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Post by chalkedon on Oct 6, 2009 9:20:05 GMT -5
If karamanlis cared so much...he should of sacked his whole govt.
Pes mou me pious kaneis parea na se po pios eisai...
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Post by chalkedon on Oct 6, 2009 9:25:29 GMT -5
If you think having a multi-party govt in parliament with a bunch of small parties is the solution then you really are out of you element. In Greece, that would never work....you would have one person pointing the finger at the other and for sure nothing would ever get done.
Look at Italy for example...they have a multi party govt for years and nothing ever changes over there.
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Post by Kastorianos on Oct 6, 2009 11:25:15 GMT -5
lol thats not fair...and not right either. If Karamanlis didnt care he would have never declared snap elections...there was no organizational reason for that...he still had his majority in the parliament...and easily could govern till March 2010. The Pasok would have never done that...never...they would make use of the situation in order to steal whatever is still possible until the next elections. Let alone the fact that pasok wanted to overthrow the government by not electing the president who is a member of their party...means they do even not respect the constitution considering power. Thats who you elected...just to let you know... You say the model of a coalition doesnt work? Believe me it works...if they have no other choice. Besides...there are other coalitions possible, too...not only Nea Dimokratia-pasok. Psifisate pasok...ore ti skato echete na fateee...kouradara...kai poli kala tha pathete...malaka ellina.
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Post by chalkedon on Oct 6, 2009 11:35:02 GMT -5
i agree with you on one point only...karamanlis could've stayed in power until 2010 had he not call snap elections. I can only speculate that maybe he got so fed up with the morons in his govt that he decided to call it quits. Political Suicide if you will..... On the other hand, he may have just gambled and lost. A number of ppl in ND have been critisized for recommending the elections. For other ppl like Bakogiannis...it will work out well. A coalition of small parties will not work in Greece. It has never worked in the past and it wont work now. One time i tried to vote for a small party and I found out they were skopian lovers Den to ksana kano afto me tipota.... besides who else is left ? Papathamelis ? LOL ! yeah right....how about KKE ? A bunch of ppl that still believe in communism. Syriza ? A young guy that doesnt know what the hell hes talking about... So you see....its much like in america. Democrats or Republicans and Pasok or ND. simple.....
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Post by Kassandros on Oct 6, 2009 12:49:19 GMT -5
I really expected something from Karamanlis. He disappointed me, and his party was disasterous for the country... And no other party can do anything more bad for the country... Papandreou(my covillager... ;D) has a different mentality of public life... and I hope the suspicious Pasokoi who are ready to grap ministries would leave him with out scandals, and let him govern... This what Karamanlis asked...two years of freezing of the economy in the name of the crisis was very anti- economic. Freezing is never a solution for economy, hope in the other hand makes economy grow. I Kastoria kratise... ;D ;D Ntropi gia tin Thessaloniki re gamoto. 20 xronia me Pasok, kai den egine oute ena ergo esto syntirisis re pousti... kai me ND.. metro, egnatia odos, to metopo tis paralias, neo deimarheio etc etc etc.. .kai psifisane Pasok! Kala na pathoume sto mellon...
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Post by Kassandros on Oct 6, 2009 13:06:11 GMT -5
George just started; 1st day as PM... and abolishment of "Ministry of Macedonia & Thrace". It changes name to "ÃåíéêÞ Ãñáììáôåßá Ìáêåäïíßáò - ÈñÜêçò" under! "õðïõñãåßï Åóùôåñéêþí". taxalia.blogspot.com/2009/10/blog-post_656.html Welcome! Americans are in a hurry.... and their representative in Greece couldnt wait a day..!
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Post by Red Brigade on Oct 6, 2009 13:12:28 GMT -5
This is not about "caring" for Greece. I know a 90 year old woman who cares a lot for Greece but she is incapable of doing anything else. This is about having the mechanism to run the country. Not empty rhetorics. PS I accidentally modified your post when I was trying to quote you.
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Post by Red Brigade on Oct 6, 2009 13:17:13 GMT -5
Kastorianos, I totally agree with your last post. It seems Greece is stuck on the two names that has run their governments for decades. And I agree about Karamanlis. I believe he was the one that really cared for Greece in a very long time. The problem he had was guilt through association, that is his people being involved in those scandals lately. I do not really know why he called for the snap elections. He said he called a snap election because PASOK would either way go for elections on February and the country couldn't afford to be in an election process for the next 6 months. This is the official explanation. The real explanation is that the economy was in very bad shape. Karamanlis must have believed that the margin wouldn't be so big, so he went for election now to lose it. Then until February, he thought that PASOK would have been discredited because the economy would be in a very bad shape and he would have better chances to get re-elected then. But he didn't believe that the difference would be 10.5%. Nobody could believe it.
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 6, 2009 13:32:42 GMT -5
Well, being a pasokos from green Achaia, and partly from the more green Kalentzi... ... i really liked Karamanlis, and I expected things from him till the last day. But he was disappointing...maybe the people he gathered around him were disasterous but even in this way Kostakis was responsible for his choises... Yorgakis... is another kind of politician, nothing like his father and generally the politicians of 80's and 90's... with all that fanatism they showed, thing that passed to all of us...you know green and blue kafeneia... trampoukoi...xylo ktl ktl something like that.. video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5134104464293203492&ei=NIfLSunhFYbq2gLV8Ky-BQ&hl=en# ( 1:36:26) ( ;D)... Andreas despite the whole sicκ phainomena that were risen under his governing, he made Greece a country that hoped for much better days(that really came after all) and we had many social gains and none can deny it.(E.S.Y., rise of the income, abolition of the Horofylaki, hard stance in the national matters...you know...Piri Reis- Hora/Sismik...generally Turks didn't fly over ...Andros..., good relations with the Arabs(especially Palestinians), thing that turned into a possitive gain today even if then he was accused talking with terrorists...etc etc. People are much more mature politically and find almost funny to plakothoun for the two parties... and please don't portrat right wing as the defenders of patriotism... historically Royalists and Junta were the most disasterous political groups in Greece...and when I say disasterous I mean cleary the Mikrasiatiki Katastrophi and the lose of northern Cyprus, a real betrayal by the guys that made parades in Kallimarmaron with chlamydes.... If 45% of the Greek population is antipatriotic then we must all fall to Kaiada...
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 6, 2009 13:38:51 GMT -5
George just started; 1st day as PM... and abolishment of "Ministry of Macedonia & Thrace". It changes name to "ÃåíéêÞ Ãñáììáôåßá Ìáêåäïíßáò - ÈñÜêçò" under! "õðïõñãåßï Åóùôåñéêþí". taxalia.blogspot.com/2009/10/blog-post_656.html Welcome! Americans are in a hurry.... and their representative in Greece couldnt wait a day..! Why not having a Ministry of Moria and Roumeli...or Crete and Myconos...etc etc.... I never understood this ministry's role... And i've read that two yphipourgeia will have the responsibilities of this ministry both based in Thessalonice. Btw 4 of the 7 vouleutes of Thessalonike ypourgopoiountai... in the rest 3 are icluded Yorgakis himself.... Arapoglou(future mayor) and Eva Kaili( ;D).. And from the 300.000 people Achaia, only one yphipourgos... Katsifaras...
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 6, 2009 13:40:45 GMT -5
Kastor,you're a young guy why all the passion in this? Now it's pasok..in 4 years it will be ND... or whatever..to me they are all the same. I was in Greece when the colonels were running in 73... I have seen the mess then.... I am grateful we don't have that anymore... Is your dad as passionate as you? Kastor is like he is in 80's... ;D ;D
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Post by Red Brigade on Oct 6, 2009 13:42:17 GMT -5
I like Andreas Papandreou as well. The 80's were interesting times, Koutsogiorgas, Laliotis haha.
Andreas Papandreou wanted national independence and social justice and PASOK was a patriotic party. The problem though is that after the collapse of the Soviet Union, USA became the only superpower. As a result of that Greece was not able to black-male the Americans and the Europeans for money and political support. That's the reason why PASOK changed, especially after the Imia crisis. It was forced to change because of the new political reality.
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 6, 2009 13:52:48 GMT -5
Andreas brought hope in Greece, and the civil war complexes in both extreme groups were almost disappeared. And only for this he is memorable...
For sure he was a Leader that inspired Greeks...we all liked Andriko...
Unbelievable!!!!!
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Post by Red Brigade on Oct 6, 2009 14:03:43 GMT -5
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 6, 2009 14:14:55 GMT -5
This is what " retor" means: Beautiful use of the language...! And of course Andreas had the physiognomy...like geroKaramanlis...
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Post by Kastorianos on Oct 6, 2009 15:34:12 GMT -5
E. pesta.
Sowara? A-ne-ta tha mporouse na perimenei tis arches tis epomenis chronias...den to'kane omos...
Thats not the real explanation...thats the leftist's explanation. Karamanlis said already that also in case he wouldnt win the elections that his party wouldnt deselect Papoulias. Besides...as if anyone could think a new elected party would lose all of its popularity within 6 months...as if Karamanlis would be so "koutoponiros". You dont believe that yourself...
afou eisai kritikos...oloi ekei kato etsi eiste...koukouromialoi...
Guys please spare us clips of this betrayer Papandreou. The man deserved to be hung...not to adore him.
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 6, 2009 15:45:51 GMT -5
Kostakis have said that Andreas was an idol-paradeigma for him...who is the betrayer...?
Come on Kastor, you can' t be so fanatic in that age...
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Post by Kastorianos on Oct 6, 2009 15:46:41 GMT -5
Well, being a pasokos from green Achaia, and partly from the more green Kalentzi... ... i really liked Karamanlis, and I expected things from him till the last day. But he was disappointing...maybe the people he gathered around him were disasterous but even in this way Kostakis was responsible for his choises... Yorgakis... is another kind of politician, nothing like his father and generally the politicians of 80's and 90's... with all that fanatism they showed, thing that passed to all of us...you know green and blue kafeneia... trampoukoi...xylo ktl ktl something like that.. video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5134104464293203492&ei=NIfLSunhFYbq2gLV8Ky-BQ&hl=en# ( 1:36:26) ( ;D)... Andreas despite the whole sicκ phainomena that were risen under his governing, he made Greece a country that hoped for much better days(that really came after all) and we had many social gains and none can deny it.(E.S.Y., rise of the income, abolition of the Horofylaki, hard stance in the national matters...you know...Piri Reis- Hora/Sismik...generally Turks didn't fly over ...Andros..., good relations with the Arabs(especially Palestinians), thing that turned into a possitive gain today even if then he was accused talking with terrorists...etc etc. People are much more mature politically and find almost funny to plakothoun for the two parties... and please don't portrat right wing as the defenders of patriotism... historically Royalists and Junta were the most disasterous political groups in Greece...and when I say disasterous I mean cleary the Mikrasiatiki Katastrophi and the lose of northern Cyprus, a real betrayal by the guys that made parades in Kallimarmaron with chlamydes.... If 45% of the Greek population is antipatriotic then we must all fall to Kaiada... lol when did better days come under Papandreou? Are you serious? Papandreou did waste a lot of money...and this was money from the EU...billions of money. Under whose government did the Drachma lose all of its value? According to the money he got from the EU...ta paketa ton paketon!!!...Papandreou did nothing. He could govern the easy years...me ksena koliwa ekane mnimosina...and still he ruined Greece. As for the Asia Minor catastrophy...you are forgetting Venizelos' responsibility here. He was by far the most hated politician among Asia Minor Greeks...every wondered why? Nevertheless I dont blame Venizelos. We tried and lost. Cyprus is another story...the enosis movement was necessary and good. I fully support it and still would support it. Here the same: We tried and lost.
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Post by Kastorianos on Oct 6, 2009 15:49:38 GMT -5
Kostakis have said that Andreas was an idol-paradeigma for him...who is the betrayer...? Come on Kastor, you can' t be so fanatic in that age... Im not fanatic. Im just against hypocrites. Papandreou Andreas was the greatest ever. He was a devil on earth in fact. When did Karamanlis say that Andreas the betrayer is a paradigm?
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 6, 2009 15:58:50 GMT -5
^ Kastor you can't compare the quality of life that one Greek family had in 1980 and in 2000... i mera me ti nihta...
But the phainomena neoploutismou were, of course, unavoidable...we still have as people.
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