coz their numbers still dropped due to low birth rates. albanians essentially won the demographic battle for kosovo. You got it all wrong Tyson my friend. Before the Ottomans came, there were hundreds of thousands of Albanians living in Serbia (without kosovo that is), all the way up to Belgrade, and the Serbs kept pushing them down year after year, village after village, and a lot of Albanians that are from Kosovo came from Serbia, not from Albania like the Serbian historians would like you to think, because thats their master plan, that Albanians came only from the "small" Albania and then took Kosovo, macedonia, montenegro, etc, while there is proof that its the other way around, that they moved down from the northern balkans (serbia, croatia).
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tyson
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Post by tyson on Dec 18, 2008 9:30:40 GMT -5
LMAO! Good one Tyson and Ilirdardani. As if anyone actually believes that crap. i'm talking crap?...... here's a quote from the wikipedia article on the demographic history of kosovo. ---------------------------- Colonization programs were implemented by the Serbian authorities in the periods between 1922 and 1929, 1933 and 1938, leading to the settlement of some 10,000 Serbian families, mostly in northern Kosovo, Kosovo Polje and along the Lab River, mostly from Montenegro and poor regions of central Serbia. The process was a result of the agrarian reform pursued by the Yugoslavian authorities. "Tax and property incentives for Serbs to move to Kosovo produced a measurable demographic change in Kosovo’s cities by 1929, but the province’s overall ethnic balance remained roughly 60% Albanian, 35% Serb," ------------------------------------------ you silly fool. and i even agree that serbs were majority in kosovo before ottoman rule. you're just so thick headed that you immediately diagree to whatever i say, even if it supports your case. You got it all wrong Tyson my friend. Before the Ottomans came, there were hundreds of thousands of Albanians living in Serbia (without kosovo that is), all the way up to Belgrade, and the Serbs kept pushing them down year after year, village after village, and a lot of Albanians that are from Kosovo came from Serbia, not from Albania like the Serbian historians would like you to think, because thats their master plan, that Albanians came only from the "small" Albania and then took Kosovo, macedonia, montenegro, etc, while there is proof that its the other way around, that they moved down from the northern balkans (serbia, croatia). i dont know about that, lol. maybe some albanians lived in belgrade while under ottoman rule, and then later migrated southwards after ottomans started losing their control of the pashaluk of belgrade.
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Post by SKORIC on Dec 18, 2008 9:53:06 GMT -5
Wiki is reliable for alot of things but when it comes to controversial stuff its a haven for random editing. Tyson is talking about the 1920's and 30's, not the middle ages where he agrees it was mostly Serb so i dont see why you's are disagreeing with him? Did i miss something.
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tyson
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Post by tyson on Dec 18, 2008 9:56:01 GMT -5
^^ nah you didnt miss anything. its just that Mega Serbatron 1.389 is a bit slow, and is not catching on to what we're actually talking about.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Dec 18, 2008 10:08:32 GMT -5
i have no doubt in my mind that kosovo was mainly populated by serbs before the ottoman conquest of kosovo. the demographic change only started to happen after ottoman conquest of kosovo. muslim albanian muhajirs from northern albania migrated to kosovo, while serbs were fleeing kosovo from the turks. albanians also assimilated very large amounts of slavic muslims, aswell as turks. albanian numbers just continued to expand from high birthrates, whereas serb numbers kept dropping, and they even tried to get serbs and montenegrins to move to kosovo, but that was a failure, coz their numbers still dropped due to low birth rates. albanians essentially won the demographic battle for kosovo. You got it all wrong Tyson my friend. Before the Ottomans came, there were hundreds of thousands of Albanians living in Serbia (without kosovo that is), all the way up to Belgrade, and the Serbs kept pushing them down year after year, village after village, and a lot of Albanians that are from Kosovo came from Serbia, not from Albania like the Serbian historians would like you to think, because thats their master plan, that Albanians came only from the "small" Albania and then took Kosovo, macedonia, montenegro, etc, while there is proof that its the other way around, that they moved down from the northern balkans (serbia, croatia). Dude I commend you for trying, but as always your efforts are pretty poorly written & generally filled with baseless crap... What the article is saying is that according to the Decani Charter & the Turkish Cadastral Tax Services (as the earliest demographic records) they show a massive Serbian majority in Kosovo... Now on the other hand you're saying that prior to this, Albanians lived all the way up to Beograd & they were driven down by the slavic migrations. Can you reference any single source for this claim what so ever?
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Post by Pejoni on Dec 18, 2008 11:06:41 GMT -5
when you people emigrated about five hundred years ago, you can no longer call yourselves Kosovo's ingenious population 500 years ago was 1508. Did we arrive after the Battle of Kosovo in 1389? That's demonstrating a major lack of knowledge. Actually that's quite embarassing. Yes you did, you sure as hell dont know your own history.
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Post by ilirdardani on Dec 18, 2008 12:06:48 GMT -5
Plus the battle of Fushe Kosova was a battle where Albanians, Croatians, Bosnians and Serbians (and other nationalities like Hungarians) all together fought the Turks, but the Serbian nationalists, like always, make it their holiday and say it was only them that fought the turks.
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Post by fazlinho on Dec 18, 2008 12:12:07 GMT -5
Gotta love the past, we were all more united back then than now.
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Post by Banatski on Dec 18, 2008 15:48:13 GMT -5
Plus the battle of Fushe Kosova was a battle where Albanians, Croatians, Bosnians and Serbians (and other nationalities like Hungarians) all together fought the Turks, but the Serbian nationalists, like always, make it their holiday and say it was only them that fought the turks. This is really funny, can we have some sources for this? Do you people really need to twist so many facts to feel more important and influential?
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Post by kapetan on Dec 18, 2008 17:22:07 GMT -5
Plus the battle of Fushe Kosova was a battle where Albanians, Croatians, Bosnians and Serbians (and other nationalities like Hungarians) all together fought the Turks, but the Serbian nationalists, like always, make it their holiday and say it was only them that fought the turks. This is really funny, can we have some sources for this? Do you people really need to twist so many facts to feel more important and influential? Hold up...you need sources to tell you the other balkan kingdoms/people also fought in the battle of kosovo? You serious? I suppose you also need someone to tell you serbs fought on BOTH sides.
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Post by vinjak on Dec 18, 2008 17:23:27 GMT -5
This time people stay on topic and no insults thanks.
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Dec 18, 2008 17:28:00 GMT -5
Plus the battle of Fushe Kosova was a battle where Albanians, Croatians, Bosnians and Serbians (and other nationalities like Hungarians) all together fought the Turks, but the Serbian nationalists, like always, make it their holiday and say it was only them that fought the turks. This is really funny, can we have some sources for this? Do you people really need to twist so many facts to feel more important and influential? dude did you read history of battle of Kosova's? except all Balcan people also were Polish,Hungarians and some Dutchs in First Kosova's Battle. About Second Kosova Battle's II (1448) were only Albanians/Hungarians againt Serbo-Othomans Aliance. Did notice why serbs never mention Kosova Battle's II ?
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Dec 18, 2008 17:33:42 GMT -5
500 years ago was 1508. Did we arrive after the Battle of Kosovo in 1389? That's demonstrating a major lack of knowledge. Actually that's quite embarassing. Yes you did, you sure as hell dont know your own history. OK, so now we have two Albanians who are saying that Serbs did not arrive in Kosovo until after the year 1500, over 100 years after the battle of Kosovo. I suppose Serbs must have just sneakily built all our monasteries like Visoki Decani (1330) & then split. And of course we should be able to find Albanian institutions older than this right? This is completely commical. I honestly thought that Albanian's would be able to come up with something. Honestly guys wtf. I'm just scratching my head going do Pejoni & Kassowonderful not know math maybe?
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Dec 18, 2008 17:39:01 GMT -5
Yes you did, you sure as hell dont know your own history. OK, so now we have two Albanians who are saying that Serbs did not arrive in Kosovo until after the year 1500, over 100 years after the battle of Kosovo. I suppose Serbs must have just sneakily built all our monasteries like Visoki Decani (1330) & then split. And of course we should be able to find Albanian institutions older than this right? This is completely commical. I honestly thought that Albanian's would be able to come up with something. Honestly guys wtf. All Monastyres in Kosova have Byzantine style (nothing slavic) exp Decan's Monastir and all were Albanian/venetian/Byzantines before serbian emperor Dusan embezzlemented all.
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Post by vinjak on Dec 18, 2008 17:40:03 GMT -5
This is really funny, can we have some sources for this? Do you people really need to twist so many facts to feel more important and influential? dude did you read history of battle of Kosova's? except all Balcan people also were Polish,Hungarians and some Dutchs in First Kosova's Battle. About Second Kosova Battle's II (1448) were only Albanians/Hungarians againt Serbo-Othomans Aliance. Did notice why serbs never mention Kosova Battle's II ? Oh this is gold lololol It was a coalition between Brankovic and Hunyadi
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