Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Sept 29, 2011 20:59:05 GMT -5
www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=mkdMacedonianA language of Macedonia ISO 639-3: mkd Population 1,390,000 in Macedonia (1986). Population total all countries: 2,113,170. Region North: Kumanovo-Kratovo region; Southeast: Gevgelija, Strumica, and Lake Dojran areas; West: Veles, Prilep, Kichevo, Bitola region, and Debar-Galchnik region. Also in Albania, Bulgaria, Canada, Croatia, Greece, Serbia, Slovenia, United States. Language map Greece and Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia Alternate names Macedonian Slavic, Makedonski, Slavic Dialects Northern Macedonian, Southeastern Macedonian, Western Macedonian. Standard dialect recognized in 1944. Classification Indo-European, Slavic, South, Eastern Language use National language. Sociopolitical attitudes are strong: called ‘Slavic’ in Greece, considered a dialect of Bulgarian [bul] by some in Bulgaria. Language development Newspapers. Radio programs. Grammar. Bible: 1990. Writing system Cyrillic script, used since 1944. Also spoken in: AlbaniaLanguage name Macedonian Population 150,000 in Albania. Alternate names Macedonian Slavic, Slavic Comments Called ‘Slavic’ in Greece. BulgariaLanguage name Macedonian Population 150,000 in Bulgaria. Region Pirin region, former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia border. Comments Some in Pirin Region claim Macedonian as L1 (1998 W. Brown). GreeceLanguage name Slavic Population 250,000 in Greece (2007 Boskov). Region Macedonia region, Florina, north Kastoria and Thessalonica prefectures. Language map Greece and Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia Alternate names Macedonian, Macedonian Slavic Language use Religion, education. Also use Greek [ell]. Comments Called ‘Slavic’ in Greece, where ‘Macedonian’ refers only to people living in Macedonia, a region in Greece. www.ethnologue.com/
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ioan
Amicus
Posts: 4,162
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Post by ioan on Sept 29, 2011 22:34:49 GMT -5
I d like to see where are those 150000 Macedonians in Bulgaria. As I posted in another thread, they are around 1500 Macs in BG (Official census and most people registered via internet in it (I did), over 1000 are recent newcomers, 300 claim their mother language is Bulgarian so you are left with one gene (probably of the leader of OMO=paid by Skopie).
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Sept 29, 2011 22:59:30 GMT -5
I d like to see where are those 150000 Macedonians in Bulgaria. As I posted in another thread, they are around 1500 Macs in BG (Official census and most people registered via internet in it (I did), over 1000 are recent newcomers, 300 claim their mother language is Bulgarian so you are left with one gene (probably of the leader of OMO=paid by Skopie). Those figures are from a non-Macedonian source. In Macedonia's last census there were 1,417 Bulgarians in Macedonia, and yet you claim we are all Bulgarians and are falling over ourselves to get a BG passport?? As for Macedonians in Bulgaria, here is some information from the minority themselves; On the falsification of census results in Bulgaria; www.omoilindenpirin.org/documents/report.pdfwww.omoilindenpirin.org/www.narodnavolja.com/
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ivo
Amicus
Posts: 2,712
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Post by ivo on Sept 29, 2011 23:05:42 GMT -5
No, you have it wrong.. again. We're not claiming that you are Bulgarians, we are claiming that your predecessors self identified as Bulgarians not long ago.
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Sept 29, 2011 23:13:13 GMT -5
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Sokol
Senior Moderator
Македонецот
Posts: 653
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Post by Sokol on Sept 29, 2011 23:22:03 GMT -5
No, you have it wrong.. again. We're not claiming that you are Bulgarians, we are claiming that your predecessors self identified as Bulgarians not long ago. The predecessors of today's Slavic population of Pirin were also classified as ethnic Macedonians, but now most are referred to as ethnic Bulgarians.
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ivo
Amicus
Posts: 2,712
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Post by ivo on Sept 30, 2011 8:44:03 GMT -5
They were classified as Macedonians, had their passports changed, and had their names changed by the Communist Bulgarian government. This lasted for just under 5 years.
The reason this happened was because Stalin wanted Bulgaria and Yugoslavia to "unite" into one huge Communist Balkan power state. Tito's 'requirement' was that this union was to occur by having all people in the geographic region of Macedonia classified as ethnic Macedonians. Furthermore, the plan was to dismember the Bulgarian identity and to have Southern Bulgarians classified as Thracians and Northern Bulgarians classified as Moesians.
Tito's concept was 'divide and conquer'.
The biggest mistake Bulgaria has ever made was allowing its communist government to terrorize its own population in Pirin Macedonia.
It is for this reason that we have a small group that identify as ethnic Macedonians in Bulgaria today, and it is for this reason why many chose to actually embrace the ethnic Macedonian identity both in Bulgaria and outside of it (ie. Vardar and Aegean Macedonia).
Disunited people are easily controlled.. which is why the West supports the creation of new Balkan states, and each country has a duplicate.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Oct 1, 2011 20:51:17 GMT -5
^ No, Tito's motto was that a weaker Serbia made Yugoslavia stronger. Now get that into your thick BuLgarski head.
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Post by uz on Oct 1, 2011 20:55:43 GMT -5
Whatever makes people think that Tito was pro-Serb (politically) is beyond me.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Oct 1, 2011 21:06:09 GMT -5
^ This is the twisted BuLgarski propaganda we face with. Its of the same nature when l argue with the BuLgari in regards to Southern Serbia.
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Post by Moe Lester on Oct 1, 2011 21:42:45 GMT -5
Why would Tito be pro-anything except pro-Yugoslavia. The guy believed in unity.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Oct 1, 2011 22:16:59 GMT -5
^ at the expensive of the Serbs.
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Post by Moe Lester on Oct 1, 2011 22:26:41 GMT -5
The guy wanted to unite the Serbs and Croats, and to a lesser extent the Slovenes and the Macedonians, into one ethnicity, culture, language and country.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Oct 1, 2011 22:41:40 GMT -5
^ but wasn't there something before that known as the union of the SERBS + Croats and Slovenes?
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Post by Moe Lester on Oct 1, 2011 22:56:12 GMT -5
Ruled by a Serbian king, serbian government and serbian army. Not much unity. He wanted them to see each other as the same people, not a union of different people.
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ivo
Amicus
Posts: 2,712
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Post by ivo on Oct 1, 2011 23:07:29 GMT -5
No body said Tito was pro-Serb. He spent a lot of time de-Bulgarizing Macedonia. So much so that 80% of Yugoslavia’s ‘special police’ was concentrated in Macedonia, while the remaining 20% were disperessed all throughout the remaining parts.
Tito simply made use of the anti-Bulgarian policies of the Serbian government that were in place prior to the formation of Yugoslavia.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Oct 1, 2011 23:28:39 GMT -5
"Ruled by a Serbian king, serbian government and serbian army. Not much unity. He wanted them to see each other as the same people, not a union of different people."
This was what the Slovenes and Croats wanted when they arrived on their knees to the Serbian king when they seeked freedom from Austria-Hungary. Serbia for their contribution during WW1 were offered territories, Napoleon, the king could had taken half of Croatia as his reward and truned it into Serbia, but naively, he SAW THE CROATS AND THE SLOVENES AS ONE PEOPLE BY BLOOD, AND INSTEAD OF TAKING THESE LANDS TO EXPAND SERBIA, HE USED HIS REWARD OFFERED BY THE WESTERN POWERS TO SEEK THE FREEDOMS OF SLOVENIA AND CROATIA INSTEAD.
PS For your information, the King was the man who named the union of the Slovenes, Croats and Serbs into YUGOSLAVIA, lets get this misinformation right. If you call the kings unselfish behaviour as evil, then l wonder what is running through your head.
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Post by Moe Lester on Oct 1, 2011 23:32:17 GMT -5
Never said that, you must be putting your words in your head. If the king was all about unity, he would've replaced the monarchy with a modern parliamentary republic with it's own president. He wouldn't put only Serbs in charge of the government and army (he did this because he only trusted Serbs).
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Post by Novi Pazar on Oct 1, 2011 23:35:49 GMT -5
^ l know you didn't, it was important for me to highlight this.
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Sokol
Senior Moderator
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Posts: 653
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Post by Sokol on Oct 2, 2011 22:40:46 GMT -5
They were classified as Macedonians, had their passports changed, and had their names changed by the Communist Bulgarian government. This lasted for just under 5 years. The reason this happened was because Stalin wanted Bulgaria and Yugoslavia to "unite" into one huge Communist Balkan power state. Tito's 'requirement' was that this union was to occur by having all people in the geographic region of Macedonia classified as ethnic Macedonians. Furthermore, the plan was to dismember the Bulgarian identity and to have Southern Bulgarians classified as Thracians and Northern Bulgarians classified as Moesians. Tito's concept was 'divide and conquer'. The biggest mistake Bulgaria has ever made was allowing its communist government to terrorize its own population in Pirin Macedonia. It is for this reason that we have a small group that identify as ethnic Macedonians in Bulgaria today, and it is for this reason why many chose to actually embrace the ethnic Macedonian identity both in Bulgaria and outside of it (ie. Vardar and Aegean Macedonia). Disunited people are easily controlled.. which is why the West supports the creation of new Balkan states, and each country has a duplicate. Actually, the inclusion of Bulgaria and Aegean Macedonia into Yugoslavia would have been fantastic. Can you imagine the economic, political and military potential of such a state? I would however not like to see such a state under communist control.
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