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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Jan 14, 2011 6:55:39 GMT -5
Are you ready to get emotional...
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Jan 14, 2011 7:01:25 GMT -5
Slavoj Zizek (Slovenian Sociologist) on the Balkans...
I love how Slovenians have no complexes. For example they have no problems associating them selves with the Balkans, eastern Europe, Yugoslavia... they even have some nostalgia for it.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Jan 14, 2011 7:03:33 GMT -5
Slavoj Zizek explaining the geographic boundary beteen middle Europe and the Balkans lol Wow I just watched some more of his stuff and discovered this fantastic word that describes exactly what I've been thinking and trying to say in more words; DeconstructionismA philosophical movement and theory of literary criticism that questions traditional assumptions about certainty, identity, and truth; asserts that words can only refer to other words; and attempts to demonstrate how statements about any text subvert their own meanings: "In deconstruction, the critic claims there is no meaning to be found in the actual text, but only in the various, often mutually irreconcilable, 'virtual texts' constructed by readers in their search for meaning" (Rebecca Goldstein). Read more: www.answers.com/topic/deconstruction#ixzz1B0lON2fnDeconstructionism: is a powerful postmodern movement currently in vogue on major college campuses and among the intellectual elite. Its influence permeates every area of our culture. This movement hasgiven rise to tribalism, political correctness, re-imaging, multiculturalsim, and culture wars. It has become a hammer for smashing traditional values. Oh that is f**king gold.
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Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jan 14, 2011 8:14:28 GMT -5
thanx man, i'll watch them tonite, with my new panasonic viera cast blu ray player, yeah!
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Post by uz on Mar 24, 2011 0:19:39 GMT -5
Great vid. posts, glad I came across them.
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on Mar 24, 2011 2:39:06 GMT -5
It sounds like you don't know many Slovenians. Not your fault though since you will only find a handful outside Slovenia. I'm fairly certain if you went to Ljubljana and attempted to 'soliti pamet' convince them they are Yugoslavian , Balkan , oriental ( culturally), they would be deeply offended and look at you as nothing more than an innocent or ignorant nostalgic. Sure , Slovenians , like Croatians , can flirt with the idea of Yugo-whatever but when it comes down to it nowadays , the vast majority would never dream of spilling a drop of blood for this fetish.
Not all Slovenians are like Zizek and many actually find him rather distasteful, at least when it comes to his Marxism.
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on Mar 24, 2011 2:47:14 GMT -5
Slavoj Zizek explaining the geographic boundary beteen middle Europe and the Balkans lol Wow I just watched some more of his stuff and discovered this fantastic word that describes exactly what I've been thinking and trying to say in more words; DeconstructionismA philosophical movement and theory of literary criticism that questions traditional assumptions about certainty, identity, and truth; asserts that words can only refer to other words; and attempts to demonstrate how statements about any text subvert their own meanings: "In deconstruction, the critic claims there is no meaning to be found in the actual text, but only in the various, often mutually irreconcilable, 'virtual texts' constructed by readers in their search for meaning" (Rebecca Goldstein). Read more: www.answers.com/topic/deconstruction#ixzz1B0lON2fnDeconstructionism: is a powerful postmodern movement currently in vogue on major college campuses and among the intellectual elite. Its influence permeates every area of our culture. This movement hasgiven rise to tribalism, political correctness, re-imaging, multiculturalsim, and culture wars. It has become a hammer for smashing traditional values. Oh that is f**king gold. The Drava? Fair enough. Conveniently Slovenia is excluded . I think 'cultural borders' are more relevant to 'Balkanism' vs 'Central Europeanism.' Slovenes are like a hybrid between Czechs and Croats (culturally) or to be more precise , Central Europe and the Balkans. Croats certainly lean more Balkan ( culturally) on average but slightly less so than more eastern neighbors ( Serbs , Bulgarians, Albanians) due to centuries of undeniable Central European and 'Roman' influence.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Mar 24, 2011 8:08:52 GMT -5
^ "Central Europeanism? ??" What does central Europe mean??? Just about every major European peoples & culture converges there. It must be one of the least specific/definable terms around. It's a pretty meaningless term.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Mar 24, 2011 8:15:47 GMT -5
It sounds like you don't know many Slovenians. Not your fault though since you will only find a handful outside Slovenia. lol Slovenia is like my second home. Been there like at least 20 times. I certainly didn't mean to insinuate that Zizek is a typical Slovene. I mean he's not typical anything really. I'd think that's obvious. But perhaps you have more of that typical Croat thing going on; globus.jutarnji.hr/komentari/boris-dezulovic/ne-volis-bas-nikoga-e-onda-si-pravi-hrvatThen again you may not be entirely a typical Croat. Certainly not on this forum where Croats have opened topics stating they are not remotely Balkan in any sense.
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Post by Emperor AAdmin on Mar 24, 2011 11:40:16 GMT -5
It appears that central Europe has to do with regions influenced by Germans (including Poland) and what used to be Austro-Hungary.
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Post by uz on Mar 24, 2011 12:48:21 GMT -5
Anyone know where I can watch this documentary "The Wild Balkans" ?
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on Mar 24, 2011 15:25:44 GMT -5
^ "Central Europeanism? ??" What does central Europe mean??? Just about every major European peoples & culture converges there. It must be one of the least specific/definable terms around. It's a pretty meaningless term. Not really. As admin said a predominately Germanic influence from Germany , most of Switzerland, to Northern Italy , down to Northern Croatia there is a continuum common theme. Culturally and structurally, except for the linguistic element and relative size ( though there are many common shared and borrowed words) you will find little difference between Vienna , Ljubljana, and Zagreb. The further into the Balkans you go there is a bit of a culture shock if one were to compare Sarajevo to Ljubljana or Zagreb. This is merely an observation not a political or social opinion of any sort.
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on Mar 24, 2011 15:39:11 GMT -5
It sounds like you don't know many Slovenians. Not your fault though since you will only find a handful outside Slovenia. lol Slovenia is like my second home. Been there like at least 20 times. I certainly didn't mean to insinuate that Zizek is a typical Slovene. I mean he's not typical anything really. I'd think that's obvious. But perhaps you have more of that typical Croat thing going on; globus.jutarnji.hr/komentari/boris-dezulovic/ne-volis-bas-nikoga-e-onda-si-pravi-hrvatThen again you may not be entirely a typical Croat. Certainly not on this forum where Croats have opened topics stating they are not remotely Balkan in any sense. Slovenia like you're second home ? Me too? Govorite tekoce slovenscina? I think this 'typical' reference is more of a perception by others rather than what's really a fact. I know how Croats are 'typically' perceived in Serbia and Slovenia , actually , kind of the opposite. Slovenes look at Croats as inferior 'Slovenes' 'corrupted' by Balkan barbarism. They will never accept us as 'western' as they are. Aside from all the negative connotations in that I don't entirely disagree with it but it is an obvious distorted perception based on some prejudice. ( Croats also have some condescending views of Slovenes) but none of this actually the case with most people on both sides. Serbians look at us as 'inferior Serbs' or mongrels 'corrupted' by evil western values ( Vatican , Catholicism , Latin , German , etc) and because of that perceive us as ' Balkan izdajice.' Croatians have a similar view of Serbs which is propagated by 'typical' perceptions but not really grounded in reality. But me personally , I think the whole 'Balkan argument' is ridiculous. I accept Croatia is a Balkan country and I see nothing wrong with that. The only potentially troubling issue I see is when people incorrectly group all Balkan nations as 'one' or 'isti kruh' based on the fact that they are Balkan countries. Croats are fiercely proud of their unique heritage in the region and feel its belittling and disrespectful when they are clumped with others diminishing their individuality.
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Post by terroreign on Mar 24, 2011 15:53:34 GMT -5
Heh very clever little insert there radiate. Because Slovenes, Serbs, and linguistics alike see Croats as a transition between Serbs and Slovenes. Slovenes have always traditionally been homogenous ethnically and culturally. They were a part of the central-european Moravian empire for a while then, a part of the central-European Hapsburgs. Their continuity is spotless.
Croats on the other hand had about 2 million identified Serbs at the turn of the century, and Zagreb was like the UN with how many different ethnicities that lived there. (Ljudevit Gaj had Slovak-German roots).
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on Mar 24, 2011 16:07:12 GMT -5
Heh very clever little insert there radiate. Because Slovenes, Serbs, and linguistics alike see Croats as a transition between Serbs and Slovenes. Slovenes have always traditionally been homogenous ethnically and culturally. They were a part of the central-european Moravian empire for a while then, a part of the central-European Hapsburgs. Their continuity is spotless. Croats on the other hand had about 2 million identified Serbs at the turn of the century, and Zagreb was like the UN with how many different ethnicities that lived there. (Ljudevit Gaj had Slovak-German roots). Slovenes were pretty much 'nameless' Slavs who settled in Styria and Carantania during the Slav and Barbarian raids of the region hence their name 'Slovene' which literally means just 'Slav.' Some of them were Germanized , Italianized , and Croatianized but the vast majority remained culturally autonomous enclave which developed into modern Slovenia. I was merely pointing out that Slovenes share commonalities with Slavic Croats and Czechs/Slovaks. Most Slovenes wouldn't even deny this. The rest of your post seems like chauvinistic garbage. No offense. Two million identified 'Serbs' among the Croats? Where? Serb numbers in Croatia never exceeded much over half a million compared to their Croat neighbors which was quadruple the amount. I'd like to see where you draw your statistics from. I could accept that Croats can be viewed as a hybrid between Slovenes and Serbs but then also the Serbs can be viewed as a hybrid between Croats and Bulgarians. What you consider 'old Serbian' is generally locked around the Macedonia region and 'old Serbian' language was probably more Eastern south Slavic than its current Western south Slavic speech ( Torlaks , Shops , Macedonians, etc.) The first census that determmins ethnic compostion in Dalmatia happened in 1850. determined 304,152 Croats (76.6%), 74,524 Serbs (18.9%) and 14,645 Italians (3.8%). According to the 1840 census of Croatia and Slavonia (which included eastern Srijem in today's Vojvodina , hence the excessively large Serb numbers) there were 1,075,627 Croats (68%), 504,179 Serbs (32%) If we didn't include eastern Srijem as Slavonia appears today that would be even less Serbs. Zagreb ( Agram) was denoted as primarily a Croatian settlement since the 1200s , even by Hungarians. Agram wasn't even heavily populated till a couple centuries ago when it benefited from the Industrial revolution. All A-H hub cities such as Zagreb , Buda + Pest , Vienna were multi ethnic to a degree but not the degree you're insinuating.
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Post by uz on Mar 26, 2011 23:01:30 GMT -5
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