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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 17:05:23 GMT -5
You really don't understand do you. Russia is Serbia's biggest/strongest allie when it comes Serbia policies. I will repeat. Russia would not have to move a muscle, only give the go-ahead to the Serbs to do what they got to do. Cause when the Americans start going ape-s**t, a balance will be needed. What balance? How will Russia get to Kosovo? Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria will not allow Russian troops to cross their territory. Or do you mean that Russia should declare war on NATO? Not at all, quite the oposite. Russia does not need to walk on Balkan soil. Remember; Serbia has legal ground to enter Kosovo, especially to protect the Serbs living their. This is inacted in UNRES 1244, in which is still in effect and recognized by many countries around the world, including a few major players; Russia, China, etc... The USA will soon loose their significance on the global stage, they already are, and certain things will simply fall back on whatever is official, and on what makes the most sense.
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Post by missanthropology58 on Oct 10, 2011 17:11:20 GMT -5
English women prositutes, never.
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Post by Anittas on Oct 10, 2011 18:14:22 GMT -5
Again, what can Russia do to you? You mention this "UNRES 1244" thingy, but from I understand from your post, you don't need Russia for that. Yeah, American influence is waning, but not necessarily the power of NATO, of which Romania also is part of. So I think you can stop dreaming of Wild East adventures in KosovA.
As for your buddies, the Russians, they're far more wicked than those powers you despise so much. They screwed us with Bessarabia and northern Bukovina--regions that unlike Kosova, Romanians were in majority (in N. Bukovina we were a plurality). Your allies are not (politically) honorable.
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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 18:25:52 GMT -5
^ Russia is not the solution, I never said they were. It just depends where you are in the world, from a Western perspective America/EU is more promising, but from a non-EU & Balkan perspective Russia is the determinal factor. It's been like this for ages, and it's not only Russia, China also has huge interests on how this plays out. We're right in the middle, and Romania also respects this resolution so it would be interesting to see how Romania will act if Serbia decides to abide by this same resolution.
Maybe Romania will finally stand out of the crowd.
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Post by Anittas on Oct 10, 2011 18:36:44 GMT -5
Not likely. Romania is with the EU, which means NATO and USA. We've picked our side and we're gonna stick to it. It's not like in the old days when we would be shifting between sides. China has Taiwan, the Chinese Sea and other disputes in Asia to worry about. Yes, they will oppose USA whenever they get the chance, in whatever conflict, but they understand that the Balkans is not their area of interest. I don't see them getting involved there, especially since more Balkan countries are expected to join the EU.
Oh, and the country where you live now ... Canada, or Aussie, or whatever. Guess of what club they belong to?
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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 18:47:33 GMT -5
Neither is it in the interests of the Americans anymore to stay in the Balkans, this my point. Things are changing very rapidly here in the Western world. I understand very well who "Canadians" root for, but this is besides the point, me nor any reg. citizen has any say in this.
The current situation in Kosovo is by all means promoting instability (the main purpose) in the region and brewing more nationalism accross the board amongst Serbs, and can you blame them.
Serb forces should be protecting Serb citizens, not KFOR or Alb officers whose sole duty in the create tension. A partition is only logical, the people want no part with the Alb regime, this is their righful choice and is legally-binding across the board.
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Post by alb12345 on Oct 10, 2011 19:18:59 GMT -5
Anybody who goes against the u.s.a and nato loses big time sooner or later one way or another. Russia will never go to war for Serbia even if a posible war happen Russia dont have the military strength to go against nato-usa. Albanian Constitution for albanians outside the borders Article 8
1. The Republic of Albania protects the national rights of the Albanian people who live outside its borders. 2. The Republic of Albania protects the rights of its citizens with a temporary or permanent residence outside its borders. 3. The Republic of Albania assures assistance for Albanians who live and work abroad in order to preserve and develop their ties with the national cultural inheritance.
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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 19:34:49 GMT -5
^ this is completely irrelvent to the discussion. Plus, how many more time does it need to be stated that Russia will/does not need to go to war "for Serbia" ?
Ps; NATO/US don't have much interest left in Kosovo, soon enough the Alb regime will be cut from the leash and they'll be on their own.
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Post by Anittas on Oct 10, 2011 19:35:30 GMT -5
You guys should start a diplomatic mission to get northern Kosovo. It is too unfortunate that your country doesn't have skillful diplomats. You only had peasant presidents and diplomats and a bunch of brutes as your generals. Try to get what you still can receive.
Kosovo is recognized and thus supported not by USA alone, but also by most EU countries. These countries have bound themselves to protect it, so even with an American partial retreat, most EU countries--on behalf of NATO--would retain their presence there.
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Post by alb12345 on Oct 10, 2011 19:46:24 GMT -5
Anita north kosova has 60k serbs theres far more albanians in serbia then they are in north kosova by that logic half of macedonia goes to albania as well as south greece plus part of montenegro if we make borders by nationalities.
Anyone who goes against nato-usa loses one way or another.
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Post by Anittas on Oct 10, 2011 19:47:38 GMT -5
Only 60k? Weren't there more? Did the Albanians use Serb tactics to get rid of the Serbs?
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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 19:48:41 GMT -5
NATO can easily have their positioned changed, what's your point?
According to the resolution, NATO has the right to be their but only temporarily untill it's agreed between NATO and Serbia on how many Serb troops should be sent. Notice the Alb regime never speaks on their own behalf, they only repeat what German and French officials say.
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Post by Anittas on Oct 10, 2011 20:09:33 GMT -5
They would have no reason to change their position, since the conditions will remain the same, namely that the Albanian majority will persevere in Kosovo and they wouldn't desire to be part of Serbia. If it was difficult to constrain them before, it would be impossible to do it now when they know the feeling of self-governing and independence.
The only way to curb the Kosovo Albanians would be through violence and the international community would never allow it.
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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 20:15:25 GMT -5
It's all here; 7. Authorizes Member States and relevant international organizations to establish the international security presence in Kosovo as set out in point 4 of annex 2 with all necessary means to fulfil its responsibilities under paragraph 9 below;(b) Demilitarizing the Kosovo Liberation Army (KLA) and other armed Kosovo Albanian groups as required in paragraph 15 below;12. Emphasizes the need for coordinated humanitarian relief operations, and for the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia to allow unimpeded access to Kosovo humanitarian aid organizations and to cooperate with such organizations so as ensure the fast and effective delivery of international aid;15. Demands that the KLA and other armed Kosovo Albanian groups end immediately all offensive actions and comply with the requirements for demilitarization as laid down by the head of the international security presence in consultation with the Special Representative of the Secretary-General;18. Demands that all States in the region cooperate fully in the implementation of all aspects of this resolution;6. After withdrawal, an agreed number of Yugoslav and Serbian personnel will be permitted to return to perform the following functions: - Liaison with the international civil mission and the international security presence; - Marking/clearing minefields; - Maintaining a presence at Serb patrimonial sites; - Maintaining a presence at key border crossings.5. Establishment of an interim administration for Kosovo as a part of the international civil presence under which the people of Kosovo can enjoy substantial autonomy within the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia, to be decided by the Security Council of the United Nations. The interim administration to provide transitional administration while establishing and overseeing the development of provisional democratic self-governing institutions to ensure conditions for a peaceful and normal life for all inhabitants in Kosovo.And there is so much more, check it out; daccess-dds-ny.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N99/172/89/PDF/N9917289.pdf?OpenElement-- To clarify, Serbia is the successor of Yugoslavia. This has already been established by the UN Security Council, even in the agreement with the United States and United Kingdom.
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Post by Moe Lester on Oct 10, 2011 20:17:38 GMT -5
6 countries are successors of Yugoslavia as well; Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Montenegro, Serbia and Macedonia.
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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 20:33:32 GMT -5
6 countries are successors of Yugoslavia as well; Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Montenegro, Serbia and Macedonia. Not officially. The UN stated specifically that under this resolution, along with ALL the other members of the UNSC that Serbia is the successor of Yugoslavia. No one has even tried to question that, by using it as a trump-card. Serbia-Montenegro is the original successor (again, according to the UN), but when Montenegro split, by default it fell unto Serbia alone.
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Post by Moe Lester on Oct 10, 2011 20:37:58 GMT -5
All countries that seceded form Yugoslavia became successor states of Yugoslavia. Serbia and Montenegro are just the most recent ones.
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Post by uz on Oct 10, 2011 20:44:43 GMT -5
Naps, you're not entirely wrong, poetically speaking. But the facts remain, according to anything printed in the Dayton Accord and UN RES 1244, Serbia is the successor of Yugoslavia. This is not me saying it, this is stated throughout the UN Nations and more importantly throughout the UNSC.
No country has even tried to debate this.
I understand your position on this conflict but when it comes to technicalities and UN/International Law, Serbia has the upper hand.
Which is also why the Internation Court of Justice (ICJ) stated; That it was not illegal to declare independance, but it was illegal to secede. (The verdict landed right in the middle, favoring not one-side fully).
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Post by alb12345 on Oct 10, 2011 20:49:18 GMT -5
Kosova when was part of jugoslavia; January 20th of 1953 the status as a Autonomic Region of Kosova was approved by the Yugoslavian Assembly; In 1968, 1971, 1972 peaceful demonstrations occurred throughout Kosova, where Albanians rightfully were demonstrating for an autonomous state; In all of these cases Albanians were put to prison, such as in the case of 1968 where only 13 of them had a hearing and 130 were put to prison without ever getting to have a say. on February 28th of 1974, a new Constitution for Kosova as an Autonomic Region of Yugoslavia was approved by the Yugoslavian Assembly thus making Kosova juridically a federation of Yugoslavia; In 1981 again a peaceful demonstration demanding an autonomous state of Kosova occurred, once again organized by the students. Throughout the demonstrations civilians were attacked by tear-gas and randomly beaten up. Over 300 Albanian intellectuals were arrested and dismissed from their working positions. Let's fast forward to the '90's, where 90% of Albanians got fired from their jobs, the schools and University were closed, teachers and professors got randomly called up to the police station to get a free round of beating-up, a good number of them remained in jail for "resisting arrest". Naturally, no hearings for these people ever occurred. Because of this Albanians used private houses to hold lectures and classes, without any payment. By this time Albanians lived off of the diaspora because they had no other incomes or salaries. In 1990 Albanians formed a legally rightful Assembly of Kosovo, and on July the 2nd 1990 Albanians declared independence and compiled the Constitution of Kosova. Because of this 28 Albanians were killed, thousands of children poisoned in peaceful demonstrations. On Septmber the 26th of 1991 a plebiscite was organized in Kosova, the results of which pointed out de jure the constituionally given right for self-determination. By this time Serbia was already preparing for war and genocide, while Albanians peacefully required what was theirs to have.
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Post by Anittas on Oct 10, 2011 20:55:50 GMT -5
Uz is correct that Serbia is the successor of Yugoslavia, in the same way that Turkey is the successor of the Ottoman Empire and Russia of the Soviet Union. All of these successions are official and they were claimed, and in turn recognized, by the nucleus power that gave birth to the political faction in question and the international community respectively. On the other hand, it's all irrelevant when considering Kosovo. The reality of things is that Albanians constitute an overwhelming majority there and they want to remain independent, which they will remain.
If we want to talk politics, the League of Nations had decided that the fate of disputed regions and provinces in Europe should be decided by self-determination. There are exceptions, of course, but Kosovo is not one.
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