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Post by terroreign on Dec 9, 2010 17:19:06 GMT -5
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Post by toskaliku on Dec 9, 2010 17:33:42 GMT -5
Funny, nothing mentioning Albania in those. In fact its only a Bosnian website that focuses on Sarajevo...
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Post by toskaliku on Dec 9, 2010 17:36:07 GMT -5
Crnogorci 6.905/4.232 Srbi 1.338/486 Albanci 440/276 Bošnjaci+Muslimani 963/279 Romi 614/94
From what it looks like, the only people winning are Muslims and Roma (over 600 born for every 94 deaths). Nice. If all goes well with the assimilation of Muslim Slavs in FYROM, the very same can be possibly applied to Montenegro in the future...
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Post by Username on Dec 9, 2010 20:27:39 GMT -5
Does little Serbia want a cookie?
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Post by Marshall_Stanko on Dec 9, 2010 21:30:55 GMT -5
Does little Serbia want a cookie? Aint you half Serbian?
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Post by Username on Dec 9, 2010 21:59:19 GMT -5
Does little Serbia want a cookie? Aint you half Serbian? Technically, yes. What's your point?
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Post by dusko1 on Dec 10, 2010 0:39:00 GMT -5
Crnogorci 6.905/4.232 Srbi 1.338/486 Albanci 440/276 Bošnjaci+Muslimani 963/279 Romi 614/94 From what it looks like, the only people winning are Muslims and Roma (over 600 born for every 94 deaths). Nice. If all goes well with the assimilation of Muslim Slavs in FYROM, the very same can be possibly applied to Montenegro in the future... Keep jerking off to this fantasy bitch.
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Post by Marshall_Stanko on Dec 10, 2010 1:14:54 GMT -5
Technically, yes. What's your point? So why are you belittling your Serbian half?
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Post by terroreign on Dec 10, 2010 2:53:56 GMT -5
Crnogorci 6.905/4.232 Srbi 1.338/486 Albanci 440/276 Bošnjaci+Muslimani 963/279 Romi 614/94 From what it looks like, the only people winning are Muslims and Roma (over 600 born for every 94 deaths). Nice. If all goes well with the assimilation of Muslim Slavs in FYROM, the very same can be possibly applied to Montenegro in the future... That is from a composite of 4 years. And sorry, I don't see us being assimilated by Gypsies. lol Taking this into account, the Roma have the highest growth rate at 6.53%, with the smallest population in the municipality. The Roma are most concentrated in the Konik neighborhood of Podgorica. From this large rate there is a bit of*gap, to the Muslims and Bosniaks together who have a 3.45% growth rate. About half of the Gypsies. The muslims/bosniaks are mainly concentrated in Stara Varos neighborhood and in the Karabusko polje neighborhood of the Tuzi sub-municipality. Then close after the Muslims, the Serbs in the Podgorica municipality have a strong 2.75% growth rate. They are mainly concentrated in the Zeta sub-municipality, and Kuci region. - Interesting to note, Serbo-Montenegrin villages in Podgorica municipality are having a noticeable rise in population growth. "Goricani" with 1,205 from 919 in 1991, "Mataguzi" with 1,299 from 1,014 in 1991, "Mojanovici" with 1,850 from 1,459 in 1991, "Mahala" with 1,235 from 953 in '91, "Balabani" with 938 from 564 in 1991, and "Botun" with 717 from 527 in 1991. While the Albanians have the lowest population growth in the municipality with 1.59%. They are mainly concentrated in the Tuzi sub-municipality. - However, it is to note many Albanian villages are being depopulated for example "Benkaj" with a population of 7 in 2003, "Arza" with a population of 55, down from 182 in 1991, "Budza" with 37 down from 109, "Drume" with a pop. of 215, cut down from 663 in 1991, "Barlaj" with 47 people from 209 in 1991, "Vuksanlekici" with 276 from 570 in 91, "Skorac" with 112 down from 392 in 1991, ect. Here we come Malesija
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Post by odel on Dec 10, 2010 7:44:29 GMT -5
Hmm, weird. I've always thought that malsors had the highest birthrate of all Albanians. If there was population decline amongst Albanians in Montenegro, I would be pretty sure that there are reasons other than birthrate that are the reasons for this population decline.
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Post by MurlaniHotit on Dec 10, 2010 13:57:34 GMT -5
The concerns regarding Malesia's population are two-fold: 1) Emigration of the country, 2) Natural movement from moutainous areas to the plains.
1) Emigration out of the country Emigration by Malesors out of Montenegro started in the mid-1960's (when my father first left), with the out flow of people continously increasing from that point on until about the late 1990's. I believe the reason for the population decline is not birthrates but emigration. Most of Malesia on the Montenegrin side of the border, about 60% (more if you count the children of emigrants born in the US), live in the US, with most living in the Metro Detroit area. Of course it has slowed down since the late 1990's, but trickles of people do still attempt to leave.
Recently though, this trend has had a slight reversal, with the US deporting massive amounts of Malesors back. It's pretty entertaining when I go back to visit because the "Americans" have their own hang out spots and discuss US sports and politics. There are also some Malesors who have emigrated back voluntarily, but this is more rare, but the trend more recently among the people who have stayed behind if to just choose to stay and try to figure out a way to live rather than leave.
This process of people leaving the country entirely is more pronounced in Malesia because Tuzi (and Malesia in general) just isn't very developed and the prospects of finding a job are slim to none. There are no jobs, and the people have no control over their own affairs. Malesia's fate is resigned to hands of Podgorica, and they don't care about the best interests of Tuzi or its people (thus the need for a separate municipality). Unemployment breeds illegal activity (people still need to eat and pay bills, etc), with the smuggling of cigarettes and cows being the main occupation of the Albanians in Malesia (especially since its a border zone).
2) Natural Movement from mountainous areas to plains The second factor affecting Malesia's population is that the mountainous villages are being emptied is because a lot of Malesors either move to Tuz, or the suburbs of Podgorice (like Konik and Maslina). This process started in the 1970's and continues today. Villages being emptied out and people resettling in the flatlands is a natural process that I think would be evident everywhere, even in Montenegrin villages. The Albanian settlements mentioned above are all mountain village settlements (with the exception of Vuksanlekaj which is a settlement on the plains outside of Tuzi).
The Serb settlements that he mentions, especially the Zeta ones, such as Balabani and Mataguzhi, are not mountain settlements. These are settlements on the plains. I don't know the stats on Kuci's settlements, but I'd be shocked to see an increase in their populations. When I go back to visit, I visit some acquaintances from Kuci who settled in Zeta (which is proof of this migration towards the plains), and others who still reside in Rahoja (not sure of the Montenegrin name for this settlement in Kuci). The ones in Rahoja always complain that the mountains are being emptied because the youth want to move to the city, and that they are all abandoning their ancestral homes.
The fact of the matter is, Tuzi, Golubovci, Podgorica, and the settlements on the plains have a constant source of running water and irrigation for farming (whereas in the moutains, people still use wells), and the electricity is more stable than in the mountains (where the slightest storm knocks out power for days). These have been my experiences whenever I have visited my family who still reside in Drume.
I have witnessed Malesors leave Drume and settle in Tuz, it happens all the time. Then there are other instances where a household has multiple sons, and once one leaves he settles in Tuz or its suburbs on the plains, while the other stays up in the mountains. This again decreases the population of the mountainous areas.
With regard to how many children Malesors have, I would say we are on par with other Albanians in general. My grandfather had 9 children, 4 of them died at a very young age, and out of the surviving 5, 3 of them live in the US. This is the case with a lot of Malesor families. My father went on to have 4 children.
Still the region of Malesia still has a population of over 10,000 people, which is pretty large for Montenegro. If it were granted the status on an independent municipality, it would have a population larger than, or equivalent to the population of 8 of Montenegro's 21 municipalities.
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Post by logjiktek on Dec 10, 2010 14:14:00 GMT -5
^^^
It's actually pretty similar to the situation in FYROM where some experts believe the Albanian figure could go down to 15-18% mainly due to the high migration. I'm not exactly sure how to deal with this issue (migration to the West) that is happening on Albanian inhabited areas. One would assume that a higher standard of living will give people less incentive to leave, however, in places like Montenegro and FYROM, where the respective governments have no desire to improve the Albanian areas, I don't see how things will change. The little funds that are used by these corrupt politicians are spent on Shkja areas.
The only thing we can do for now is help the family members that live abroad with the money we are making in the diaspora.
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Post by terroreign on Dec 10, 2010 15:09:47 GMT -5
Malësia and Albanian villages in Plav and Guci are being completely depopulated. The only palces where Albanians are mantaining are Ulqin and Tuzi. This is true, but even Tuzi and Ulcinj's growth rates are weak in comparison to the other cities. This is true, Albanians do not even make up a real presence in the Rozaje region anymore. There are Montenegrin companies looking towards Malesija villages and farmland to expand vinyards and plantations for Wine production. There will definitely be investment in the area, and settlement..by Serb-Montenegrin workers. It's actually not split at all, the people interchangebly call themselves Montenegrins and Serbs, the real difference is political parties. Only 457 Albanian-Kosovo refugees live in Montenegro today, and 10,312 Serbo-Montenegrins from Kosovo. However these are dispersed across the country and can't really explain the rates in Podgorica. Yes, the depopulation of villages can be seen as due to the migration to Tuzi and Podgorica. However the average growth rate of the Albanians there "1.59%", is still the lowest in the region. This growth rate is due to the fact Albanians in the region are having fewer babies and the elders are dying off.
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Post by terroreign on Dec 10, 2010 15:53:54 GMT -5
The concerns regarding Malesia's population are two-fold: 1) Emigration of the country, 2) Natural movement from moutainous areas to the plains. And 3) fewer kids and 4) assimilating into Serbo-Montenegrins The immigration happened until the late 1990's you say. This figures are from 04-08, using only the births and deaths. Albanians are having fewer children, this is the main reason. Haha, this is intreresting Yes however there has been no significant migration from the area since 2004. Albanians aren't the only ones, Montenegrins all throughout the country have to resort to smuggling cigarettes in order to pay their bills, ect. What Malesia is facing is more or less what all of Montenegro (Besides Budva and Podgorica) are facing. Also, Tuzi was given a municipality, a sub-muncipality. Yes it is typical, however even plains villages (like Vuksanlekici) and are experiencing rapid declines. While many are facing declines, most Kuci and Brda settlements have stable populations or are experiencing growth. For example "Medun" with a population of 108 compared to 107 in 1991, "Orahovo" with 137 from 178 in 1991, "Ubli" with 341 from 339 in 1991, "Vrbica" with 117 from 104, "Bioce" with 179 from 162, ect. Yeah, this is a typical scenario and is occuring from all sides. However undoubtedly the most from the Albanian side. As I illustrated above, most Serb Mountain villages have maintained a steady population since 1991. Yeah, trust me I've experienced this in Herceg Novi! (We regularly did not have water for most of the day & showering with bottles was necessary). Same thing happens everywhere, my relatives in Plav, have land and a couple of houses, and the sons all settled elsewhere except one. Thus, one went to Podgorica for school, the other to Novi Sad, you have to go out to get proper education and get work. Can't live the village life and expect money or fame lol (Although the son that stayed in Plav now works at the bank, owns land and has a wife and kid, pretty successful). Yet from 04-05 you only had a 1.59% growth rate Of course, it is a fertile region with good weather. Still, Malesia's Albanian population is showing weak growth, compared to the Muslims/Bosniaks you are feeble. Better watch out for Tuzi not becoming little Sarajevo
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Post by terroreign on Dec 10, 2010 17:25:39 GMT -5
Albanian girls marrying Montenegrin men is a common thing, many Albanians also change their last names to integrate.
Thus you have Senad Dresevic, or example the RTCG news journalist Nebojsa Skenderi
In the Plav municipality, Albanians have their strongholds like you showed, but they are all declining.
In contrast the Montenegrin Serbs hold Murino, Brezojevica, Gornja Rzenica and Masnica which all have stable rates or are increasing.
The Bosniaks might have the most numbers in the region, however the region as a whole is having a negative growth rate. The only villages with positive growth in the region are Serb villages.
This is an unrealistic belief. The city of Podgorica is rapidly expanding, and it needs more resources and land to accommodate this. Podgorica neighborhoods around the city limits were 15 years ago not part of the city, instead villages of their own. For example Tolosi or Doljani.
This incorporation will soon enough happen to Tuzi, sooner though, to Dinosa village as the city expands from Vrela Ribnicka.
Wine is a big commodity in Montenegro, the Plantaze company being one of the most successful, owning plantations all over the Zeta and Malesija region. Once real estate becomes more expensive in the city, people will be moving out to the suburbs - to cheap suburbs, these would be the depopulated ones in Malesija.
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Post by la3ar on Dec 10, 2010 21:35:44 GMT -5
What the hell is a Montenegroin ? ,,, lool is that another way of saying you have a rocket in your pocket?...
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Post by terroreign on Dec 10, 2010 23:36:44 GMT -5
Malesia is ... essentially a mountainous region (Malesia means litteraly "Mountainous region"), and I really don't think a mountainous region will aver be populated again, especially since the people who left the area are stil owners of the properties, and don't necesseraly want to sell them. Plus don't forget Montenegro have only 620 000 inhabitants ... you won't make Podgorica any bigger than a provincial capital ... Not true. The areas around Tuzi, Vuksanlekici and Dinosa are in plains. Also, proven through the Montenegrin mountainous villages in the area showing stability and even growth, these villages can be populated. Actually Montenegro today has about 666,800 people to be more precise and has a healthy growth rate. Podgorica will have double it's population in 10 years time. Actually that's a huge lie. No names were changed, all name changing happened by the Albanians through their own free will. Thus today you have many Dresaj, Cunmulaj's, Ljuljdjuraj's in Montenegro. Albanians fantasize this just to justify why so many of their own people have Serbian last names and are assimilated. Common Albanian folktale, why don't you show some proof if you really believe in this bull. You're stupidly contradicting the whole "Albanians aren't religious" idea that you constantly argue. Montenegrins and Catholic Albanians have always been very close throughout history, proven through the works of Marko Miljanov, and brotherly relations between the Serb Kuci & Albanian Kuci e Koja, Piperi, Grudi, ect. Also I showed a common example of assimilated Albanian which you ignored since it proves you wrong well-known Monte news journalist Nebojsa Skenderi, he's mixed Monte-Alb from Podgorica, completely assimilated, 100's of other examples of this. The way you sell your daughters and babies for profit, yeah sure A one or two person drop from the census of 12 yrs prior? That isn't real decline...compared all the Bosniak and Albanian villages that have dropped by 50%. Again, the only villages with any growth in Plav region are Serb Montenegrin villages.
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Post by terroreign on Dec 10, 2010 23:37:26 GMT -5
What the hell is a Montenegroin ? ,,, lool is that another way of saying you have a rocket in your pocket?... I guess you can say that's what we got down there.
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Post by plisbardhi on Dec 11, 2010 6:36:54 GMT -5
Kurvaj, its funny watching you try to argue as if you know what you're talking about.
You don't even come off as a Montenegrin, more like some fat Australian diaspora Serb.
How much did you sell your old ethnic Montenegrin identity? And how much will it take for you to become a real African nigger?
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Post by Marshall_Stanko on Dec 11, 2010 8:55:05 GMT -5
Kurvaj, its funny watching you try to argue as if you know what you're talking about. You don't even come off as a Montenegrin, more like some fat Australian diaspora Serb. How much did you sell your old ethnic Montenegrin identity? And how much will it take for you to become a real African n**g**r? Plisgovnarhi, how long will it take untill you admit your inner Albanimal side?? Go back into the wild of the jungle primarily in Africa where you Albanimals belong or else you Albanimals will end up in a ZOO, in a locked up solitary environment.
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