Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Dec 28, 2010 3:23:28 GMT -5
i've been dying to find evidence and info about those "Baiunetes" which supposedly lived in my lands to no avail. Loads of signs from internet, no signs from the most specialized books. That's not a good thing. I used to believe i started tracing the path of Bosnian/Krasnici Serbs, but i dont seem to find the material i'd really want.
The Epirotan Slavs must have been close to the peloponesian ones, as they most probably crossed peloponese by sea from the western side rather than Corinth in the east.
Indeed the toponyms of Epirus/Peloponese demonstrate a higher ressemblence rather than the toponyms of Makedonia.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Dec 29, 2010 22:05:42 GMT -5
"Post-1945, The trend is there."
Thats correct Pyrro. Those maps from Babylon were created, most likely, from an American organisation (10 years ago). I don't take them seriously. I ask Babylon to do some serious research, as we have done, to take note of the time when Southern Serbia began to be called a region of BuLgari.
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Post by rusebg on Dec 30, 2010 5:13:44 GMT -5
Bre! Do Serbs in Leskovac say this with such a long 'e' so they resemble a sheep? I don't think so.
When have you done it, Pazar? In the breaks between your lessons in Serbian? Lol, you really think of yourself as some sort of researcher, don't you?
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Post by Novi Pazar on Dec 30, 2010 22:47:11 GMT -5
^ Ruseche, there hasn't been nothing from you because you know nothing.....l'm even sure you don't even know what nothing is.
PS Year of the Rabbit is just around the corner, send my well wishes to Tengri, thanks.
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Post by rusebg on Dec 31, 2010 5:07:03 GMT -5
Tangra, please accept the well wishes of Pazar! He is going to sacrifice a kangaroo in your honour. I know it is too much but you are also a very generous god, so please give Pazar wisdom or at least some basic knowledge for a start.
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Post by andromeda on Dec 31, 2010 6:42:03 GMT -5
My lab assistant is Serbian from somewhere deep in Serbia , I think she said Vranje or something. I just know its in the east ( I regret not being more familiar with Serbia's geography but I never been there yet) and just for laughs I told her about a couple Serbians here aggressively hating on Bulgarians, like even worse than the typical antagonism you see with Cros vs Serbs or some combination thereof. She laughed. She said Serbians and Bulgarians are complete harmony where she comes from and do not fight about the things talked about here. Bulgarians and Serbs are virtually identical , perhaps more than even Croats and Serbs because of the majority religious commonalities and languages are intelligible if you really pay attention ( Bulgarians understand Serbs better than vice versa since some of the dialects spoken in parts of Serbia and Macedonia are , in fact , Bulgarian. Anyway, judging on the small amount of vernacular produced in Serbia for the last umpteen centuries, I believe Serbs and Bulgarians used to probably speak the same language more or less but it was still distinct from other Slavic speech , even that far back )
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Dec 31, 2010 15:53:37 GMT -5
Bulgarians and Serbs are virtually identical , perhaps more than even Croats and Serbs because of the majority religious commonalities and languages are intelligible if you really pay attention ( Bulgarians understand Serbs better than vice versa since some of the dialects spoken in parts of Serbia and Macedonia are , in fact , Bulgarian. Anyway, judging on the small amount of vernacular produced in Serbia for the last umpteen centuries, I believe Serbs and Bulgarians used to probably speak the same language more or less but it was still distinct from other Slavic speech , even that far back ) Bulls**t. You're just provoking a response whereby it would make Serbs appear to have some sort of desire to prove they are closer to Croats. Only a minority of Serbs (the Torlaks) can be seen as being closer to Bulgarians then to Croats. Perhaps you are one of those Croats who thinks Croatia is not in the Balkans and perhaps also in Western Europe. More likely just one of those Croats who's identity concept runs along the anti-thesis... We are not slavs, we are not in the Balkans etc. And using your language logic we should also perhaps really consider that Croats are a fusion of more distinct and separate slavic/ethnic peoples considering the more comprehensive differences found in their own languages.
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Post by srbobran on Dec 31, 2010 16:21:33 GMT -5
I'd have to agree with Arsenije here, I consider Serbs and Bulgarians to be kin, but overall, most Serbs are definitely closer to Croats. Our language and culture are more similar, although if you ask me with regards to Serbs, Croats, Bulgarians, Bosnians etc , same shit different pile.
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Post by andromeda on Dec 31, 2010 17:53:04 GMT -5
Bulgarians and Serbs are virtually identical , perhaps more than even Croats and Serbs because of the majority religious commonalities and languages are intelligible if you really pay attention ( Bulgarians understand Serbs better than vice versa since some of the dialects spoken in parts of Serbia and Macedonia are , in fact , Bulgarian. Anyway, judging on the small amount of vernacular produced in Serbia for the last umpteen centuries, I believe Serbs and Bulgarians used to probably speak the same language more or less but it was still distinct from other Slavic speech , even that far back ) Bulls**t. You're just provoking a response whereby it would make Serbs appear to have some sort of desire to prove they are closer to Croats. Only a minority of Serbs (the Torlaks) can be seen as being closer to Bulgarians then to Croats. Perhaps you are one of those Croats who thinks Croatia is not in the Balkans and perhaps also in Western Europe. More likely just one of those Croats who's identity concept runs along the anti-thesis... We are not slavs, we are not in the Balkans etc. And using your language logic we should also perhaps really consider that Croats are a fusion of more distinct and separate slavic/ethnic peoples considering the more comprehensive differences found in their own languages. Easy there , I think you're not understanding me completely. First off , I am not trying to provoke a response like the one you gave me. I was merely pointing out the fact that Serbs have certain things in common with Bulgarians and Macedonians that they don't share with Croats ( arguably their closest 'kin') I fully acknowledge the same and/or similar culture of Croats and Serbs and don't make a big deal of trying to point out the differences. In fact I think its a little silly how far some Serbs and Croats would go just to prove how different they really are! Although virtually all Croat and Serb speakers communicate in a merged language ( intelligible i.e. you understand the Croatian I speak , I understand the Serbian you speak etc.) there are deep schisms that divide the two cultures that are ironically created without their own doing. Serbs and Bulgarians do not suffer from these same schisms which is mainly the religious one. On top of that Serbs and Bulgarians have long reconciled their differences and it seems that most Bulgarian and Serbian people are at peace about a separate FYROM identity even if they might quibble about details. The venom spat by Novi and Pyrros towards Bulgarians is unique in the sense that most Serbs would regard Bulgarians and Bulgarian culture as friendly and even similar. Btw , I consider Croatia part of the Balkans. Almost any Croatian town or village is almost identical to a Bosnian or Serbian one as is the folklore. However, Croatian culture is that combined with other elements unique to it such as the mixture with Central Europe and Italy which helps add to Croatia's appeal to tourism. When Western + Central Europeans vacation in Croatia its not like they are completely away from home in uncharted territory. Zagreb and Dalmatia appear very similar to Austria/Germany and Italy but with a Balkan twist which also adds to its appeal. Croatia is where Central-Southern Europe meets Balkans.
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Post by andromeda on Dec 31, 2010 17:55:14 GMT -5
I'd have to agree with Arsenije here, I consider Serbs and Bulgarians to be kin, but overall, most Serbs are definitely closer to Croats. Our language and culture are more similar, although if you ask me with regards to Serbs, Croats, Bulgarians, Bosnians etc , same s**t different pile. I tend to agree. I simply pointed out that on the religious side of things , Bulgarians and Serbs are closer which is true. And its not a minor thing since religion did help shape much of the of the modern identities. Likewise there are things that Croats have more in common with Slovenes than they do with Serbs but nobody said that means Serbs and Croats are completely different.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Dec 31, 2010 20:31:05 GMT -5
Guys, when the BuLgari clean up their aggressive attitude towards the serbs and stop claiming half of serbia as theirs then my attitude will change. The buck doesn't stop with the serbian nation but with the stupid BuLgari.
PS look through history and you will see Serbs and Serbia never had territorial ambitions on the BuLgari, O.K!.
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Post by andromeda on Dec 31, 2010 21:30:33 GMT -5
Novi you really lost your mind. In the real world there is no real animosity between Bulgarians and Serbians. If Bulgarians *really* wanted half of Serbia for themselves don't you think they would've made a move during the wars in the 90s when Serbia was at its weakest? Theres not even any indication that such a plan was on the table anyway. lol. I think its more about you. This obsession you have with finding enemies where there are none is mind bogglingly funny , and sad. Perhaps because this forum lacks enough 'traditional Serb enemies' like Cros , Bosniaks , ( and the Albanians just don't seem to care enough) you see an opportunity to pick fights with forum Bulgarians since there are some here. Must be some kind of identity crisis you have. Nobody , including the Bugari or BuLgari are out to get you. lol PS and OT , My gf is Portuguese/Brazilian too.
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Post by ulf on Dec 31, 2010 22:01:14 GMT -5
"Perhaps because this forum lacks enough 'traditional Serb enemies' like Cros , Bosniaks "
You're right, in that case Serbian forum would need another moderator just in order to remove all the idiotisms that would regular Croats and Bosniaks post(a logic that is only know to the aforementioned, or better to say absence of logic)
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Post by andromeda on Dec 31, 2010 22:08:03 GMT -5
"Perhaps because this forum lacks enough 'traditional Serb enemies' like Cros , Bosniaks " You're right, in that case Serbian forum would need another moderator just in order to remove all the idiotisms that would regular Croats and Bosniaks post(a logic that is only know to the aforementioned, or better to say absence of logic) I'm not getting what you're trying to say here. Sorry.
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Post by ulf on Dec 31, 2010 22:11:20 GMT -5
I'm talking about the possible feuds
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Post by andromeda on Dec 31, 2010 22:21:08 GMT -5
I try not to feud with anyone. To be truthful I despise nationalism of any variant whether it be Pax American 'War on Terror' Croatian , Serbian , etc. ( same with Religion) I was honest and let people know I am Croatian and it seems that I'm judged on that fact more than what I actually say. I'm not surprised though, enlightenment is a painfully slow process among Balkanoids.
I totally agree , any Cro , Serb , Bosniak , or whatever with a nationalistic predisposition are likely to feud but all it really is two similar but rival human conditionings of the mind combating each other. Sad , really.
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Post by Babylon Enigma on Jan 2, 2011 18:34:54 GMT -5
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Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jan 3, 2011 3:59:59 GMT -5
Bre! Do Serbs in Leskovac say this with such a long 'e' so they resemble a sheep? I don't think so. Dont confuse the ones who say "Beeee" (the bulgarians) with the ones who say "Breeeee" (Humans).
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Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jan 3, 2011 4:03:36 GMT -5
Guys, when the BuLgari clean up their aggressive attitude towards the serbs and stop claiming half of serbia as theirs then my attitude will change. The buck doesn't stop with the serbian nation but with the stupid BuLgari. PS look through history and you will see Serbs and Serbia never had territorial ambitions on the BuLgari, O.K!. How many times did we propose a complete cease-fire and they rejected it?
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Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Jan 3, 2011 4:06:15 GMT -5
The existence of the Dregovic/Dragovic/Drugovic (which could very well be derived from THREE totally unrelated Slavic words) have nothing to do with the maps. Separate concepts, separate problems. Now regarding toponyms, although slavic concentration is a very good tool in studying possible correlations, we must remember that the Slavic studies by Max Vasmer were done in ~ 1940+, many years after the massive renamings of 1926/1927. E.g. if now Epiros, Peloponese, each, count 400->450 slavic toponyms, the numbers were much bigger before 1926. Even today i discover (every time i go there) toponyms not included by Max Vasmer. (e.g. Sklivani, Gistova to name a few recent ones found)
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