Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Apr 6, 2009 22:06:03 GMT -5
^^^Yes they do it, they clearly can't seperate politics and religion.
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Post by Username on Apr 6, 2009 22:32:05 GMT -5
What has Turkey ever done for Bosnia? Why all the praise?
ETA: Why not fly Albanian flags who are fellow Muslims?? (or better yet, no foreign flags at all).
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Apr 6, 2009 22:54:19 GMT -5
^ Why use any flags if they won't cheer for anyone else. Anyway, to make a long story short, they do it to stick it in the faces of the Extremist Croats or Extremist Serbs because that is all about they can do, at this point in time.
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Post by tito on Apr 6, 2009 23:17:09 GMT -5
What has Turkey ever done for Bosnia? Why all the praise? The glorious Ottomans liberated the Balkans, they saved the followers of the old Bosnian religion from the crusaders and today’s Turkish flag is originally Bosnian/Illyrian.
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Post by SKORIC on Apr 7, 2009 0:05:54 GMT -5
What has Turkey ever done for Bosnia? Why all the praise? ETA: Why not fly Albanian flags who are fellow Muslims?? (or better yet, no foreign flags at all).
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Post by Username on Apr 7, 2009 0:29:34 GMT -5
I was in Sarajevo when Croatia lost to Turkey ![:(](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/sad.png) It was terrible!... I heard the honking.. The Ottomans liberated the Balkans? WTF? I don't know much about the Ottoman Empire, but I do know that it was an EMPIRE - with the supreme power rooted within Turkey.. No one else had any power.. That is what an empire is after all. So how were the Balkans suddenly liberated? I'm sensing a sarcastic tone from you though (especially considering how you are a Serb, right?) Bosniaks are genetically and culturally closer to Croats and Serbs than to Turks. The whole fascination with Turkey is just stupid... Is Bosnia suddenly a subordinate to Turkey? Are they back under its command? That's the message that they seem to be sending.. I mean, after all, you wouldn't see any Bosnian flags in Turkey, would you? And should Croats suddenly be flying Austrian/Hungarian flags? Or Italian? Having been their territories in the past? They may be trying to aggravate Serbs and Croats by flying the Turkish flag (which is what you guys are saying, which seems odd. I would suspect another motivation that plays a bigger role), but it's just making them look bad.. Seriously.
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Post by tito on Apr 7, 2009 1:09:09 GMT -5
The Ottomans liberated the Balkans? WTF? I don't know much about the Ottoman Empire, but I do know that it was an EMPIRE - with the supreme power rooted within Turkey.. No one else had any power.. That is what an empire is after all. So how were the Balkans suddenly liberated? I'm sensing a sarcastic tone from you though (especially considering how you are a Serb, right?) LOL, no I’m not a serb, and Yes the Ottomans did liberate the Balkans, they gave the people more rights then we had before, but Balkan nationalists prefer to demonize them so I recommend that you choose books by western authors if you want to learn more about the glorious Ottomans. Bosniaks are genetically and culturally closer to Croats and Serbs than to Turks. The whole fascination with Turkey is just stupid... Don’t be silly, Serbs and Croats attempted to destroy us, that is not our culture, our culture is tolerant, we just like our Ottoman brothers don’t wish to exterminate the Serbs and Croats, we want peace in Bosnia and a multi-religious country where churches and mosques can stand side by side so please don’t insult the Bosniak people by comparing us to the intolerant aggressors who attempted to destroy Bosnia. Is Bosnia suddenly a subordinate to Turkey? Are they back under its command? That's the message that they seem to be sending.. I mean, after all, you wouldn't see any Bosnian flags in Turkey, would you? As I told you before: today’s Turkish flag is originally Bosnian/Illyrian so all the Turkish flags you see in Turkey are in fact Bosnian. And should Croats suddenly be flying Austrian/Hungarian flags? Or Italian? Having been their territories in the past? Isn’t it bad enough that they use the flag of Croatia in Bosnia? ![::)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/eyesroll.png) They may be trying to aggravate Serbs and Croats by flying the Turkish flag (which is what you guys are saying, which seems odd. I would suspect another motivation that plays a bigger role), but it's just making them look bad.. Seriously. I strongly disagree, the Turkish flags look good in Bosnia since they are originally from Bosnia.
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Post by Username on Apr 7, 2009 1:30:47 GMT -5
Your signature could have fooled me. I'm not going to claim to be an expert on the Ottoman Empire, cause I'll admit, I don't know much about it. But they gave them rights? They pretty much forced them to convert, directly or indirectly - it doesn't matter (freedom of religion, right...), and the ones who didn't, were put down.
Like it or not, genetically, you are the same as Serbs and Croats. You speak the same language. You share a similar culture; much closer than anything to do with the Turks. And it's funny that you claim to be tolerant, yet your reply is filled with hateful comments against Croats and Serbs. How about you quit your stereotypes against Croats and Serbs and realize that just like your own people, there are savages and good people in all groups? I personally would like to see a peaceful, tolerant, multi-religious Bosnia as well (I'm not picking up that tone from you however). There's nothing worse than nationalism in the Balkans. I don't care who it comes from - Bosniaks, Serbs, or Croats.. I can't stand it.
Can you provide a source? Again, I don't claim to be an expert on this either, but from the few minutes of searching I just did, I found nothing to suggest that that is in fact true.
The Croat homeland is Croatia. Makes sense to me that they may use the flag (although I think they should be waving the Bosnian flag). Much less bizarre than Bosniaks using the Turkish flag.
Again, provide a source.
ETA: and assuming that the flag does come from Bosnia, it doesn't represent Bosnia. It represents a foreign nation, and its use by nationalistic Bosniaks is for reasons other than because it's "originally from Bosnia". Give me a break.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Apr 7, 2009 1:32:31 GMT -5
What has Turkey ever done for Bosnia? Why all the praise? The glorious Ottomans liberated the Balkans, they saved the followers of the old Bosnian religion from the crusaders and today’s Turkish flag is originally Bosnian/Illyrian. Mars. Zivjela Pravoslavna Republika Srpska.
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Post by tito on Apr 7, 2009 1:45:25 GMT -5
Zivjela Pravoslavna Republika Srpska. ;D illyria.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=srpska&action=display&thread=2075310.3.2009 U okviru redovnih planskih zadataka u povodu 12. Rebiu-l-evvela –roðenja Muhammeda a.s. Ured Vojnog muftije je organizirao obilježavanje ovog znaèajnog datuma u islamskom kalendaru u Komandama i jedinicama Oružanih snaga Bosne i Hercegovine. U kasarni "Kozara" u Banja Luci u srijedu 04.marta 2009. godine, Vojni imami su realizirali prigodan mevludski program za pripadnike OS BiH sa lokacija kasarne "Kozara" i "Zalužani" u Banja Luci. Ovim povodom prisutnima su se prigodnim predavanjima obratili Glavni imam OS BiH Hadis Pašaliæ i Vojni muftija Ismail ef Smajloviæ koji je naglasio znaèaj obilježavanja Mevluda u tradiciji Bošnjaka sa posebnim naglaskom na njegovanju milosrða kao Bogom darovane vrijednosti poslaniku islama Muhammedu a.s. i njegovim sljedbenicima. Nakon mevludskog programa organizovan je zajednièki ruèak èiji je domaæin bio komandant Komande za podršku OS BiH brigadni general Mirsad Gutiæ uz prisustvo komandanta 6. Pješadijske brigade generala Stamenka Novakoviæa i drugih visokih oficira OS BiH, kao i predstavnika vjerske službe u OS BiH Štabnog kapelana don Josipa Grubišiæa i Štabnog sveštenika Dragana Grujiæa. ![](http://www.mod.gov.ba/files/image/fotogalerija/4.jpg)
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Post by tito on Apr 7, 2009 2:17:16 GMT -5
I'm not going to claim to be an expert on the Ottoman Empire, cause I'll admit, I don't know much about it. But they gave them rights? They pretty much forced them to convert, directly or indirectly - it doesn't matter (freedom of religion, right...), and the ones who didn't, were put down. Balkan nationalist myths, I mean even a person that knows nothing about the glorious Ottomans can understand that there would be no non-muslims in the Balkans after 500 years of Ottoman rule if any of the above was true. Like it or not, genetically, you are the same as Serbs and Croats. What makes you think that?? Most Bosniaks are ethnic illyirans, but again Serbian and Croatian expansionist ideology wont teach you that either, not that it really matters since we are not nazis here, I don’t look down at the Slavic race even if they came as intruders to the Balkans. You speak the same language. You share a similar culture; It is true that they have stolen our Bosnian language, but I still consider it kind of insulting that you would suggest that Bosniak culture is somehow similar to the so called culture of the aggressors who attempted to destroy Bosnia and the Bosniak people. And it's funny that you claim to be tolerant, yet your reply is filled with hateful comments against Croats and Serbs. How about you quit your stereotypes against Croats and Serbs and realize that just like your own people, there are savages and good people in all groups? Well obviously they are much more savages compared to the tolerant Bosniaks, I didn’t mean to insult anyone but it is a historical fact that they keep proving over and over again. Although I must say that the Croatians have improved a lot in the last 15 years thanks to EU and NATO. I personally would like to see a peaceful, tolerant, multi-religious Bosnia as well (I'm not picking up that tone from you however). There's nothing worse than nationalism in the Balkans. I don't care who it comes from - Bosniaks, Serbs, or Croats.. I can't stand it. I’m glad that we seem to agree on the final goal even if we have some disagreements on historical facts(again only thanks to Balkan nationalism that has a tendency to manipulate history). Can you provide a source? Again, I don't claim to be an expert on this either, but from the few minutes of searching I just did, I found nothing to suggest that that is in fact true. There is a topic about it here at the forum, I will try to find it for you. The Croat homeland is Croatia. Makes sense to me that they may use the flag (although I think they should be waving the Bosnian flag). Much less bizarre than Bosniaks using the Turkish flag. Unless you know that the Turkish flag was originally from Bosnia and that the so called Croats in BiH are ethnic Bosniaks(but again Balkan nationalism obviously made us have different perspectives on that issue as well). and assuming that the flag does come from Bosnia, it doesn't represent Bosnia. It represents a foreign nation, and its use by nationalistic Bosniaks is for reasons other than because it's "originally from Bosnia". Give me a break. You are probably right on that one, then again even if those supporters don’t know that the flag is originally Bosnian they still know that it was Ottoman before it became Turkish.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Apr 7, 2009 2:25:47 GMT -5
YOU ABSOLUTE FUCKING DELUDED PSYCHOPATH. I HAVE NEVER READ A BIGGER BUNCH OF GARBAGE. EVERY POINT JUST DEMONSTRATES THE ABSOLUTE RIDICULOUS LOGIC OF THE BOSNIAK EXISTENCE.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Apr 7, 2009 2:27:22 GMT -5
I'm not going to claim to be an expert on the Ottoman Empire, cause I'll admit, I don't know much about it. But they gave them rights? They pretty much forced them to convert, directly or indirectly - it doesn't matter (freedom of religion, right...), and the ones who didn't, were put down. Balkan nationalist myths, I mean even a person that knows nothing about the glorious Ottomans can understand that there would be no non-muslims in the Balkans after 500 years of Ottoman rule if any of the above was true. What makes you think that?? Most Bosniaks are ethnic illyirans, but again Serbian and Croatian expansionist ideology wont teach you that either, not that it really matters since we are not nazis here, I don’t look down at the Slavic race even if they came as intruders to the Balkans. It is true that they have stolen our Bosnian language, but I still consider it kind of insulting that you would suggest that Bosniak culture is somehow similar to the so called culture of the aggressors who attempted to destroy Bosnia and the Bosniak people. Well obviously they are much more savages compared to the tolerant Bosniaks, I didn’t mean to insult anyone but it is a historical fact that they keep proving over and over again. Although I must say that the Croatians have improved a lot in the last 15 years thanks to EU and NATO. I’m glad that we seem to agree on the final goal even if we have some disagreements on historical facts(again only thanks to Balkan nationalism that has a tendency to manipulate history). There is a topic about it here at the forum, I will try to find it for you. Unless you know that the Turkish flag was originally from Bosnia and that the so called Croats in BiH are ethnic Bosniaks(but again Balkan nationalism obviously made us have different perspectives on that issue as well). and assuming that the flag does come from Bosnia, it doesn't represent Bosnia. It represents a foreign nation, and its use by nationalistic Bosniaks is for reasons other than because it's "originally from Bosnia". Give me a break. You are probably right on that one, then again even if those supporters don’t know that the flag is originally Bosnian they still know that it was Ottoman before it became Turkish. I just had to quote this for posterity.
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Post by tito on Apr 7, 2009 2:34:00 GMT -5
YOU ABSOLUTE f**kING DELUDED PSYCHOPATH. I HAVE NEVER READ A BIGGER BUNCH OF GARBAGE. EVERY POINT JUST DEMONSTRATES THE ABSOLUTE RIDICULOUS LOGIC OF THE BOSNIAK EXISTENCE. ;D Calm down with some sevdah:
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Apr 7, 2009 2:58:08 GMT -5
YOU ABSOLUTE f**kING DELUDED PSYCHOPATH. I HAVE NEVER READ A BIGGER BUNCH OF GARBAGE. EVERY POINT JUST DEMONSTRATES THE ABSOLUTE RIDICULOUS LOGIC OF THE BOSNIAK EXISTENCE. Dude, don't get so worked up over fairy tales. It's good to have someone spice up this forum with imaginary history. Didn't you know? Bosniaks aren't Turks, but Turks are Bosniaks. It's just a matter of time before someone spots it. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) (Someone like Tito)
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Post by Username on Apr 7, 2009 21:03:41 GMT -5
I'm not going to claim to be an expert on the Ottoman Empire, cause I'll admit, I don't know much about it. But they gave them rights? They pretty much forced them to convert, directly or indirectly - it doesn't matter (freedom of religion, right...), and the ones who didn't, were put down. Balkan nationalist myths, I mean even a person that knows nothing about the glorious Ottomans can understand that there would be no non-muslims in the Balkans after 500 years of Ottoman rule if any of the above was true. What makes you think that?? Most Bosniaks are ethnic illyirans, but again Serbian and Croatian expansionist ideology wont teach you that either, not that it really matters since we are not nazis here, I don’t look down at the Slavic race even if they came as intruders to the Balkans. It is true that they have stolen our Bosnian language, but I still consider it kind of insulting that you would suggest that Bosniak culture is somehow similar to the so called culture of the aggressors who attempted to destroy Bosnia and the Bosniak people. Well obviously they are much more savages compared to the tolerant Bosniaks, I didn’t mean to insult anyone but it is a historical fact that they keep proving over and over again. Although I must say that the Croatians have improved a lot in the last 15 years thanks to EU and NATO. I’m glad that we seem to agree on the final goal even if we have some disagreements on historical facts(again only thanks to Balkan nationalism that has a tendency to manipulate history). There is a topic about it here at the forum, I will try to find it for you. Unless you know that the Turkish flag was originally from Bosnia and that the so called Croats in BiH are ethnic Bosniaks(but again Balkan nationalism obviously made us have different perspectives on that issue as well). and assuming that the flag does come from Bosnia, it doesn't represent Bosnia. It represents a foreign nation, and its use by nationalistic Bosniaks is for reasons other than because it's "originally from Bosnia". Give me a break. You are probably right on that one, then again even if those supporters don’t know that the flag is originally Bosnian they still know that it was Ottoman before it became Turkish. Well I'm not going to bother arguing your points (as someone already stated, they are kind of laughable).. but.. ever consider that you are the victim of Balkan nationalistic myths/propaganda and not me?
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Post by tito on Apr 8, 2009 1:41:27 GMT -5
Well I'm not going to bother arguing your points (as someone already stated, they are kind of laughable).. but.. ever consider that you are the victim of Balkan nationalistic myths/propaganda and not me?
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Post by Unleashed on Apr 8, 2009 14:17:15 GMT -5
Many of the people I know in BiH really don't care about the national team there. Why should they? Croat and Serb players only play for BiH when they can't make it on the Croatia or Serbia national team. Its profit motive. They can get recognized for playing on the world stage and hopefully get an offer to play for some well established foreign club.
Croats from BiH display much more pride playing for Croatia than any Croat on the Bosnian team. Blazevic is getting washed up but still wants to compete internationally. He's improved the Bosnian team but he will definitely be cheering for Croatia if it comes down to a match with BiH. It's quite funny actually. Bosnia's coach would be rooting more for the opponent.
Croatia plays tough when a tournament is on the line. They will obliterate Bosnia if it came down to it.
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MiG
Amicus
Republika
Posts: 4,793
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Post by MiG on Apr 8, 2009 14:21:17 GMT -5
^ That's true.
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Post by Unleashed on Apr 8, 2009 14:30:37 GMT -5
tito's Turkey worship is unusual as well. He is definitely a minority among his kind. To me it seems reactionary to the bond BiH Croats and BiH Serbs have with Croatia and Serbia respectively. In my experience if I tried to tell a Bosniak he was Turk or had some kind of close bond with Turks he would get angry. Many Bosniaks still consider themselves White Europeans and revile the thought of being closely tied to Asiatic Turks.
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