MiG
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Post by MiG on Jun 4, 2008 19:24:32 GMT -5
That's not actually true. It never was true. Milosevic and his goons started the war (Although it was not in the interest of the majority of the populace in Serbia, or SFRJ). That is why you are blamed. Because of your own nationalists at home, who took things to the next level, and made it bloody, and naturally, the other sides responded in the same fashion. Slavs have too much pride not to respond in the same way. You should know that by know, as you are a Slav, and our pride is more important than anything at times.
All Vietnam-Era "HEAT" (High explosive anti-tank) Weapons, have been decomissioned by the mid-1980's as they proved very ineffective (They were primitive in the stages of Incendiary 'HEAT' development). They worked alright against Soviet T-34's, but later models of the T-54/55 did nothing, hence them being decomissioned.
The United States however didn't hand out/sell these to anyone other than NATO/SK/Japan/KSA and Israel. Those are variants of Bazooka, Panzerfaust 3's, M72 LAW. What you might be thinking of in the case of VRS might be US-made RPG's. Those are abundant, same as USSR/Russian RPG's. But still, the chance of VRS getting those weapons (JNA especially in the 1980's), is slim to none. I've never heard of any US-YUG transaction where there were small arms transactions. Yugoslavia was good on its own in the Arms industry.
The AK-47's are from 1947 (Automatic Kalashnikov 1947, hence AK-47). Sure if you upkeep the guns they're very useful, but tell me how many people actually take proper care of their weapons. I'll bet you that 20% of ex-VRS soldiers have no clue where they burried their weapons.
Na podrucju Jugoslavije, nije nista ostalo od Drugog Svijetskog Rata, jer su Komunisti bili pametni, pa to procistili uz pomoc civilima, i vojnim licima.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 5, 2008 3:01:10 GMT -5
That's not actually true. It never was true. Milosevic and his goons started the war (Although it was not in the interest of the majority of the populace in Serbia, or SFRJ). That is why you are blamed. Because of your own nationalists at home, who took things to the next level, and made it bloody, and naturally, the other sides responded in the same fashion. Slavs have too much pride not to respond in the same way. You should know that by know, as you are a Slav, and our pride is more important than anything at times. Milosevic and other Serb politicians didn't start anything. Every action they did was in reaction to the actions of Slovenian, Croat, Muslim and Albanian politicians. If you are referring to the anti bureaucratic protests then that had nothing to do with ethnic rivalries. If you are referring to the speech in Kosovo then that event was triggered by Albanian police officers beating up Kosovo Serbs. Also (lest we forget) when Slovenia and Croatia declared independence, the President of Yugoslavia was a Croat. All Vietnam-Era "HEAT" (High explosive anti-tank) Weapons, have been decomissioned by the mid-1980's as they proved very ineffective (They were primitive in the stages of Incendiary 'HEAT' development). They worked alright against Soviet T-34's, but later models of the T-54/55 did nothing, hence them being decomissioned. The United States however didn't hand out/sell these to anyone other than NATO/SK/Japan/KSA and Israel. Those are variants of Bazooka, Panzerfaust 3's, M72 LAW. What you might be thinking of in the case of VRS might be US-made RPG's. Those are abundant, same as USSR/Russian RPG's. But still, the chance of VRS getting those weapons (JNA especially in the 1980's), is slim to none. I've never heard of any US-YUG transaction where there were small arms transactions. Yugoslavia was good on its own in the Arms industry. A LAW, that's what its called. I don't know how it got there but I did see it and I did touch it. Maybe it wasn't American made but I am 100% sure it was American designed. The AK-47's are from 1947 (Automatic Kalashnikov 1947, hence AK-47). Sure if you upkeep the guns they're very useful, but tell me how many people actually take proper care of their weapons. I'll bet you that 20% of ex-VRS soldiers have no clue where they burried their weapons. All the veterans from farms and villages have kept their weapons close to their dwellings. The vast majority of veterans I have met are from farms and villages. Na podrucju Jugoslavije, nije nista ostalo od Drugog Svijetskog Rata, jer su Komunisti bili pametni, pa to procistili uz pomoc civilima, i vojnim licima. They couldn't have possibly cleaned ALL of the mines.
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Jun 5, 2008 21:37:04 GMT -5
I lived through it, and saw it with my own eyes. Albanians instigated it, yes, I'll never denied it, but Milosevic could have strategized it better, instead of playing the nationalist card first. He started the chain of nationalism.
The M72 LAW is US designed, yes, but was produced in Norway. So having it in VRS usage is somewhat believable, but the chance of more than 5-10 units being in service is highly unlikely.
They did, because in the 45 years time that SFRJ did exist, there was not ONE death from a wartime landmine.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 5, 2008 23:57:18 GMT -5
I lived through it, and saw it with my own eyes. Albanians instigated it, yes, I'll never denied it, but Milosevic could have strategized it better, instead of playing the nationalist card first. He started the chain of nationalism. You saw it with your own eyes, did you? My mistake, I didn't know you were so intimate with Milosevic and the Yugoslav hierarchy. The M72 LAW is US designed, yes, but was produced in Norway. So having it in VRS usage is somewhat believable, but the chance of more than 5-10 units being in service is highly unlikely. If all else fails, RPG-7 is the answer. Though I haven't seen one, if they have LAWs then they probably have RPG-7s.
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Jun 6, 2008 0:15:11 GMT -5
I was a kid back then. And if you are picturing little kids doing s**t with older men, then you have some serious problems, ya kiddie diddler. Nice way to get out of an argument. .. Kiddie diddler. RPG-7's ehh? That is the most well know RPG in the world, and yes, VRS has had about 1200 units (All donated by the wonderful VJ - Frm.JNA). The ammunition was near depletion though by the end of 1995, and they were running low. But that's because Milosevic put an embargo across the Drina, and he did it to keep his position in FRJ. If you take a look at the position the Serbs were in, in 1991, and now, what do you see?
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 6, 2008 3:48:11 GMT -5
I was a kid back then. And if you are picturing little kids doing s**t with older men, then you have some serious problems, ya kiddie diddler. Nice way to get out of an argument. .. Kiddie diddler. You have no argument that Milosevic or Serbian authorities started anything. You claim that you saw what happened with your own eyes which could only happen if you had a close relationship with Milosevic and/or the Yugoslav hierarchy. You (like everyone else) just saw biased reporting on the television stating how people protesting against bureaucracy are Serb nationalists or that Milosevic's speech in Kosovo was anything but pan Yugoslavia. RPG-7's ehh? That is the most well know RPG in the world, and yes, VRS has had about 1200 units (All donated by the wonderful VJ - Frm.JNA). The ammunition was near depletion though by the end of 1995, and they were running low. But that's because Milosevic put an embargo across the Drina, and he did it to keep his position in FRJ. If you take a look at the position the Serbs were in, in 1991, and now, what do you see? I see that we are in a better position then in 1941.
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Jun 6, 2008 19:00:53 GMT -5
That still gives me the edge and validity in the argument that I saw it with my own eyes.
Whoever said anything about 1941? I was talking about 1992.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 6, 2008 22:25:14 GMT -5
That still gives me the edge and validity in the argument that I saw it with my own eyes. You saw what exactly? The television? Whoever said anything about 1941? I was talking about 1992. Aye but we survived 1941 and that was before we had so many weapons.
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Jun 7, 2008 17:33:46 GMT -5
That still gives me the edge and validity in the argument that I saw it with my own eyes. You saw what exactly? The television? Whoever said anything about 1941? I was talking about 1992. Aye but we survived 1941 and that was before we had so many weapons. Yes, the TV. And again I ask, who was talking about 1941?
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 7, 2008 17:58:57 GMT -5
And again I ask, who was talking about 1941? If you take a look at the position the Serbs were in, in 1991, and now, what do you see? I thought we were comparing how combat ready Serbs are. Sure we may not be in the same position we were in 1991 but we are in a much better position then we were in 1941 and in 1941 we still managed to fight off 5 proxy enemies and 2 superpowers.
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Post by theblackswans on Jun 8, 2008 20:15:51 GMT -5
And again I ask, who was talking about 1941? If you take a look at the position the Serbs were in, in 1991, and now, what do you see? I thought we were comparing how combat ready Serbs are. Sure we may not be in the same position we were in 1991 but we are in a much better position then we were in 1941 and in 1941 we still managed to fight off 5 proxy enemies and 2 superpowers. Your retardation is brought to a new level, 5 proxy enemies and two superpowers? Are you talking about Tito's partizans or your baby killer cetniks? The cetniks refused to fight head on any enemy instead attacked villages and women and children just like your modern cetniks!
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niquetamere
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Post by niquetamere on Jun 9, 2008 0:55:39 GMT -5
Bouncy Betty sounds like a cool stripper name. I think Illyria should put some clear heels on n shit and twist around for a bit.
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 9, 2008 2:08:40 GMT -5
Your retardation is brought to a new level, 5 proxy enemies and two superpowers? Are you talking about Tito's partizans or your baby killer cetniks? The cetniks refused to fight head on any enemy instead attacked villages and women and children just like your modern cetniks! Balija, STFU.
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niquetamere
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Post by niquetamere on Jun 9, 2008 2:23:31 GMT -5
Your retardation is brought to a new level, 5 proxy enemies and two superpowers? Are you talking about Tito's partizans or your baby killer cetniks? The cetniks refused to fight head on any enemy instead attacked villages and women and children just like your modern cetniks! Balija, STFU. Gypsy, calm down!
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Post by Novus Dis on Jun 9, 2008 4:08:24 GMT -5
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Jun 9, 2008 11:16:57 GMT -5
Guys quit the insults. Anyways, Deucaon, I'm not going to start an argument over what the Cetniks did in WW2 (Because Blackswans summed it up).
What I will start poking at is your inability to see that in 1991, the Serbs had all the positions of strategic superiority, and all the military equipment of JNA's 5th, 17th, and 37th Corps. They had most of the 4th Corps, but Bosniaks got 25% of that equipment (Which is not much, a couple of Mortars and Anti-Tank weapons). Give me you thoughts (And I mean serious insight) into what kind of a position the Serbs are in now.
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niquetamere
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Post by niquetamere on Jun 9, 2008 12:15:48 GMT -5
Guys quit the insults. Anyways, Deucaon, I'm not going to start an argument over what the Cetniks did in WW2 (Because Blackswans summed it up). What I will start poking at is your inability to see that in 1991, the Serbs had all the positions of strategic superiority, and all the military equipment of JNA's 5th, 17th, and 37th Corps. They had most of the 4th Corps, but Bosniaks got 25% of that equipment (Which is not much, a couple of Mortars and Anti-Tank weapons). Give me you thoughts (And I mean serious insight) into what kind of a position the Serbs are in now. Well put.
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Post by Sh1 Shonić on Jun 9, 2008 12:24:26 GMT -5
Srusit cemo dvo-entitetski ustroj BiH. Tesko onom tko Hrvata dira! Dirkam ti gacice! ;D
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Post by theblackswans on Jun 9, 2008 17:29:41 GMT -5
Guys quit the insults. Anyways, Deucaon, I'm not going to start an argument over what the Cetniks did in WW2 (Because Blackswans summed it up). What I will start poking at is your inability to see that in 1991, the Serbs had all the positions of strategic superiority, and all the military equipment of JNA's 5th, 17th, and 37th Corps. They had most of the 4th Corps, but Bosniaks got 25% of that equipment (Which is not much, a couple of Mortars and Anti-Tank weapons). Give me you thoughts (And I mean serious insight) into what kind of a position the Serbs are in now. I think he is too busy giving himself mental masturbation about what a great military leader Mladic was (even though military historians would say he was a poor leader and tactician).
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Post by zgembo on Jun 9, 2008 18:13:37 GMT -5
I thought we were comparing how combat ready Serbs are. Sure we may not be in the same position we were in 1991 but we are in a much better position then we were in 1941 and in 1941 we still managed to fight off 5 proxy enemies and 2 superpowers. Your retardation is brought to a new level, 5 proxy enemies and two superpowers? Are you talking about Tito's partizans or your baby killer cetniks? The cetniks refused to fight head on any enemy instead attacked villages and women and children just like your modern cetniks! The killing of innocent civilians in WW2 started with the Ustashe and their Muslim proxies. Everything the Chetniks did they did in revenge.
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