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Post by vinjak on Dec 7, 2009 22:26:06 GMT -5
whatever makes Serbia weaker is in the interest of peace in the Balkans and that includes an independent Kosova and even Vojvodina:
Nah keeping your kind weak (which is proving easy as your lies get easily exposed plus your fighting amongst yourselves ) and eradicating the Wahhabi movement from Europe is in the interests of peace in the Balkans. Forget Vojvodina that is now sorted once and for all. Oh and I forgot to mention the trade ban has now been lifted...stings doesnt it.
DKHED
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Post by irrational on Dec 8, 2009 8:16:17 GMT -5
Albania's king had a saying that I very much love: Atdheu mbi te Gjith! "Fatherland Above All". My interests are squarely with my people and I personally neither deny nor hide the fact that I am a hypocrite in that regard. Personally, I could not care less about Bosnia and if the situation in my territory can be fixed by the destruction of another territory... then... so be it. My people and land above all others. And how am I a hypocrite? I support self-determination among all peoples. If Serbs want to separate in RS... then I dont see why they should be forced to stay in a nation that clearly is not working out. My view is that people should choose for themselves. Lol, and that's why I look down on a lot of people from the Balkans.. you're all crazy, close minded, and selfish nationalists. Brainwashed completely. Pathetic. You don't support self-determination.. you only support it when it comes to gains for Albanians only. There's a sizable Greek minority in Albania.. do you support their self determination? It's called politics. If Bosnia recognized Kosova, less people would agree with his mindset, but they can't due to their own problems with RS. Again its politics...........
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Post by insomniac on Dec 9, 2009 2:49:06 GMT -5
Albania's king had a saying that I very much love: Atdheu mbi te Gjith! "Fatherland Above All". My interests are squarely with my people and I personally neither deny nor hide the fact that I am a hypocrite in that regard. Personally, I could not care less about Bosnia and if the situation in my territory can be fixed by the destruction of another territory... then... so be it. My people and land above all others. And how am I a hypocrite? I support self-determination among all peoples. If Serbs want to separate in RS... then I dont see why they should be forced to stay in a nation that clearly is not working out. My view is that people should choose for themselves. Actually the moral thing would be for Serbia to loose RS and Kosovo gain independence. Maybe later unite with Albania. Serbs dont deserve their own state in Bosnia. Not after what they did to the Bosniaks. And Bosniaks have not even been treating them bad. What basis can they seperate there. So yeah that would make you a hypocrite, selfish and opportunist. But at least you admit it. However, you are just like me. I could not care less about Bosnia and if the situation in my territory can be fixed by the destruction of another territory. I wouldn't hesitate to support it, aswell. Even if it's not right. But that's a double edged sword. Do we want our enemies to be stronger? Unless there is a pact signed which guarantees long-term peace. By supporting destruction of Bosnia, we are in essence supporting the growth of our enemies.
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Post by todhrimencuri on Dec 9, 2009 3:09:32 GMT -5
Well... once Kosovo is settled I dont see a reason for Albs and Serbs to be enemies any longer. They are our immediate northern neighbors. If the illfeeling can be removed... then I think the moderate sides will grow more and more and then we can have a stable northern region and move finally into trying to fix relations once and for all.
Either through this, or, admittedly, significant autonomy for the northern Serb populated region of Kosova (which, though I dont like, is already a reality), or perhaps in the bleakest scenario, outright secession for some given territory.
Anyone with even a shred of evidence realizes that politics is not a game of emotions and sorrows or sympathies... it is a hard game of realpolitik.
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Post by insomniac on Dec 9, 2009 3:24:01 GMT -5
Kosovo is done and settled. What you see today is only Serbs haven't come to terms yet. Which is a matter of time, and if never who gives a chit? I think doing some negotiated immoral deal can really harm us in the future. It was only 10 years ago when 800 000 refuggees had to be accomodated in tents. And you want to "settle deals" with Serbs by harming a third party(Bosnia in this case).
The message you are sending is "we got something, so let's give them something". No man, that's wrong. We won Kosovo fair and square. If Serbs haven't come to terms with it yet, tough luck. If they want to speak on equal terms maybe they should try a taste of their own medicine. Heck, I would even argue for another bombing. This time more effective and not a half-assed job like NATO did last time.
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Post by chalkedon on Dec 9, 2009 8:42:29 GMT -5
havnt read all the pages. but i just dont understand why ppl are trying to keep Bosnia together. Just split already and set the balkans straight. Stupid anglo-saxon nation building tendencies. Bosnia, Fyrom, Kosovo all western orchestrated projects doomed to failure.
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Post by todhrimencuri on Dec 9, 2009 11:31:09 GMT -5
I certainly give a chit if a significant Balkan regional player and northern neighbor remains hostile towards my country. Whether or not Serbia can do anything doesnt matter, it is still best to resolve problems rather than letting them linger. As of now people in that country feel that they were cheated and although I disagree, it is still better in my eyes to ease the anger than inflame it or ignore. Times change. We won Kosovo with successful foreign involvement... it can be lost the same way. Better safe than sorry, however unlikely.
Plus I think if tensions die down we can also focus more intently on important social economic issues.
Im saying that if Bosnia's partition strengthens Kosovo, then I support it. Nothing wrong with promoting your own interests. Politics is politics and in the end friendships and sympathies count for little.
The 90s are long gone.
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Post by insomniac on Dec 9, 2009 13:29:54 GMT -5
^ And I'm saying don't loose your backbone. Otherwise other countries wont take you serious anymore.
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Post by vinjak on Dec 9, 2009 15:47:13 GMT -5
Anyone with even a shred of evidence realizes that politics is not a game of emotions and sorrows or sympathies... it is a hard game of realpolitik.
100%
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Post by vinjak on Dec 9, 2009 15:52:59 GMT -5
And I'm saying don't loose your backbone. Otherwise other countries wont take you serious anymore.
Actualy by harping back to the 90's and constantly whining is where "countries wont take you seriously anymore" For evidence of that just look at the leadership of the Muslim gov constantly trying to undermine RS and pulling the sympathy card while letting the economy etc slip...has had the effect of your quote "Countries wont take you seriously anymore"
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aayy
Amicus
Posts: 469
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Post by aayy on Dec 17, 2009 12:50:07 GMT -5
I remember someone's proposal for Balkan stability - Kosovo division - up to 15-25% to Serbia and the rest - to Albanians with the opportunity to join Albania if they want
and
separation of RS with some loss of territory.
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aayy
Amicus
Posts: 469
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Post by aayy on Dec 18, 2009 12:41:21 GMT -5
chalkedon,
IMHO it's difficult for the Anglo-Saxons to admit they were wrong and fought for the wrong idea.
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