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Post by lvl100 on Feb 13, 2009 1:47:49 GMT -5
A few years ago I read a book about Romania I just happened to pick it up in local library (btw I dont live in Hungary), it was not written by a Hungarian but actually by a English Professor who was specialist in East Euro and Balkan history. I have read too from a book of a foreigner who had a fetish for all Balkan minorities and the bias in that book puts Magyar Garda` propaganda to shame  If you want to talk about a book you should cite the author too. Oskar, we didnt vote Ceausescu. While i acknowledge the hard times for Hungarians during that period , its hypocritical to blame it like its a tenet of Romanian people. Ceausescu fucked all Romanians equally, not only Hungarians. Now Romania its praised for its legislation and treatment of minorities. Every parties involved have skeletons in their closet, digging up the past mess wont help anyone. Its the present we must focus in a mature manner to maintain a good cohabitation. |
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Post by jerryspringer on Feb 13, 2009 2:27:13 GMT -5
A few years ago I read a book about Romania I just happened to pick it up in local library (btw I dont live in Hungary), it was not written by a Hungarian but actually by a English Professor who was specialist in East Euro and Balkan history. Many things I had read about from Hungarian sources for example Romania"s poor treatment of minorities especially Hungarians and Ceasescu"s approach to how history was written etc were similiarly detailed in this book. Secondly Romania"s poor treatment of minorities has even been noted by international organisations. What minorities? Hungarians and Gypsies were discriminated against, whereas Transylvanian Saxons and Jews were allowed to leave the country for a fee. Greedy Greeks were kicked in the butt, but they survived. The first were discriminated because the society viewed them as a threat, whereas the latter was about economy. |
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Feb 13, 2009 8:48:35 GMT -5
"Now Romania its praised for its legislation and treatment of minorities."
same redundant remark...
' July 9, 1997 Bill Clinton explained that Romania knew how to overcome tension between Romanians and Hungarians. Romania had become a model for settling interethnic conflicts. The Romanian newspapers spread the news (with their own slant), without delay. “Look, the United States’ president himself is repeating that the Hungarians should be happy with the actual situation in Romania. These Hungarians are always so hard to please”!
Pages From the Romanian – Hungarian Reconciliation: 1989-1999.
The Role of Civic Organizations
by Gabriel Andreescu
try reading something other than romanian newspapers and propaganda idiot
"whereas Transylvanian Saxons and Jews were allowed to leave the country for a fee."
you mean sold....
Another chapter in this migration story was opened with the agreement the German chancellor Schmidt and the Romanian president Ceauºescu concluded in 1978. From then on between 10.000 and 20.000 people of German origin (Saxons and Swabians) left Romania for Germany every year till 1989, and Germany payed a certain sum per capita. It kind of bought them.
In the 80-ies the son of Ceauºescu, Nicu, became mayor of Hermannstadt and literally terrorized that town for years, which certainly added to many inhabitants’ desire to get away from there.
After the fall of communism, with the borders more open and an economic situation without perspectives, the remaining Saxons also started to leave.
Nowadays the Saxon towns and villages are mainly populated by Romanians and Gypsies.
"At the end of World War II, the survivors returned to find their land and property confiscated by the communist regime, and many of them emigrated. As in the case of the Jews, they were also sold exit visa at the approximate price of $8000.
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Feb 13, 2009 9:51:39 GMT -5
"The millions of Romanians kept serfs or tolerati were exporting their work "
here are just a few examples...
Kolozsvar started to develop under the reign of the Hungarian kings, and in the 15th century, it was surrounded by walls. On 23 February, 1440, Matthias Hunyadi, son of János Hunyadi, was born in Kolozsvár. (János Hunyadi was the Hungarian legendary defender of the country against the Ottoman (Turkish) invasion, the military commander, whom the pope called the Savior of Christianity; and his son, Matthias Hunyadi later became the finest Hungarian king (1458-1490), who brought in Hungary the renaissance culture from Italy.
KOLOZSMONOSTOR is in the outskirts of Kolozsvár. The Benedictine monastery and abbey of Kolozsmonostor is of great importance. Founded by Hungarian king Béla I, (1059-1063),
Nagyvarad: The city and the Episcopacy of Várad were found by King Ladislas I., King of Hungary in 1093. The king was buried in the cathedral of the city. There were the graves of King Stephen II, King Andrew II, King Ladislas IV, King Sigismund and his wife Queen Mary. In 1241-42 the Mongols devastated the city and the county. At the years of the Anjou Kings the city was one of the largest cities of the kingdom. The first Turkish siege was in 1474. To 1538 Free Royal City of the Kingdom of Hungary. In 1538 King Ferdinand Habsburg
and King János Szapolyai (both of them kings of Hungary) signed peace and divided the kingdom into two parts. City of Nagyvárad became part of Szapolyai's kingdom. From 1556 the city is part of the Principality of Transylvania as the centre of the 'Részek' ('Parts'). In 1660 the city was occupied by the Osmans and devastated. 1660-1692 the settlement was under Turkish rule.
1692-1850 and 1861-1919 the city was located in the territory of Bihar County, 1850-1861 in South Bihar County.
The settlement in 1910 was a city in the Kingdom of Hungary. Inhabitants in 1910: 64.169; 58.421 (91,0%) Hungarian, 3.604 (5,6%) Rumanian.
The city has got its name from Knight Orod, knight of King Saint Stephen in 1029. Castle Orod later Arad became the capital of Arad County. The city was in Arad County of the Kingdom of Hungary till 1551. In 1514 it was destroyed at the time of the Dózsa peasant revolt. On 18th September 1551 it was occupied by the Turks. The Turks built a new fort and Arad became a sandsak seat. It was under Turkish rule till 1685. The Treaty of Karlovac (1699) reunited it with Hungary. 1699-1741 Arad was part of the Military Borderlands and was the district seat. Between 1763-1783 the new fort was built. 1741-1832 Arad was a town in Arad County. Free Royal City from 1832. At the time of the Independence War in 1848-1849 the Fort Arad took Habsburgs' part, and the fort bombarded the city. On 1st of July 1849 the ort was surrended. Arad became the capital of Hungary for a very short time 02.08.1849 - 09.08.1849. The fort surrended to the Russian troops on 17. August 1849. On 6th October 1849 there were executed the 13 generals of the Independence war (you can find their small obelisc between a football ground and the car parks).
The settlement in 1910 was a city in the Kingdom of Hungary. Inhabitants in 1910: 63.166; 46.085 (73,0%) Hungarian, 10.279 (16,3%) Rumanian
yeah millions of romanians provided the labor lol.......care show some evidence
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Post by oszkarthehun on Feb 13, 2009 18:02:30 GMT -5
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 14, 2009 1:53:35 GMT -5
The settlement in 1910 was a city in the Kingdom of Hungary. Inhabitants in 1910: 63.166; 46.085 (73,0%) Hungarian, 10.279 (16,3%) Rumanian Why in around 60% Romanian Transylvania, the cities had around 10-16% of them ? The Romanians just loved nature and hate the busy crowded life of cities , right ?  Well its kinda hard when Hungarians decided that millions of Romanians doesnt even exist. Sounds familiar ? |
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 14, 2009 2:46:09 GMT -5
so the Hungarian non Nobility/Peasants and many were Szekely suffered also, why do you think there was a significant peasant rebellion that consisted of Szekely and Romanians against the Nobility, In the 1500s, Anton Verancsics wrote: “Transylvania is inhabited by three nations, the Szecklers, the Saxons, and the Hungarians; I would, nevertheless, add the Romanians, who, although they easily equal the number of all the others, do not have any liberties or a nobility, nor any rights of their own... See, there is a difference between having a hard life and to be considered by default some type of inferior human, who isnt worthing to be called inhabitant of that land. Those croats needed to erase their origins and their religion to be considered noble too ? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- For that reason i believe that we must focus on the present , history is loaded with to much hate and pain from both sides. Of course , minorities treatment must be always a priority. There are 2 parts of this problem. 1) one , less important, but still worth mentioning, is that autonomy its not included in the "must have" minority laws. Fact clearly stated recently by Vienna Commission. 2) most important : the people. What you most of you dont see about autonomy its political BS. From szekelis party shouting all kinds of slogans to impress Hungarians`s hearts `till Basescu who want to win nationalists votes. And you believe those BS But if the real population wants it , what stops them ? We are not Serbians, we dont keep that region with tanks. Why the most pro-autonomy meetings (and they are rare)have like 5000 at most when the population is a lot more ? Why are not all in the street now asking the autonomy if they want it so much ? |
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wbb
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Post by wbb on Feb 14, 2009 8:04:04 GMT -5
a few days ago Basescu was in Hungary meeting with this Gyurcsany fukwit, for Basescu, he mentions that the autonomy for Szekely is out of question, so even if u sound so reasonable, he isnt. 2 years ago there was a referendum on autonomy, Basescu called it ''illegal'.'
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Feb 14, 2009 9:59:16 GMT -5
now its 10% to 16% roumanians in cities, don't forget the 0% to 5% roumanians in such cities as Nagyvarad, Temesvar, Kolozsvar, Marosvasarhely, Szatmar
can't find any articles about those "millions of romanians" building those cities can you? Thats because those millions of migrants are New Arrivals...relocated from moldavia and wallachia.
" We are not Serbians, we dont keep that region with tanks."
Marosvasarhely has proven you are.....All romanian military installations in Hungarian majority populated areas like Szekelyfold are manned exclusively with ethnic romanians, even the police force are all romanians. Why don't you do a little research instead of continually lying about what a great multi-ethnic paradise romania is. Lying and thievery must be inherent with you people.
Agache got what he deserved.
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 15, 2009 1:46:27 GMT -5
a few days ago Basescu was in Hungary meeting with this Gyurcsany fukwit, for Basescu, he mentions that the autonomy for Szekely is out of question, so even if u sound so reasonable, he isnt. 2 years ago there was a referendum on autonomy, Basescu called it ''illegal'.' As i said already, Basescu and the szekely party alike, have their own political agenda. And your falling for it. BTW , the szekely party existence its against Romanian Constitution, we had all the legal basis to reject a legal status, but nevertheless we grant them full political rights. Thats about Romanian "oppression" About that referendum it was a political joke too. They didnt made any serious things, they just took a box and walked door to door, checking before ringing if the owner is Hungarian or Romanian ( they asked only Hungarians) No one took seriously that referendum , not even the szekelys. About Basescu calling it "illegal" , it also was only a political speech. If he really was against it, again, we had all the legal basis to arrest and prosecute all the initiators of the referendum. But there was no such things , they were let to do whatever they want without any problems. So you are basically grasping at straws here. Romanian intervention in that area its almost nonexistent. The rest its political BS. |
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 15, 2009 2:13:37 GMT -5
can't find any articles about those "millions of romanians" building those cities can you? Thats because those millions of migrants are New Arrivals...relocated from moldavia and wallachia. I see you have selective readings skills, so let me refresh you memory : ANTON VERANCSICS (1504-1543), friend of Erasmus of Rotterdam. In his Description of Transylvania “Transylvania is inhabited by three nations, the Szecklers, the Saxons, and the Hungarians; I would, nevertheless, add the Romanians, who, although they easily equal the number of all the others, do not have any liberties or a nobility, nor any rights of their own... Tough luck junior , we were an important part of Transylvania`s populations ages ago, like it or not. Do you have any official source ( no geocities links kthxby) for that or is just your usual BS ? Police and army there is mixed and , more important , more than 90% of administration and leaders are Hungarian. |
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Feb 15, 2009 11:16:17 GMT -5
The only BS her are you frustrated posts...The bottom line here is Transylvania and the 2 million ethnic Magyar should never have been given to you balkan people. Cowardice, treachery and falsification should never have been rewarded.
"no written or architectural evidence bears witness to the presence of "proto-Romanians" the lands north of the Danube during the millennium after Rome's withdrawal from Dacia.
Library of Congress
While Romanian historians have tried to argue that the Romanian-speakers have always lived in the territory of Romania (originating, it is claimed, from Romanized Dacian tribes and/or Roman legionaries), there is compelling evidence to show that the Romanian-speakers were originally part of the same population as the Vlachs, whose language and way of life were developed somewhere to the south of the Danube. Only in the twelfth century did the early Romanian-speakers move northwards.
Origins: Serbs, Albanians and Vlachs
Chapter 2 in Noel Malcolm's Kosovo, a short history (Macmilan, London, 1998, p. 22-40)
yeah nomadic vlachs were an important part of transylvania, they built shepards huts.
Try using contemporary sources idiot
While not commenting directly on the quote in the Rumanian-language daily, Recurs, whereby special units are ready to respond to supposed ethnic Hungarians separatist inclinations, Chief Commander of Military Police General Anghel Andreescu, issued a statement in response to protests by the Mures/Maros County Operative Council of the Democratic Alliance of Hungarians in Rumania [see report of April 5]. Andreescu sought to clarify his position by stating that currently eight mobile troops are stationed around the country, for example at the Cluj/Kolozsvár, Tirgu Mures/Marosvásárhely and Brassov/Brassó military police depots, to generally intervene in the case of disturbances, guarantee public safety and restore constitutional order if necessary.
Romanians have been induced to relocate to Transylvania from poorer regions of the country, as well as the Romanian General Staff having recently increased the presence of the Romanian army along with their families (despite the protests of the DAHR), in Hargita and Kovászna counties.
lol....you're one misinformed clown.
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 15, 2009 14:46:23 GMT -5
The only BS her are you frustrated posts... I`m not the one crying in the sleep after Pozsony Bratislava Why because savants writing in the 1500`s about Romanians being a major part of Transylvania`s population doesnt fit to well to your sad rantings and theories about recent cosmic migrations? Great quote,a real jewel of szorostalpu1a BS-ing. April 5 when ? 1800 ? 2009 ? |
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Feb 15, 2009 18:08:37 GMT -5
lol... you're just the one continually returning to this MAGYAR forum and failing miserably.
"writing in the 1500`s about Romanians being a major part of Transylvania`s population "
That so-called "quote" is a falsehood in itself...since there were no people called romanians in the 1500s...try again loser and this time be a little more careful.
"April 5 when ? 1800 ? 2009 ?
I keep forgetting with what I'm dealing with here....So lets look at the comment a little closer. It couldn't be 1800 because romania didn't exist then. It mentions cluj, brasov and tirgu mures...those names have only existed since 1920. It mentions DAHR which has only existed since 1990, and then it mentions Anghel Andreescu who's a 4 star general and a state secretary in charge of home affairs since 2007. So you see just by using your brain a little bit you can acertain this article is fairly recent....S.T.U.P.I.D. gypsy lol
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 16, 2009 0:36:00 GMT -5
"writing in the 1500`s about Romanians being a major part of Transylvania`s population " That so-called "quote" is a falsehood in itself...since there were no people called romanians in the 1500s...try again loser and this time be a little more careful. The ignorance is bliss , isnt it ? Thats your lesson for today junior : Tranquillo Andronico writes in 1534 that Romanians (Valachi) "now call themselves RomansIn 1532, Francesco della Valle accompanying Governor Aloisio Gritti to Transylvania, Walachia and Moldavia notes that Romanians preserved the name of the Romans (Romani) and "they call themselves in their language Romanians (Romei)". He even cites the sentence "Sti rominest ?" ("do you speak Romanian ?" for originally Romanian "ştii româneşte ?")Ferrante Capeci writes around 1575 that the inhabitants of those Provinces call themselves “Romanians” ( Anzi essi si chiamano romanesci, e vogliono molti che erano mandati quì quei che erano dannati a cavar metalli) the Transylvanian Saxon Johann Lebel confirms in 1542 that common Romanians call themselves "Romuini" There are more , but i the we got the idea Oh dear , of course , its about Targu Mures , the isolated and unique incident that every frustrated propagandist must repeat it like a mantra , conveniently forgetting how even Hungarian authors recognize that nobody was innocent those days. |
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wbb
Moderator
Posts: 733
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Post by wbb on Feb 16, 2009 1:09:54 GMT -5
yeah sure, all ur post is nothing more than a fabricated history.
Vlachs is more common sense than Romanians as Romanised Dacians.
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 16, 2009 3:51:34 GMT -5
yeah sure, all ur post is nothing more than a fabricated history. Vlachs is more common sense than Romanians as Romanised Dacians. Yeah , too bad history doesnt care about what you think. Other than that, what can i say, brilliant argumentation wbb style |
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Feb 16, 2009 9:52:54 GMT -5
"Yeah , too bad history doesnt care about what you think."
Yeah..."history is nice isn't it"
" In 1729 Inocentius Micu Klein, Greek Catholic bishop was the first to use the word "RUMUN" instead of Vlach, and to claim LATIN origin. Until then the popular concept accepted the Slavic origin of the Vlachs, based on the use of the Slavic language in the Greek Orthodox Church as well as on the fact, established by several linguists (including Prof. Cihac, Rumanian linguist of the XX century) that 48% of the Rumanian language consisted of Slavic words and only 31% of the Latin.
In 1991 the French writer, Renaud Camus wrote: "What characterizes the Romanians is mental confusion. They don't even know their own history"
History and Myth in Romanian Consciousness By Lucian Boia
It seems you fit into this category perfectly...and please keep your "Oh dear 's" to yourself, this isn't the place to let your homsexual urges out...poponar prost
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Post by lvl100 on Feb 16, 2009 10:54:09 GMT -5
" In 1729 Inocentius Micu Klein, Greek Catholic bishop was the first to use the word "RUMUN" instead of Vlach, and to claim LATIN origin. Although our junior didnt gave the original link of the quote, i knew instantly what site it is. But , hey , lets have some fun ! Copy the first line "In 1729 Inocentius Micu Klein, Greek Catholic bishop was the first to use" Then paste it on Google. Hit the search button. Results : 1 Site: hungarian-history.hu
Wow, seems this is one of the world`s best kept secrets if only 1 site have this info. Or maybe its the same steaming pile of crap that some certain Magyar Garda fanboy its used to feed on. But hey lets move on and see how other scientific and objective sources he uses: Wow Renaud Camus a fairly obscure prose and novels writer and , who spend most of his life in UK, France and USA. I wonder who is going to be next on the list of scientific and relevant list of szorostalpu : Hans Christian Andersen with his "Little mermaid" or "The little match girl" ? Actually the author you just quoted above, Renaud Camus , its known for his obsession for gay people, its book Tricks its all about homosexual encounters. I`m not pointing any finger here , but...erm...i see you really like his writings. |
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Feb 16, 2009 13:35:22 GMT -5
Look who's talking "dear"....."Renaud Camus , its known for his obsession for gay people,"
really, it didn't say that in the article, so how would you know? lol. you really need to put a sock in your mouth, unless this is your "coming out of the closet post ".
and yeah your "wiki' sources are very scholarly and reliable, it allows anyone to make edits...any fool can place an article on their and any idiot such as yourself will believe it.
here is your micu klein and the birth of romanian nationalism...."ruman/roman" take your pick lol
REPRESENTING ROMANIA: A MUSEUM AT THE CENTER OF ETHNIC STRUGGLE By ...
etd.fcla.edu/UF/UFE0004860/schweig_j.pdf -
"Moth of the cloth"....lol, great description, all though I would have called you gypsy moths.
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