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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 23, 2008 20:35:56 GMT -5
^ so their lanuage evolved hiding up the mountains, and when it did they came back down and reclaimed lost lands?
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 23, 2008 20:41:10 GMT -5
"In fact we do not know what was Illyrian (centum or satem). Plus, an evolution from centum to satem is possible."
C'mon man, its like saying that swedish can evolve into urdu.
The slavs named all the rivers, mountains, valleys etc...and not to mention they gave their blood also.
Do u know about Jovan Vladimir....there is even a church named after him in Albania, l believe.
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Post by meltdown711 on Sept 23, 2008 21:06:34 GMT -5
That wouldnt be the first time. And it probably happened in the beginning of the 11th century. Albanians seem to have moved first from the mountains of southern-North Albania, from the area of Kruja. Not long afterwards Shkoder had to constantly be protected from the attacks of people living on the outside of the city and not too long afterwards deep within it: Albanians.
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Post by ILIRI I MADH on Sept 24, 2008 2:29:41 GMT -5
Illyrian is centum while Thracian and Albanian are Satem. Either way though, the area where the Albanian language formed was most likely a zone between the two. South Serbia for instance was a mixed Illyrian/Thracian zone and most likely Albanian developed in that area. There is NO evidence of ANY illyrian language ever recorded, so who is this genius that says that illyrian is centum or other bullcrap like that!
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 24, 2008 18:29:40 GMT -5
^ then how do we know Albanians are directly decended from the illyrians?
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Post by meltdown711 on Sept 25, 2008 1:37:47 GMT -5
Because there is no evidence that says Albanians are anything otherwise. A people dont just appear magically in a region. What is recorded can easily be a mere chance of manuscript survival. What is certain is that the Byzantines were far more interested in what was moving in the Balkans then what wasnt moving.
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Post by PrijesDardanian on Sept 25, 2008 11:36:12 GMT -5
^ then how do we know Albanians are directly decended from the illyrians? Albanians mentioned as Illyrian tribes from ancient greek historians ,Culturally, Traditions,,Tomponimes, Anthropology, Etnography ect? is not enough?
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Demonel
Amicus
I am Jack's regained insanity.
Posts: 833
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Post by Demonel on Sept 25, 2008 12:43:23 GMT -5
Illyrians are not native to the Balkans.
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Post by srbobran on Sept 25, 2008 18:02:14 GMT -5
Damn straight brotha!
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 25, 2008 22:10:51 GMT -5
"Illyrians are not native to the Balkans."
Well, as far as l know, Bosnians are the illyrians according to genetics.
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Post by benzino on Sept 26, 2008 5:57:56 GMT -5
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 26, 2008 7:00:10 GMT -5
^ Well l've seen charts, figures and the like which have the Croats and Bosnians with the highest percentage of the illyrian gene, however its the opposite for the Albanians.
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Post by shkodrani on Sept 26, 2008 8:27:46 GMT -5
^ Well l've seen charts, figures and the like which have the Croats and Bosnians with the highest percentage of the illyrian gene, however its the opposite for the Albanians. Be kind and enlighten us on your newly discovered "illyrian gene" I don't know why you even bother with them, theyll never accept that albs are illyrians simply beacause it dosent fit their political agenda.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 26, 2008 9:07:13 GMT -5
^ sorry mate, but illyrianism is used by Albanians to reach their aspirations onto neighbouring states.
Wilkes:
"On the other hand, it is hoped that the unfortunate distortions which have marred outstanding progress in Albanian Archaeology will soon be corrected. As new guidebooks are demonstrating, the Albanian culture, as fascinating and varied as any in that quarter of Europe, is an inheritance from several languages, religions and ethnic groups known to have inhabited the region since prehistoric times, among whom were the Illyrians."
&
Ardian Vebiu:
Onomastics is of no great help in settling linguistic and ethnogenetic issues. Let's have a look at some important place names in Albanian territories, like Dajti, Shkodra, Durresi, Vlora, Burreli, Drini, Shkumbini, Tirana, etc. Are they Albanian? We can't say that, for there are no Albanian words that would explain them (as we explain, for example, Kruja with "krue" - fountain).
This might well be true, but seems pathetic in front of the fact that we can't explain through Albanian words the place names we currently use, let alone the Illyrian ones. So what?
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Post by shkodrani on Sept 26, 2008 9:29:04 GMT -5
Ardian Vebiu: Onomastics is of no great help in settling linguistic and ethnogenetic issues. Let's have a look at some important place names in Albanian territories, like Dajti, Shkodra, Durresi, Vlora, Burreli, Drini, Shkumbini, Tirana, etc. Are they Albanian? We can't say that, for there are no Albanian words that would explain them (as we explain, for example, Kruja with "krue" - fountain). This might well be true, but seems pathetic in front of the fact that we can't explain through Albanian words the place names we currently use, let alone the Illyrian ones. So what? First off don't call me mate cuz i'm not your mate, I don't mate with males go to the greek forum if youre looking for a mate Dajti - Very alb. sounding Durres - from lat. Dyrrhachium Vlora - from lat. Avalona Burrel - Burr (man) + suffix -el Shkodra - Shko-Dri(ni) (Where the drin goes) Also note some albanians don't call people from shkoder Shkodran but ShkoDRIan Drin - Is beleived to be illyrian for river Shkumbin - Definatly Alb. Shko (go) mbi (over) Tirana ?? I want year was Tirana founded ?? Next will you ask for the ethymology of Elbasan !
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 27, 2008 20:14:49 GMT -5
"First off don't call me mate cuz i'm not your mate, I don't mate with males go to the greek forum if youre looking for a mate"
I don't give a rats, buddy.
Do these cities or towns for example sound Albanian:
Malibarde, Podgradec or ljubonje?
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Post by malsor4life on Sept 28, 2008 0:19:04 GMT -5
mali barde=white mountain mali zi=monte negro LoL
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Post by Novi Pazar on Sept 28, 2008 2:14:49 GMT -5
^ what about the other two?
Btw Malibarde is the Albaniansed serbian name for malibrdo (small hill), its similar to golo brdo (bare hill).
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Post by meltdown711 on Sept 28, 2008 2:25:44 GMT -5
Malibardh means white mountain in Albanian. Since various parts of south Albania are flat land, Slavs, particularly Bulgars in the area of Pogradec, settled along with Serbs in the region of Epirus. Albanians took control over these territories in the 14th century and started sending the Slavs packing. Unfortunately we have not been as smart as Greeks and have yet to fully erase all the Slavic placenames in the area like they did to their own regions. This change will occur, in due time.
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Post by meltdown711 on Sept 28, 2008 2:31:47 GMT -5
Btw its interesting that you quoted Wilkes Novi, do you have the book?He actually goes on to use the Albanian language to explain various Illyrian toponyms. And Ardian Vehbiu is not a linguicist nor an "Illyrianologist", he is a piblicist who does occasional articles for an Italian-Albanian newspaper. He has absolutely no creds on this issue so I dont see why your quoting him.
Oh, I know why, because Highduke -- in his firm belief that anything written by a person of a certain ethnicity who writes against that ethnicity must be right since he must truly be "objective" -- has misquoted him. Even Vehbiu, further in that very same article negates what he says by continually stating that Albanian are most probably descendants of these people.
But the lesson we should all learn from this is: Novi is a tard and doesnt have a clue regarding this topic, he just regurgitates everything he reads from Highduke...
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