aayy
Amicus
Posts: 469
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Post by aayy on Feb 18, 2010 11:09:33 GMT -5
like Korea, Chine, etc., inspite of long history of partnership with the west?
Does it have anything to do with religion, culture and traditions?
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Post by thracian08 on Feb 18, 2010 15:14:38 GMT -5
Japan is a successful country but it was an extremely closed country - it's not the culture, religion, or tradition related.
China is not a good comparison b/c of their population advantage. They produce everything cheaply and have the biggest labor force.
Turkey is a tiger, but internal politics, avoided it from becoming like Korea for example.
But Turkey is in the G20 as it's the 15th largest economy, and will be the 10th largest by 2020.
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yeni
Moderator
gulash freak
Posts: 327
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Post by yeni on Feb 18, 2010 23:19:25 GMT -5
i agree Turkey is doing quite well at least that was my impression from my visits, i saw rapid development. the weak coalition governments were not good for stability in the past and it also increased corruption. They will have to invest more in the infrastructure especially in the eastern part of the country though. i was always wondering why doesn't have Turkey more raillines for example.. but Turks are hard working, enterprising, have big labour force and more and more professional ppl so they certainly have the potential to become a rich developed country in the future.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Feb 19, 2010 4:03:49 GMT -5
like Korea, Chine, etc., inspite of long history of partnership with the west? Does it have anything to do with religion, culture and traditions? China has always been a tiger if you review the history of the world. So, when China is powerful, there is no other tiger around like Korea or Japan. Turkey is doing ok. It is not a tiger, but it is best to be a wild cat rather than a paper tiger after all.
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Feb 19, 2010 5:53:31 GMT -5
But Turkey is in the G20 as it's the 15th largest economy, and will be the 10th largest by 2020. whats the point if the vast majority of its people live like gypsies...?? Thats good more for the generals...
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Feb 19, 2010 7:01:11 GMT -5
But Turkey is in the G20 as it's the 15th largest economy, and will be the 10th largest by 2020. whats the point if the vast majority of its people live like gypsies...?? Thats good more for the generals... Living standards in Turkey are better than most Balkan and Eastern European countries whether you like it or not. After paying off your national debt, your living standards will be probably lower than the people of Turkey.
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Post by chalkedon on Feb 19, 2010 7:19:22 GMT -5
lol...more ball busting.
Anyway, turkey should be in a way better position than it is now. They are really undermining themselves. Given their strategic location and access to Oil, Energy, Minerals and a diverse landscape not to mention young population...they should be way up there.
Unfortunatly for them and lucky for us...their nationalism gets the better of them. They have a lot of open items with their neighbors and paranoid of conspiracy theories. If they were more progressive they would be way ahead of even Malyasia.
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Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning
Senior Moderator
Simarik Turkish Pwincess
Know yourself...
Posts: 3,563
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Post by Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning on Feb 19, 2010 9:22:17 GMT -5
Why should we have more railway lines?
How can the govt make more money if the people can get around cheaper and safer by using the trains?
No no nooo we must make roads (pay Sabanci and Koc) and sell cars, insurance, taxes, etc.. thats where the money is :/
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Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning
Senior Moderator
Simarik Turkish Pwincess
Know yourself...
Posts: 3,563
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Post by Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning on Feb 19, 2010 9:22:57 GMT -5
Patrinos obviously hasn't been to Turkey to see how the normal people live.
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aayy
Amicus
Posts: 469
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Post by aayy on Feb 20, 2010 12:42:52 GMT -5
Does Muslim religion/culture support enrichment/making profit? I guess - it doesn't?
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Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning
Senior Moderator
Simarik Turkish Pwincess
Know yourself...
Posts: 3,563
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Post by Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning on Feb 20, 2010 14:04:52 GMT -5
Aay you think that Turks have a 'muslim culture' not the new generation, unless they are part of some cult or living in a village. To understand Turkey u must live here for many years, even then the dynamics aren't like anything you would have seen before.
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aayy
Amicus
Posts: 469
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Post by aayy on Feb 20, 2010 15:50:12 GMT -5
I think that traditional religion influences the society a lot even if the majority of its members don't practice the religion actively.
For example I read that even in the time of state atheism Russia was under the influence of its traditional religion - Orthodoxy. I don't mean that people attended churches secretly, I mean that people's mentality included such statements as 1) one can't get rich using honest ways 2) making profit is amoral, etc., which was influenced by Orthodoxy, though it wasn't practiced any longer.
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Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning
Senior Moderator
Simarik Turkish Pwincess
Know yourself...
Posts: 3,563
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Post by Dèsîŗĕ Yèarning on Feb 20, 2010 17:15:30 GMT -5
I think those kind of ethical conditionings are present within almost all societies whether they be religious or cultural or otherwise.
Cheating, lying, etc are universal no no perhaps due to the importance of respect and honesty in todays society. Regardless Turkish society has more lies and deception than many other countries, its easier to lie about something or promise to do it, whilst full well knowng you will not. Turkey is the type of place where a man will feel guilty about cheating on his wife, but feel worse if he doesnt satisfy his needs, that his wife finds sinful. Turkey is the type of place where poor kids are given money on the streets, yet as soon as something goes wrong they are the first to be blamed. Turkey is the type of place where money matters, society matters only if you are rich, if you are poor u just try to survive the best you can. The rich n poor do not interact. Its late I may be going on without direction ut my consciousness seems to have these feelings about my own motherland
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yeni
Moderator
gulash freak
Posts: 327
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Post by yeni on Feb 20, 2010 17:27:53 GMT -5
Does Muslim religion/culture support enrichment/making profit? I guess - it doesn't? interesting i had opposite impression, that being involved in business is a positive, favoured thing, esp. small businesses are very popular and the Quran itself encourages fair trade + many early muslims incl the Prophet himself were merchants.
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aayy
Amicus
Posts: 469
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Post by aayy on Feb 20, 2010 17:39:03 GMT -5
yeni,
IMHO the problem is it's not easy to define what fair trade is. Trade is supposed to bring profit, and according to some theories making profit is ammoral.
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Feb 21, 2010 8:18:17 GMT -5
Why hasn't Turkey become Asian tiger like Korea, Chine, etc., inspite of long history of partnership with the west? Does it have anything to do with religion, culture and traditions? because they are budala nomads deep inside...
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Post by thracian08 on Feb 22, 2010 14:56:07 GMT -5
actually according to Islam Ayy, trade and business is Islamic and just fine. Trade flourished during the Ottomans, and Ummayids (Arabic empire), and also during Prophet Mohammed's time. His wife was a businesswoman herself.
It's the high interest - usury stuff that's forbidden. That's why the USA is in this financial crisis (all the major banks, insurance, mortgage companies are owned by Jews), as everything is based upon lending credit to people w/o any money.
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