Albanians are not Illyrian

[rex362]

you guys need more .....I have 6 days worth of this ....



PELASGIAN -ILLYRO- ALBANIAN

[terroreign]

^no soliciting.....

[derk]

interesting stuff rex

[rex362]

Nov 4, 2011 21:56:16 GMT -5 @terroreign said:

^no soliciting.....

“…Albania, whose people are probably the oldest inhabitants of the peninsula have even been indentified by some with the ancient Pelasgi…” (Travels and Politics in the Near East, William Miller, p.208)

"...the principal proof of this Pelasgic origin to be the relation between the Albanian language and the most ancient Greek mythology..."

[atdhetar]

rex pls stop, my head is spinning, one source at a time pls

[atdhetar]

Sept 15, 2011 12:38:53 GMT -5 missanthropology58 said:

Sept 14, 2011 10:16:51 GMT -5 @darkness said:

says the dark asian boerka wearing nutjob

Yeah i'm so dark with my light tanned skin light hazel eyes and medium brunette hair what a Paki

marry me

[rex362]

[valmir]

Albanians are Illyrians and thats A FACT!

[Hellenas]

THE PELASGIANS-DIRECT ANCESTORS OF THE HELLENES.

Christos Mergoupis

Based on a number of classical quotes, that the Pelasgians were Hellenes (Greeks), and the direct ancestors of later Greek tribes. Some of the components of these theories are as follows:

That the term "barbarian" had a dual meaning. Aside from meaning "non-Hellenic," the term "barbarian" has been used by Greek tribes/city-states to deride other Greek tribes/city-states that were deemed unsophisticated in their use of the Hellenic language/culture (Foreigners and Barbarians). When Demosthenes of Athens attacked Philip II of Macedon, in the Third Philippic, Demosthenes deemed the Macedonians as non-Hellenic, unrelated to the Hellenes, and not even worthy of being deemed as "barbarians." The utilization of the term in many ancient Greek accounts is representative of the competition that existed among various Greek city-states, tribes, and civilizations.

From the dual meaning of the term "barbarian", some propose that when Herodotus deemed the Pelasgians as "barbaric", he did not imply that they were non-Hellenes. In support of this interpretation, these theorists point to the passage where Herodotus deems the Hellenes a branch of the Pelasgians (Herodotus on the Pelasgians and the Early Hellenes). Herodotus 1.57 concludes that the Athenians "changed language" when they "joined the Hellenic body"; but this may be open to different interpretations. Herodotus also tells of a war in which the Athenians expelled the Pelasgians from Attica to Lemnos. Yet, Herodotus is known for not distinguishing the difference between dialects and languages that are completely separate (Herodotus' Conception of Foreign Languages). As a result of the ambiguity of Herodotus in distinguishing languages from dialects, one can propose that the language of the Pelasgians was a "barbaric" (or unsophisticated) form of Hellenic as opposed to it being non-Hellenic.

That the autochthonous nature of the Athenians — an ancient belief to which Herodotus, Isocrates, Plutarch and others attest — implies they are descended from the autochthonous Pelasgians. The Athenians deemed themselves "true Hellenes" due to their well-developed society.

---

Contrary to modern understanding, Herodotus was convinced that the Hellenes were not invaders, but descendents of Pelasgians:

"The Hellenic race has never, since its first origin, changed its speech. This at least seems evident to me. It was a branch of the Pelasgic, which separated from the main body, and at first was scanty in numbers and of little power; but it gradually spread and increased to a multitude of nations, chiefly by the voluntary entrance into its ranks of numerous tribes of barbarians. The Pelasgi, on the other hand, were, as I think, a barbarian race which never greatly multiplied."

That the Athenians were autochthonous was expressed mythically in the stories of Erechtheus and Erichthonius and was emphatically stated by Isocrates in Panegyric 23-5:

"For we did not win the country we dwell in by expelling others from it, or by seizing it when uninhabited, nor are we a mixed race collected together from many nations, but so noble and genuine is our descent, that we have continued for all time in possession of the land from which we sprang, being children of our native soil, and able to address our city by the same titles that we give to our nearest relations, for we alone of all the Hellenes have the right to call our city at once nurse and fatherland and mother."

[Hellenas]

A fast example from Wikipedia.

In Greek mythology, Pelasgus (Greek: Ðåëáóãüò) was the eponymous ancestor of the Pelasgians, the mythical inhabitants of Greece who established the worship of the Dodonaean Zeus, Hephaestus, the Cabeiri, and other divinities. In the different parts of the country once occupied by Pelasgians, there existed dif­ferent traditions as to the origin and connection of Pelasgus. The Ancient Greeks used to believe even he was the first man.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelasgus

The name Pelasgians (Greek: Ðåëáóãïß, Pelasgoí, singular Ðåëáóãüò, Pelasgós) was used by some ancient Greek writers to refer to populations that were either the ancestors of the Greeks or who preceded the Greeks in Greece.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelasgians

Achilles prays to "High Zeus, Lord of Dodona, Pelasgian, living afar off, brooding over wintry Dodona".

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodona

Pelasgians=ancestors of ancient Greeks.

[Hellenas]

Wikipedia.


the Albanians originated north of the Jirecek Line, further north and inland
than the current borders of Albania suggest.



The Albanians first appear in the historical record in Byzantine sources of the late 11th century.

The Arbanasi people are recorded as being 'half-believers' (non-Orthodox Christians) and speaking their own language in the Fragment of Origins of Nations between 1000-1018 by an anonymous author in a Bulgarian text of the 11th century.[23]

The theory of an Illyrian origin of the Albanians is challenged on archaeological and linguistic grounds.

Although the Illyrian tribe of the Albanoi and the place Albanopolis could be located near Krujë, nothing proves a relation of this tribe to the Albanians, whose name appears for the first time in the eleventh century in Byzantine sources[61]

According to linguist V. Georgiev, the theory of an Illyrian origin for the Albanians is weakened by a lack of any Albanian names before the 12th century and the relative absence of Greek influence that would surely be present if the Albanians inhabited their homeland continuously since ancient times.[62] According to Georgiev if the Albanians originated near modern-day Albania, the number of Greek loanwords in the Albanian language should be higher.[63]

According to Georgiev, although some Albanian toponyms descend from Illyrian, Illyrian toponyms from antiquity have not changed according to the usual phonetic laws applying to the evolution of Albanian. Furthermore, placenames can be a special case and the Albanian language more generally has not been proven to be of Illyrian stock.[61]

Many linguists have tried to link Albanian with Illyrian, but without clear results.[61][64] Albanian belongs to the satem group within Indo-European language tree, while there is a debate whether Illyrian was centum or satem. On the other hand, Dacian[64] and Thracian[65] seem to belong to satem. Additionally, more recent research suggests that there was a process of satemization by which non-satem languages slowly acquired characteristics, and this characteristic has found parallels in the modern development of many Western European languages. For example, in terms of the pronunciation of the word for one hundred ("centum" kɛntʊm in Latin and "satem" satəm in Avestan, an Ancient Iranian language- hence the names for the isogloss), French could be considered semi-satemized, as the pronunciation of French cent, sɑ̃t, is actually closer to "satem" than "centum".[citation needed][original research?]

There is a lack of clear archaeological evidence for a continuous settlement of an Albanian-speaking population since Illyrian times. For example, while Albanians scholars maintain that the Komani-Kruja burial sites support the Illyrian-Albanian continuity theory, most scholars reject this and consider that the remains indicate a population of Romanized Illyrians who spoke a Romance language.[66][67][68] Recently, some Albanian archeologists have also been moving away from describing the Komani-Kruja culture as a proto-Albanian culture.[69]

[Hellenas]

The real Albanian origin

[Shqipni13]

Nothing proves the link between Albanopolis and Albanians? Hmmmm

[uz]

Jan 15, 2012 5:06:01 GMT -5 Shqipni13 said:

Nothing proves the link between Albanopolis and Albanians? Hmmmm

What does?

[srbobran]

^Nothing. Albanians don't even call themselves Albanians, its a name that foreigners call them. Albanians call themselves Shqiptars, the name Albania holds no meaning to them. Until we get evidence that these Albanoi called themselves Shqiptars, the Albanians can't even claim the name of the Illyrians.

[laughinglions]

Tense and Aspect in Indo-european Languages: Theory, Typology, Diachrony (Current Issues in Linguistic Theory)
by John Hewson and Vit Bubenik (1997)
www.amazon.com/gp/search?index=books&linkCode=qs&keywords=9027236496






books.google.com/books?id=5pCBRsfJMv8C&pg=PA103&dq=cimochowski+albanian+position&hl=en&sa=X&ei=JCETT4G5L8u3twf8hdWODQ&ved=0CDAQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false

[laughinglions]

Before somebody decides to get cute and start throwing around words like "Caucasus", a pet favorite among Greeks and Serbs, allow me to lift up this post
illyria.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=shqiperiaalbania&thread=34899&page=1#329273

[atdhetar]

laughing lions ain't playing around son, keep schoolin' these fools

[Anittas]

Albanians are not Illyrians, but they hail from the Illyrians and the various Thracian tribes.

[rex362]

Jan 15, 2012 18:56:38 GMT -5 atdhetar said:

laughing lions ain't playing around son, keep schoolin' these fools

should read :

laughing lions ain't playing around son, keep schoolin' these Albanians that have been fooled into assimilation by the grek


Hellenas ...where is your families heritage from ? have you ever heard your yaya & papou speak a strange language to your ears