Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 6, 2007 11:10:15 GMT -5
Foreign policy is not about letting other countries run you, I think you guys get my drift on this one. FP is about having good relations with your neighbours and those in which you would like to trade with. It's not about letting other's run your country or giving them ultimatums based on what you would like to see them do for your own benefit.
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Zvone
Amicus
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Posts: 525
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Post by Zvone on Dec 6, 2007 15:11:41 GMT -5
No, foreign policy is following your own interest. How much of this interest you can exert on other states depends on your political leverage. Croatia has little to none so it can’t influence other state’s policies as much as the other states can influence Croatia.
Your interpretation is not realistic in any sense. Look at the example of Iraq, Afghanistan, Gulf War, Latin America, etc. All of these policies were based on self-interest rather than a common good. Why do you think Iran and North Korea are trying to create and amass nuclear weapons? To gain leverage and therefore be more effective when conducting foreign policy.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 6, 2007 15:50:11 GMT -5
How are we to talk about a "so called" foreign policy then if we have no power whatsoever in excerting our interest over others? This discussion is pointless is what I'm trying to say. We need to fix our internal policies before we excercise our external ones and then we can have the power to figure out some great foreign policies. We won't get any foreign help with that, we need to do that alone.
However, I do realise what you are saying, I agree and understand how the system works. But I would like to think that perhaps we can go about it in a different manner than just becoming another "yes man".
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tyson
Amicus
Posts: 1,256
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Post by tyson on Dec 6, 2007 20:07:35 GMT -5
i must admit that ivica racan was a good man that cared about croatia, but the people that were beneath him are scum. now that he's gone, SDP is run by a bunch of un-patriotic leftie scumbags, who dont give a rats ass about croatian people. those heartless bastards would cut the lifeline on the croats of BiH, which would end up with croats in BiH mass migrating to western countries, and the substantial croatian presence in BiH would be gone for good. those scumbags of SDP would love nothing more than for croatians to be assimilated into a new european identity. croatia would be nothing more than a piece of land of a future republic of europe. SDP would sell their mothers for a million dollars, they would sell their mothers to join the EU. SDP are a bunch of anti-catholics , who would love nothing more than to see croats reject the catholic church and all the family morals that it brings along with it, and become athiest scum . if sdp was to get in power, the problem with birthrates would be 50 times worse. nobody would have children, because wifes and husbands both have to work, with no penalty rates, no holidays, no sick leave, long hours, have to work on weekends. there would be no time for anything but working. forget familes, because SDP couldnt give a rats ass for them. SDP are the axis of evil.
yes, HDZ is horrible, and my family did not vote for them, but SDP is waaay waaay worse.
a party that cares about the people, and about croatian national interests is HSS. HSS deserves to run croatia
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Zvone
Amicus
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Posts: 525
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Post by Zvone on Dec 6, 2007 22:35:12 GMT -5
SDP is a progressive party that functions through new ideas of social democracy in the 21st century. HSS is a conservative peasant party that is theocratic in nature and backwards in everything else.
Concerning foreign policy, is it really worth tangling in another state’s sovereign right for the greater good of Croats that don’t live in Croatia when the Croatian government can’t even fix problems in their own country? Croats get plenty of support and will get plenty of support in BiH mainly because of economic interest and the fact the countries border each other. Croats in BiH should be the ones trying to acquire more rights within BiH rather than fracturing into little political groups that stand no chance in the political arena. They should stop with the whiny bs and find a common ground behind one leader. Croatia can’t nor will intervene because only Croats in BiH can resolve their issues within it.
SDP aren't anti-Catholic they are pro-secularism. There should be, nay, must be a separation of church and state within Croatia. I believe in equality for all, justice, and religious freedom, but how can we have that if there's one church in power that dictates morality and politics? Is this fair to those who do not believe in it? Or should we just tell the pope to annex us and control us through his 'closer to god' powers? Conservatism is a notion that says society is as good as it gets; it cannot get any better. Liberalism says that society can get better and must. Croatia is far from perfect so should we try to improve its situation or just stay the course? Progress should be Croatia's top priorities and not degrees. Let's live like we are in the 21st century with freedom for all, equality, and a government run by the people for the people. After all, when have conservatives cared about the greater dispersion of wealth? How about welfare or healthcare? Check the results how good conservatives have run our country and then say to me they did a good job without lying. It is time for a change, choosing HSS will only lead to the same old issues. SDP will be different, they will give Croatia a chance to redeem itself both domestically and foreign.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 7, 2007 3:28:17 GMT -5
Then why are so many close neighbours to Croatia sticking their heads in where it doesn't fit? Don't you think it is interest of people within Croatia (naturally) and those in the diaspora (who may end up living back in the domovina) like myself to somehow rectify things for the future?
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Dec 10, 2007 12:20:58 GMT -5
^ Croatias future all depends on how good it looks in front of the world. Right now that image is very good, and it should be kept that way. Problems in the Balkans are the real test for the Croatian Government and somehow right now they are doing their balancing and keeping everything in check pretty much. Today is Dec. 10th, 2007, and today is the due or die date for Kosovo. No matter what the solution is, it is still going to test every single nation in the Balkans, and Europe, especially Croatia, since we border Serbia. Just watch as certain events unfold in the near future, and it will prove that Croatia is in a very good position right now, and will be for a long time.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 10, 2007 12:48:20 GMT -5
I can too see good things as long as money is pumped in; things are being built meaning jobs are created. I can see a modern country full of so many possibilities but there are many things we need to still weed out.
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Dec 10, 2007 15:42:26 GMT -5
^ 100% agree.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 10, 2007 19:18:45 GMT -5
Gee sounds like the role of women in society. Sorry I can be a little crud at times but it's so true...
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Dec 10, 2007 19:30:50 GMT -5
^ LOL! Sounds funny comming from a woman.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 10, 2007 20:10:54 GMT -5
Well I am not like most women, from what I have seen and my experiences in life it is what I see and hear...Yeah, you could sometimes mistaken me for a man hahahaha
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Dec 10, 2007 22:02:10 GMT -5
^ LOL! Naw, I couldn't do that. I mean, look how you defend womens rights. Hell not even the gayest of the gay men would do that. You can see that you are a woman from a mile away.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 10, 2007 23:07:52 GMT -5
Any normal woman would defend women's rights unless they were living solely off a man; then it's all mouthes shut.
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Dec 10, 2007 23:09:54 GMT -5
^ Agreed.
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Post by avenger on Dec 11, 2007 18:39:43 GMT -5
Let me correct you . First of all the US isn't entirely capitalistic in fact its more socialist under the guise of capitalism . I don't feel that I really have to ennumerate how many regulations the US government puts on free trade and how we run a protectionist trade policy .
Pure capitalism means free market and a market isn't free if its over-regulated by the government like we see in the United States . ' Social' in the political sense means big government and government regulation on people's liberties and general lives .
How does Socialism promote free market ? Socialism promotes government regulation of free enterprise . In short , socialism means CENTRAL PLANING and CENTRAL PLANING is intellectually bankrupt . Why would anyone entrust the government to run their lives ? Government can't take care of you from cradle to grave .
One of the big issues is healthcare . It said that societies without socialized healthcare pay too much .
That may be true, though no more so than any of the more socialist systems in the world perceived as "inexpensive" by those desiring similar government programs in the US. In those nations, the cost is hidden in individual tax-rates in excess of fifty percent, so the extremely high costs for care are still being paid by the patient, they just don't write the check to the doctor, they write it to the tax collector.
Think about what socialism is for a second . Redistributing wealth from one individual to another no matter how poor or rich without the concent of BOTH individuals is called THEFT .
This exists in the US as well but not under any pseudo free market we have , but rather in a system of socialism known as the federal reserve and their government cohorts .
The fix for America isn't socialism because our economy can't afford a more expanded government but rather the exact opposite a REAL FREE MARKET and a reinstatment of the liberties gurenteed to us by the constitution .
Get rid of the Federal Reserve ( AMerica's central bank). Get rid of the IRS ( The government shouldn't have to tell you how much of YOUR OWN HARD EARNED DOLLARS you keep.) Get rid of useless government run departments/programs . End the wellfare/warfare state ( End government regulations on businesses. back our currency with gold tender again . stop wasting our money on worthless projects like get out of the war in Iraq and Afganistan)
Lets have a humble foreign policy.
Lets follow our own friggin constitution for a change and we'll see that the limited government , free market society , and gurentee of liberties it gave us ACTUALLY WORK to make us THE MOST PROPERPOUS COUNTRY IN THE WORLD !
AAdmin you have a thing or two to learn about the economy if you think socialism really works .
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Dec 11, 2007 19:12:11 GMT -5
Welcome to the forum avenger, you have some good points there!
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