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Post by berik on Feb 26, 2012 14:15:39 GMT -5
Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible and Why. For almost 1,500 years, the New Testament manuscripts were copied by hand––and mistakes and intentional changes abound in the competing manuscript versions. Religious and biblical scholar Bart Ehrman makes the provocative case that many of our widely held beliefs concerning the divinity of Jesus, the Trinity, and the divine origins of the Bible itself are the results of both intentional and accidental alterations by scribes. In this compelling and fascinating book, Ehrman shows where and why changes were made in our earliest surviving manuscripts, explaining for the first time how the many variations of our cherished biblical stories came to be, and why only certain versions of the stories qualify for publication in the Bibles we read today. Ehrman frames his account with personal reflections on how his study of the Greek manuscripts made him abandon his once ultra–conservative views of the Bible. www.amazon.com/Misquoting-Jesus-Story-Behind-Changed/dp/0060859512/ref=pd_sim_b_1The popular perception of the Bible as a divinely perfect book eceives scant support from Ehrman, who sees in Holy Writ ample evidence of human fallibility and ecclesiastical politics. Though himself schooled in evangelical literalism, Ehrman has come to regard his earlier faith in the inerrant inspiration of the Bible as misguided, given that the original texts have disappeared and that the extant texts available do not agree with one another. Most of the textual discrepancies, Ehrman acknowledges, matter little, but some do profoundly affect religious doctrine. To assess how ignorant or theologically manipulative scribes may have changed the biblical text, modern scholars have developed procedures for comparing diverging texts. And in language accessible to nonspecialists, Ehrman explains these procedures and their results. He further explains why textual criticism has frequently sparked intense controversy, especially among scripture-alone Protestants. In discounting not only the authenticity of existing manuscripts but also the inspiration of the original writers, Ehrman will deeply divide his readers.
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Post by berik on Feb 26, 2012 14:18:05 GMT -5
There is a great, basic contradiction in the teachings of Jesus. Jesus was one of the first great teachers to proclaim the basic principle of individualism -- the inviolate sanctity of man's soul, and the salvation of one's soul as one's first concern and highest goal; this means -- one's ego and the integrity of one's ego.
But when it came to the next question, a code of ethics to observe for the salvation of one's soul -- (this means: what must one do in actual practice in order to save one's soul?) -- Jesus (or perhaps His interpreters) gave men a code of altruism, that is, a code which told them that in order to save one's soul, one must love or help or live for others. This means, the subordination of one's soul (or ego) to the wishes, desires or needs of others, which means the subordination of one's soul to the souls of others.
This is a contradiction that cannot be resolved. This is why men have never succeeded in applying Christianity in practice, while they have preached it in theory for two thousand years. The reason of their failure was not men's natural depravity or hypocrisy, which is the superficial (and vicious) explanation usually given. The reason is that a contradiction cannot be made to work. That is why the history of Christianity has been a continuous civil war -- both literally (between sects and nations), and spiritually (within each man's soul)
- Ayn Rand (Letters)
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Post by Anittas on Feb 27, 2012 2:23:07 GMT -5
Don't quote that bitch, please. Are you working in Silicon Valley, perhaps?
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Post by hellboy87 on Feb 27, 2012 5:30:32 GMT -5
Don't quote that bitch, please. LOL!!! Why?
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Post by uz on Mar 1, 2012 19:11:47 GMT -5
yea what's your beef with ayn Rand ?
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Post by ralphtpika on Mar 2, 2012 6:18:30 GMT -5
Misquoting Jesus? Or Misquoting those which quoted/misquoted Jesus?
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Post by laughinglions on Mar 2, 2012 19:53:35 GMT -5
Who cares? Jesus was misrepresenting himself and misquoting Eastern mysticism anyway. He was one of mankind's greatest enemies.
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Post by uz on Mar 2, 2012 19:56:29 GMT -5
Christianity is completely backwards from the way he was teaching, I am not even religious and I noticed this in the "texts" which started my skepticism about religion to begin with.
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Post by srbobran on Mar 2, 2012 21:40:20 GMT -5
After reading a decent amount of the Bible (and parts of Old Testament at that), I gave up on organized religion cold turkey to be honest.
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Mar 19, 2012 14:01:50 GMT -5
After reading a decent amount of the Bible (and parts of Old Testament at that), I gave up on organized religion cold turkey to be honest. Christ cultist are in a state of trance when they read the bible. "turn the other cheek" "happy is he who smashes babies into rocks". Srbodan you should read the expulsion from Egypt, its very relavent to today.
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Mar 19, 2012 14:02:34 GMT -5
Christianity is completely backwards from the way he was teaching, I am not even religious and I noticed this in the "texts" which started my skepticism about religion to begin with. So how religious are you, 8% or something?
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Post by srbobran on Mar 20, 2012 11:48:54 GMT -5
^The "virtues" you speak of amount to nothing more than keeping man poor and complacent> Christianity leaves no room for personal ambition and assigns meaningless to all temporal life. Their "virtues" are self destructive and depressing to quite frank.
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Post by uz on Mar 20, 2012 17:25:37 GMT -5
I find this statement to be true for me as well. It's not a all-in or all-out type deal. This is where they got us, way back when... when they built this beleif-system initially, opening the gate-way to manipulation lies and exploitation. The choice was given, but in reality there really was no choice, either you-are in or you're-not - you take in everything that you're told or not take in anything, thus the beginning of true division.
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Mar 20, 2012 19:41:17 GMT -5
^The "virtues" you speak of amount to nothing more than keeping man poor and complacent> Christianity leaves no room for personal ambition and assigns meaningless to all temporal life. Their "virtues" are self destructive and depressing to quite frank. Excellent observation srbodan, and consider the idea that this was exactly why christinsanity was created for. Semitic religions are nothing to envy, they are intolerant. Both Islam and Christianity spread by the sword, the same with communism. All jewish products and both had similar effect on white civilization (destruction). Contrast Semitic intolerence and hatred with ancient Rome and the diversity of faiths that were tolerated by this Aryan civilization. This is Aryan way of thinking, that every one is different so different people need different religion and express themselves differently. One respects the other wants to dominate it. Aryan and semitic spirits are polar opposites.
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Mar 20, 2012 21:06:16 GMT -5
That is the Luciferian teaching, it is what freemasons are taught, if they get to progress to higher degrees. And it is the jewish outlook. This anti-tradition, anti-nature perspective can only come from a cosmpolitan creature, a rootless and defective type of man. The core idea is that man is God, or as jews view themselves as God and the rest of us and two legged cattle (goyim).
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Mar 20, 2012 22:17:33 GMT -5
Christianity is not for the jews. Jews are taught they are man and rulers over the goym. Christcultist are taught they are born of sin, took look for happiness in next life, turn the other cheak, forgive, submit. Christianity is a universalist egalitarian anti-racist religion created by jews for goyim. Can you imgaine ancient Germans, ancient Slavs or any other ancient Aryan puting up with extortions jews pull on us today? What would Thor do? Would he hammer these snakes hard, or cry on cross to forgive his enemies? Christianity opened the way for explotation of Europeans, and toleration of this menace.
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Mar 20, 2012 22:25:23 GMT -5
That is the Luciferian teaching, it is what freemasons are taught, if they get to progress to higher degrees. And it is the jewish outlook. I am not sure I follow you. So, believing in Yahweh and Jesus as the son of god is a Jewish invention but admiring the spirit of Lucifer who opposed God / Yahweh for the benefit of Mankind is also a Jewish outlook? If that's your meaning, you have me baffled. Every religious myth has its two opposing characters/camps. Greek mythology, Norse mythology, Egyptian (Horus vs Seth), etc... What is important is the interpretation taken, jews interpretation is satanic. Man will conquer nature, man defines reality, man is God. Thats their outlook in a brief summary. And man= jew not goy. In the bible satan really represents man in the spiritual sense. There are two parallel falls from the bible, one material and one spiritual. Lucifer represents man in spiritual sense.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Mar 22, 2012 7:19:02 GMT -5
Babylon & RD, great conversation here. Just letting you guys know you got an audience.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Mar 22, 2012 7:33:44 GMT -5
Especially because people are indoctrinated in their parents religious values (no matter how outlandish) at a young age and never had any real choice in the matter. Much the same is true about society at large, people keep on being Christians on Sundays just because their parents went to church and their parents’ parents did so before them. The whole thing is a farce, a caricature of the divine, and the only thing more sad is the ones who actually believe in it. Is that what you do? This is not true at all. Church attendance is much smaller then the amount of people who declare religious affiliation (anonymously). Also, marriagewedding ceremonies with civil celebrants are much higher then those who proclaim religious affiliation. You can easily check this. So in other words, people are more willing to proclaim religious affiliation on an anonymous survey then whom actually practice it in reality! A much better derivation would be that people secretly see value in it, or actually are even afraid to express their appreciation for the security, beauty, love etc they see in it.
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Mar 22, 2012 20:09:02 GMT -5
Babylon & RD, great conversation here. Just letting you guys know you got an audience. Arsenije, this is how masonry basically interprests the fall man. "In the garden of Eden man was held poor and ignorant by a cruel and unjust God. Lucifer freed man from the bonds of ignorance by giving him the gift of intellect." As you probably already know, ever since Lucifer was casted down from heaven for disobeying God. Lucifer has been plotting ever since to dethrone God. God represents nature(natural law), order, tradition. Theres more intersting info on this and I can explain further, don't ind asking. If I know the answer I don't mind sharing. I do not make things up when I say this is jewish religion. All one has to do is read their material. "A famous midrash registers a classic milah debate between Rabbi Akiva and Turnus Rufus [Roman officer] Turnus Rufus the wicked asked Rabbi Akiva, "Whose deeds are better? Those of G-d or those of humans?" Rabbi Akiva answered, "Those of humans are better." Turnus Rufus asked, "Behold the heaven and the earth. Can you make anything more beautiful than them?" He answered, "Do not tell me about something that is higher than human capabilities, since humans are unable to do these things, but let us compare things which humans are capable of." Turnus Rufus asked, "Why do you circumcise yourselves?" Rabbi Akiva answered, "I knew that you were asking about something like that, and for that reason I told you at the start that men's deeds are greater than those of G-d." Rabbi Akiva then brought to Turnus Rufus two items: stalks of wheat and baked rolls. Rabbi Akiva said, "These [the stalks of wheat] are the deeds of G-d, and these [the baked rolls] are the deeds of humans. Are these [baked rolls] not more beautiful?" "If so," answered Turnus Rufus, "since G-d is interested in circumcision, why did he not create human beings already circumcised?" Rabbi Akiva answered, "Because G-d gave the mitzvos to the Jewish people only to purify them. And this is what David Hamelech said, "The word of G-d is pure, it is a shield for all those who take shelter in Him."(1) (YALKUT 546, par. "Uveyom") " www.shemayisrael.co.il/parsha/feinhandler/children/archives/tazria.htm
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