|
Post by la3ar on Feb 18, 2011 21:57:34 GMT -5
I am curious to know as to what, when, and how did the ethnic tensions between Serbs and Albanians start.
Let's try to keep this civil.
Again.... this is not meant to instigate nor stear up negative emotions.
It's a simple question I think we all need to adress.
|
|
|
Post by eaglesson on Feb 18, 2011 22:01:00 GMT -5
I thinks it all started in Kosovo... you stole it from us and guess what, its ours again .
|
|
|
Post by la3ar on Feb 18, 2011 22:04:10 GMT -5
It might have started in Kosovo, but I think that's unlikely. The mind-set back way back then was a lot different.
|
|
|
Post by eaglesson on Feb 18, 2011 22:12:03 GMT -5
Its also a possibility that it started during the balkan wars.
|
|
|
Post by laughingriever on Feb 18, 2011 22:53:24 GMT -5
I would guess it first started whenever the two groups first came into contact with each other. To me that means, and I don't really know if I am right or wrong about this, that it started when Slavs started pouring into Balkan, wave after wave, and we drew the line in the fields of Kosova. I guess that line of argument pre-supposes that we were in Balkan before you arrived, which many here would dispute.
After the initial period of killing each other, it seems we all took a break and at least our noble families were intermarrying, but then the turks came and that was the great upheaval in Balkan. Later Serbs would develop this complex of Turk-slayers, and by extension Albanian slayers. At this point I think our differences became forever irreconcilable.
Balkan wars didn't help either, as eaglesson stated right above, but I think they were just an extension of everything that had come before. It couldn't have played out any other way.
And, to continue the line of thought from the other thread, Yes, serbs would be very happy if the Albanian people just vanished, whether in the existential sense or genocidal sense. Reading the sig lines of novus deakonis, krivo and others about "Death to the Shqiptar colonizers" is reminder of that. I suppose that I could be wrong based on the small sample size fallacy, yet I feel that it is representative of the whole.
|
|
|
Post by terroreign on Feb 18, 2011 22:59:04 GMT -5
It all happened when the shqiuptar hordes invaded Serb lands....pillaging and disrupting the enlightened Serbs' way of life forever...
|
|
|
Post by laughingriever on Feb 18, 2011 23:03:58 GMT -5
It all happened when the shqiuptar hordes invaded Serb lands....pillaging and disrupting the enlightened Serbs' way of life forever... Without casting any judgment on whether your statement is historically right or wrong, you essentially made my point (and I do consider your statement historical revizionism at its finest).
|
|
|
Post by terroreign on Feb 18, 2011 23:08:14 GMT -5
It all happened when the shqiuptar hordes invaded Serb lands....pillaging and disrupting the enlightened Serbs' way of life forever... Without casting any judgment on whether your statement is historically right or wrong, you essentially made my point (and I do consider your statement historical revizionism at its finest). I never claimed your point was incorrect...
|
|
|
Post by laughingriever on Feb 18, 2011 23:58:15 GMT -5
Point taken....
|
|
|
Post by mystery on Feb 19, 2011 9:15:27 GMT -5
I think it was during the start of the 20th century.. Balkan wars than the whole communist thing, Hoxha and Tito falling out of favor then of course the Yugoslavs treating albanians like crap and the eventual attempt at a Albanian free Yugoslavia..
|
|
|
Post by la3ar on Feb 19, 2011 17:23:50 GMT -5
^ Tito built homes for illegal Albanians, declaring a truce. And indeed there was a truce, untill he died.
|
|
|
Post by srbobran on Feb 19, 2011 19:48:25 GMT -5
Like Crap? Are you fvcking kidding me? Albanians were literally begging to cross the border into Kosovo because of how much better your lives were under Tito then Hoxha. On top of that you had half the fucking national budget being poured into the "Autonomous Province of Kosovo" and absolutely no progress being made. Treated like crap, the fucking nerve. Absolutely disgusting.
Do you have any proof whatsoever of anything you just said? The Albanians weren't even a recognized people at the time (first mention was in the 11th century) so how on earth could they have randomly come together in the 600's and decided that Kosovo and everything south was 'Albanian' when for all we know, the Albanians as a people didn't even exist at that time (certainly not in the eyes of the rest of Europe).
That's a ludicrous argument. The Serbian Albanian animosity started with the Balkan Wars. The Albanians sided with the Ottomans, we sided with the Balkan league, we became enemies and the rest is history. I mean, if you look at medieval Serb-Albanian relations, they were pretty good.
|
|
|
Post by la3ar on Feb 19, 2011 19:54:57 GMT -5
^ I agree. Once upon a time Albanians and Serbs got along very well.
They even participated in Serb orthodox ceremonies.
|
|
|
Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Feb 20, 2011 7:58:16 GMT -5
I would guess it first started whenever the two groups first came into contact with each other. To me that means, and I don't really know if I am right or wrong about this, that it started when Slavs started pouring into Balkan, wave after wave, and we drew the line in the fields of Kosova. I guess that line of argument pre-supposes that we were in Balkan before you arrived, which many here would dispute. Even if Serbs did arrive en-masse this is still a completely stupid repetition coming from Albo's. There's plenty to think that cooperation between Serbs & Albanians was infinitely better then today. After all we both sided together against Turks in Kosovo.
|
|
|
Post by laughingriever on Feb 20, 2011 11:43:34 GMT -5
Do you have any proof whatsoever of anything you just said? The Albanians weren't even a recognized people at the time (first mention was in the 11th century) so how on earth could they have randomly come together in the 600's and decided that Kosovo and everything south was 'Albanian' when for all we know, the Albanians as a people didn't even exist at that time (certainly not in the eyes of the rest of Europe). That's a ludicrous argument. The Serbian Albanian animosity started with the Balkan Wars. The Albanians sided with the Ottomans, we sided with the Balkan league, we became enemies and the rest is history. I mean, if you look at medieval Serb-Albanian relations, they were pretty good. No I have no "proof" that would satisfy all parties, in fact I was taking a bit of poetic license with my writings. The line about me "not really knowing whether I am right or wrong about this" was to let people know that this is a personal opinion, not necessarily supported by any "proof". If I had definite proof one way or the other, then I would form a definite opinion. I think my post also made the point that, at least our nobility intermarried, implying that even the average man and woman might have. In fact I bet this kind of thing goes on even today www.topix.com/forum/world/serbia/TD0TBH7I3SSMFNHJPI based my thought on my view of history, in which when two tribes come into contact and conflict, at first they kill each other, then they find that it's more profitable to enslave, and finally they end up marrying each other. (Again, no real proof of this, just my own synthesis of history and anthropology). I admit, it's an over-simplified and generalized, and so not very "accurate". Obviously, I cannot say with certainty who, and where, the "Albanian" people were circa 600 AD. More likely than not, that particular brand of identity was probably not forged yet.
|
|
|
Post by ulf on Feb 20, 2011 19:03:49 GMT -5
bottom line, it was USA orchestrated (Albanian rebellion in Kosovo against Serbia)
This happens when you bring peasant manners from your country into more advanced one - a rebellion, and who knows maybe even a state(soon to be seen)
|
|
|
Post by la3ar on Feb 20, 2011 19:08:25 GMT -5
^ USA?
The USA didn't become relevent untill recently, this feud has been on for much longer than that.
|
|
|
Post by ulf on Feb 20, 2011 19:11:38 GMT -5
USA just used it in the end
|
|
|
Post by la3ar on Feb 20, 2011 19:14:35 GMT -5
Ya that became way to obvious. Only a blind-man couldnt see that. Just like the civil wars during the 90's; All of the ex-Yugo people's got along for centuries and declared themsevles as the same, now all of a sudden we want to kill each other
|
|
|
Post by ulf on Feb 20, 2011 19:22:05 GMT -5
If my memory serves me right, it all started when Yugoslavia opposed to unification of Germany. Thats when they decided to break us into smaller banana states. ps. Old text but nevertheless very interesting: www.emperors-clothes.com/articles/carr/carr.html
|
|