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Post by alb12345 on Nov 20, 2008 16:47:53 GMT -5
Number of Turkish/Turkic Words in Other Languages:(Source: TDK - Turkish Language Association)
Serbian: 8965 Armenian: 4260 Bulgarian: 3490 Greek: 2983 Persian: 2969 Romanian: 2780 Russian: 2476 Arabic: 1990 Hungarian: 1982 Albanian:1200 Ukranian: 800 English: 470 Chinese:289 Czech:248 Urdu:227 German:166 Italian:146 Finnish:110
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 20, 2008 18:26:31 GMT -5
Thats because most words were swept out in the 1970's.
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Kanaris
Amicus
This just in>>>> Nobody gives a crap!
Posts: 9,589
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Post by Kanaris on Nov 20, 2008 19:17:13 GMT -5
The amount of words is disputable... How are we to be sure they are turkish?
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 20, 2008 22:09:13 GMT -5
If their either from the: Turkish, Arabic or Persian words that come through the ottoman empire then they are Turkish...
and its easy to determine if they are Turkish or Arabic...
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Kanaris
Amicus
This just in>>>> Nobody gives a crap!
Posts: 9,589
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Post by Kanaris on Nov 20, 2008 22:49:52 GMT -5
I guess if your saliva is send through the air trying to pronunciate arabic or Turkish then you know it's theirs.
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 20, 2008 23:05:55 GMT -5
Turkish and Arabic are not similar in pronunciations at all... neither is Persian and Arabic.
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Post by proleteriat on Nov 21, 2008 0:21:17 GMT -5
That list proves I'm not Turkish, thank God. The less Turkish words the better. I was getting worrid there for a minute... Now...if only I could do something about my Greek and/or possible vlach side? perhaps you have another list alb12345? ;D
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Nov 21, 2008 5:08:30 GMT -5
How many slavic words do you have??
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 21, 2008 5:13:21 GMT -5
Not that many... maybe 5-7% of our language... but considering the proximity...
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Nov 21, 2008 5:42:44 GMT -5
I have online the lexico of Xristoforidhi(btw why he has such name??) and he has about 20 pages containing slavic words. He wrote his lexico in Greek alphabet, why you've changed it? I bet that if you used today the greek alphabet, in albanian.com like sites there would be lengthy texts to prove the albopelasgoillirian orign of it...
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Kanaris
Amicus
This just in>>>> Nobody gives a crap!
Posts: 9,589
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Post by Kanaris on Nov 21, 2008 6:30:49 GMT -5
This just proves we were just villagers before the mighty arab and turk civilizations came to us.
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Post by Duke John on Nov 21, 2008 6:56:32 GMT -5
Number of Turkish/Turkic Words in Other Languages:(Source: TDK - Turkish Language Association) Serbian: 8965 Armenian: 4260 Bulgarian: 3490 Greek: 2983 Persian: 2969 Romanian: 2780 Russian: 2476 Arabic: 1990 Hungarian: 1982 Albanian:1200 Ukranian: 800 English: 470 Chinese:289 Czech:248 Urdu:227 German:166 Italian:146 Finnish:110 do you have a link? and are there words mentioned?
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Kanaris
Amicus
This just in>>>> Nobody gives a crap!
Posts: 9,589
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Post by Kanaris on Nov 21, 2008 8:21:31 GMT -5
What about Albanian and Greek words in those languages?
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 21, 2008 13:36:55 GMT -5
20 pages would probably be enough to cover 5-7%. Over half of our foreign loanwords are Latin/Italian.
Surnames came pretty late in Albanian history and when applied they were generally under the hand of the millet. So, for instance, numerous Muslim last names in this period end with -oglu(olli), a Turkish suffix, while numerous Orthodox Christian last names were Greek in nature. Konstantin was from this particular period.
And as for why we dont use the Greek alphabet? Why in the fk would we? Im glad we got rid of that crap and am thankful, for once, that most of those manuscripts have long since been lost. No need for people to remember a time when our identity was decided on by the church of another.
And we never changed it since it was never accepted as an official alphabet. It was simply the staple alphabet of Albanian Christians in the south. Most Albanian Christians and Muslims later finally decided on a Latin alphabet. Which makes more sense since a 14th century Crusader itinerary, the writer mentions:
The Albanians indeed have a language quite different from Latin. However they use Latin letters in all their books.
Unfortunately none of these survives...
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Patrinos
Amicus
Peloponnesos uber alles
Posts: 4,763
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Post by Patrinos on Nov 21, 2008 14:28:04 GMT -5
Surnames came pretty late in Albanian history and when applied they were generally under the hand of the millet. So, for instance, numerous Muslim last names in this period end with -oglu(olli), a Turkish suffix, while numerous Orthodox Christian last names were Greek in nature. Konstantin was from this particular period. I didn't mean his first name,Konstantin, but his surname Hristofor idhi, which is, I can say, more typical for Greek surnames even more from -opoulos endings. And as for why we dont use the Greek alphabet? Why in the fk would we? Im glad we got rid of that crap and am thankful, for once, that most of those manuscripts have long since been lost. No need for people to remember a time when our identity was decided on by the church of another. Lately you lose you philellenic attitude.
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 21, 2008 14:51:26 GMT -5
Yea, the -olli and -idhi(which mean the same thing, 'son of') were rare surnames handed out during the late Ottoman Empire when surname registries started to make an appearance. Only a set few ever had them (although -olli is far more pronounced than -idhi although still very rare). We had a discussion in the Kosova forum a while back on the issue of surnames and one of the members mentioned this. never had it. No this topic is on Turkish words in Albania, not your ideas and people. Stop trying to turn attention away.
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Post by proleteriat on Nov 21, 2008 15:08:01 GMT -5
Lately you lose you philellenic attitude. I think Toskali wants to prove how proud he is to be Albanian despite that he has Greek blood and the only way for him to do that is to hate Greeks and love Turks. There's a reason I picked on him so much, I'm all too familiar with that topic, as I have Greek blood also, not just from grandma, but from grandpa also ;D Kristoforidhi obvoiusly has Greek roots, this reminds me when someone was trying to convince me that Papadhopuli is a pure Albanian last name what can I say mother nature is a w**re, who likes oxymorons apparently. now we're all getting off topic Tosko ;D Long live Turkey!!!!.... but only until Thanksgiving!! ;D
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 21, 2008 15:14:32 GMT -5
Sad but it used to be very true for me in the past. Not anymore though I actually got into a fight with one or two Albanians when my 'identity' was questioned just because of some partial non-Alb heritage. But thats how it is when people keep flouting the '100% Alb' crap. Ironically this person was an Alb from Montenegro and he himself had to later admit to some non-Alb heritage... but thats only after I nearly choked him half to death...
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Post by epiroti on Nov 21, 2008 16:07:07 GMT -5
I thought our language had more foreign words than what these stats are conveying, and from what Tosku is saying (I am not calling you a liar by the way)!
I am glad that the commies "cleaned" our language from many foreign words. We will need to do this again, when our economy and education system picks up again, from english words. It can be done quicker via consensus between the big media groups, but I highly doubt it. Changes of that level have to be initiated by the government. They are currently destroying our language.
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Post by meltdown711 on Nov 21, 2008 16:53:52 GMT -5
I agree, words like 'startoj' have to be purged completely, their a shame. Annoying other ones include 'hajde' (come) which unnecessary since we have synonymous word for that: 'eja'; 'akoma' (still;yet) which should be replaced entirely with 'ende'. Many other similar words here and there. The fact that many still use 'mashallah', 'ishalla', 'evallah' makes me cringe. 'Taban', 'tavan', 'yorgan', 'dushek', 'taraf' (household terminology) etc. should all be replaced with more European oriented words if we dont have native ones for them. 'Takim' should also be replaced with something better.
Albanian does have many more foreign loanwords, however they are mostly Latin. Even relatively small expressions like 'debil' come from Latin. I think as much as 35-40% of our language is made of Latin inherited words.
The one good thing about Albanian is that, like German or Greek, we can create compound words to encompass greater ideas. This should be used far more than it is now.
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