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Post by uz on Jan 22, 2012 13:28:34 GMT -5
(AP) ZAGREB, Croatia — Croatians voted Sunday in a referendum on whether to join the European Union — a test of how much the debt-stricken 27-nation bloc has lost in its appeal among aspiring new members because of its crisis.Those who are for the EU say their Balkan country's troubled economy — burdened by recession, a euro48-billion ($61-billion) foreign debt and a 17 percent unemployment rate — will revive due to access to wider European markets and job opportunities that the membership should bring.
"It's a big moment in our history ... we are joining more successful countries in Europe," Croatia's President Ivo Josipovic said after casting his ballot, adding that he expects a "Yes" vote in the referendum.Opponents say Croatia has nothing to gain by entering the bloc, which is fighting off the bankruptcy of some of its members. They say that Croatia will only lose its sovereignty and the national identity it fought for in a war for independence from Yugoslavia in the 1990s.
"I voted against because I don't think we'll do well in the EU," said university student Matea Kolenc, 23. "I heard a lot of bad things about the EU, its economic situation and what it has to offermore: www.cbsnews.com/8301-505245_162-57363449/croats-vote-in-eu-membership-referendum/
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Post by uz on Jan 22, 2012 13:31:30 GMT -5
Croatian Serbs hope EU entry will guarantee rightsDVOR, Croatia — Ethnic Serbs who went to war in a bid to prevent Croatia's independence are expected to endorse its EU membership this weekend, hoping it will improve their prospects and protect their rights.Brussels represents "an additional authority where (Croatian Serbs) can claim their rights. ... It's a kind of guarantee," Nikola Arbutina, Dvor's mayor, told AFP ahead of a nationwide referendum this Sunday on EU membership.
He said the six-year-long accession talks during which the EU insisted on the protection of ethnic Serbs and their right to return to their pre-war homes "improved the status and the perception of the Serb community".www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iDIldbbg3JcpHAte73p7vbZzJm3g?docId=CNG.c50b5df4da12e13528e5efca15ec436e.411
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Post by Anittas on Jan 22, 2012 15:53:12 GMT -5
Congratulations, Croatia!
I just read the same news article on Yahoo. I liked this part:
"Croatia's pro-government media have also tried to scare Croatians by saying that if they reject the EU, they would have to return to some sort of a Balkan union with their former wartime foes, Serbia, which has been struggling to gain a candidacy status in the bloc."
Scary indeed!
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Post by uz on Jan 22, 2012 16:04:28 GMT -5
Congratulations, Croatia! I just read the same news article on Yahoo. I liked this part: "Croatia's pro-government media have also tried to scare Croatians by saying that if they reject the EU, they would have to return to some sort of a Balkan union with their former wartime foes, Serbia, which has been struggling to gain a candidacy status in the bloc." Scary indeed! LOL I like that part too.
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Post by uz on Jan 22, 2012 17:40:00 GMT -5
Croatia's state referendum commission said that with nearly all ballots counted, about 66 percent of those who took part in the referendum answered "yes" to the question: "Do you support the membership of the Republic of Croatia in the European Union?"About 33 percent were against, while the rest of the ballots were invalid. About 47 percent of eligible voters took part in the referendum, illustrating voters' apathy toward the EU. That compares to 84 percent who voted in a referendum for Croatia's independence from the former Yugoslavia in 1992.The EU congratulated Croatians on their vote, saying it's good news for the whole Balkan region. "The upcoming accession of Croatia sends a clear signal to the whole region of southeastern Europe," it said in a statement. "It shows that through political courage and determined reforms, EU membership is within reach." Croatian anti-EU activists were furious."The turnout shows that Croatia has turned its back on the EU," said war veteran Zeljko Sacic, who led a campaign against membership. "This referendum is illegitimate. We will never recognize it." www.newsday.com/news/croatia-says-yes-to-eu-membership-1.3470343
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Post by uz on Jan 22, 2012 17:50:48 GMT -5
interesting read, not sure what to make of it. Police have clashed with anti-EU demonstrators in Croatia a day ahead of the country’s referendum on whether it will attempt to join the union. Meanwhile, a recent survey shows that about 40 per cent of Croatians oppose entering the EU.People are “protesting because they see the European Union not delivering its side of the deal – and the deal is free trade and jobs,” he explained.He also points to the EU’s vast economic problems as one a reason why so many Croatians are against joining. “Ultimately there is economic chaos within the European Union at the moment, driven from the Eurozone – and that is not to the advantage of Croatian citizens.”“The problem is that the European Union really cannot solve its internal problems at the moment. Rather, it is in total denial about a problem – about the Euro,” he concluded.“If now they say, ‘No, we’d rather wait’, they might be waiting forever, and that’s the risk they – at least the political class in Croatia – does not mean to take. What strikes me is that all the political parties represented in parliament are for EU accession – all the manifestations that we see are done by organizations that are not present in it.”www.infowars.com/croatian-police-clash-with-anti-eu-protesters-ahead-of-referendum/---- Croats pray to stay out of the EUSome people in Croatia have been praying to the Virgin Mary to save them from entering the EU. A billboard has been placed aside the road at the entrance of the Adriatic port of Split showing the image of Virgin Mary, stating: "Save us from entering the EU". The billboard also declares that the EU will bring "GM food, chemicals, the culture of death and other evil things". www.croatiantimes.com/news/General_News/2011-01-12/16405/Croats_pray_to_stay_out_of_the_EU---- Croatia in the EU: A Disaster Waiting to HappenIn the late 19th century, someone asked Bismarck what would cause the next great European war. “Some damn thing in the Balkans,” he presciently answered. Today, events in that region are no less consequential if we remember that Greece, now roiling global markets, is also a Balkan state.Unfortunately, it might get much worse.
In 2013, another Balkan nation, Croatia, is scheduled to join the European Union. Unless that country cleans house before then, another hobbled economy will add its weight to the EU, exacerbating the problems that already exist. There will be more debt, more burden on EU taxpayers, more risk of loan defaults, and more downward pressure on U.S. markets inextricably linked to European markets.Since 2003-2004, Croatia and the EU have been preparing for that nation’s membership, delayed in part by Slovenian concerns over border issues. As we get nearer to 2013, much attention has been given Croatia’s economic problems, including a warning from central bank Governor Zeljko Rohatinski that it must cut more waste to avoid an economic crash.Yet one rising star of Croatian politics points to deeper systemic malignancies beyond such familiar concerns over the fiscal problems of a modern welfare state (including a 20% unemployment rate in Croatia). Natasha Srdoc, founder and chair of the Adriatic Institute for Public Policy (AI), is a compelling figure if only because she’s also directly addressing what is now a top-priority initiative for global regulators: anticorruption.
If the many reports are accurate, corruption in Croatia is ruthless and systemic in a way that altogether changes the dialogue from “how” Croatia should enter the EU, to “if” Croatia should enter the EU. As things purportedly stand now, Croatian membership in the EU would be another liability that we cannot afford to add to our ongoing exposure in Greece. EU membership could prove a disaster for the Croatian people as well.... more: www.forbes.com/sites/richardlevick/2011/10/27/croatia-in-the-eu-a-disaster-waiting-to-happen/--- so much conflicting views coming from the media.
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Post by Emperor AAdmin on Jan 22, 2012 23:30:17 GMT -5
Curtesy of my Croatian friend ;D
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Post by Emperor AAdmin on Jan 23, 2012 0:34:35 GMT -5
interesantno Jako slab odaziv građana na referendum! 22. januar 2012. Referendum o ulasku Hrvatske u Europsku uniju odvija se na ukupno 6.749 biračkih mjesta u zemlji i inozemstvu, a DIP je objavio rezultate iz kojih je vidljivo da je odaziv jako slab. Naime, do do 11 sati je na referendum izašlo samo 11,44 posto građana. Od 7 sati ujutro otvorena su biračka mjesta u Hrvatskoj i inozemstvu te se građani izjašnjavali žele li Hrvatsku u Europskoj uniji. Referendumu može pristupiti više od 4,5 milijuna građana, a prvi neslužbeni rezultati biti će poznati oko 22 sata.
Svoje glasove već su dali predsjednik Ivo Josipović, premijer Zoran Milanović i Jadranka Kosor, a iz Državnog izbornog povjerenstva su poručili da je do 11 sati glasalo je 443.623 birača, što predstavlja 11,44 posto od ukupnog broja birača s obrađenih glasačkih mjesta.
Najveći odaziv zabilježen je u Zagrebačkoj i Krapinsko-zagorskoj županiji, a najmanji u Vukovarsko-srijemskoj.
Također, doznaje se da za sada nije zabilježen niti jedan incident, a referendum prolazi glatko i bez zabilježenih nepravilnosti. Ako se prvi rezultati odaziva na referendum usporedi s nedavnim rezultatima izbora, dolazi se do podatka da je dosadašnji odaziv građana slabiji za gotovo pet posto. Naime, do 11 sati na birališta je 4. prosinca prošle godine izašlo 16,39 posto birača. Izvor: Danas.hr www.e-balkan.net/drustvo-svijet/12267-jako-slab-odaziv-graana-na-referendum.html
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Post by uz on Jan 23, 2012 17:55:30 GMT -5
^ I wonder what would be the reason or explanation for those who refused to participate.
Also if anyone knows, since Croatia is said to be entering the EU officially in July of 2013 what is the law or rule if things start getting more sour in the EU realm and more people (in Croatia) start voicing oposing feelings, can they somehow withdraw?
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Post by Anittas on Jan 23, 2012 18:07:52 GMT -5
Yes, a country can withdraw from the EU, but as far as I know, there's no mechanism to describe the process of withdrawing in detail. As of now, there's no need to worry about Croatia withdrawing from the EU which they are to join in 2013. We should worry more about Greece and the state the EU will find itself in 2013.
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Post by uz on Jan 23, 2012 18:16:11 GMT -5
I highly doubt it will come to Croatia wanting to withdraw, especially since not one political party in Croatia (as far as I know) is against the EU. This is what the opposition was protesting about mainly, arguing that they're voice wasn't heard at all. I wish Croatia and her people the best despite my personal thoughts on what the European Union is really about.
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Post by srbobran on Jan 23, 2012 18:38:03 GMT -5
R.I.P Croatia.
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Post by uz on Jan 23, 2012 18:43:45 GMT -5
from what i'm reading at least the Serbs of Croatia are happy about it.
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Post by Anittas on Jan 23, 2012 20:42:10 GMT -5
I highly doubt it will come to Croatia wanting to withdraw, especially since not one political party in Croatia (as far as I know) is against the EU. This is what the opposition was protesting about mainly, arguing that they're voice wasn't heard at all. I wish Croatia and her people the best despite my personal thoughts on what the European Union is really about. I'm sure the opposition is free to create their own party with an anti-EU agenda. They can't expect other parties to adopt an anti-EU stance if it's not part of their policy. Still, there was a referendum and the Yes-side won overwhelmingly, so no one can claim that the democratic process was not put to use. If, in the future, the opposition to the EU grows to greater proportions, I'm sure that some anti-EU party will form, just like they have in UK and a score of other countries. Those kind of parties are sending their members of the Parliament to work for an exit strategy for their country from the EU. Most of the time, these parties colaborate with one another. I believe there were serious talks of holding a referendum in England over continuous EU membership. Cameron argued that it would be poor taste to hold such a vote in a moment of crisis, but sure enough they will have one. The EU has come to a point when it needs to be further centralized in order to function properly. Indeed, the very survival of the EU depends on further centralization. Those countries that will oppose such a move will be asked to leave. It's just a matter of time. The EU needs loyal countries, not flip-floppers that will bail out as soon as trouble emerges. The same criticism can be said to be directed towards Sarkozy and Merkel who opposed having Romania and Bulgaria joining the Schengen in 2010 and 2011.
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Post by srbobran on Jan 23, 2012 21:43:04 GMT -5
Yeah centralization at the cost of a people's autonomy and self determination is always a great thing.
Isn't that why the Croats left Yugoslavia? This is all very confusing to me.
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Post by uz on Jan 23, 2012 21:49:33 GMT -5
"Croatia's pro-government media have also tried to scare Croatians by saying that if they reject the EU, they would have to return to some sort of a Balkan union with their former wartime foes, Serbia, which has been struggling to gain a candidacy status in the bloc."
That's why I find this quote from the news amusing to read. I guess Croatia's destiny was to be colonized with somebody and to not actually be independant.
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Post by srbobran on Jan 23, 2012 22:01:00 GMT -5
^Its ludicrous.
And I don't know why Croats would have to enter a union with us, why can't they just strive be independent of us and the greater powers? Makes no sense to me.
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Post by uz on Jan 23, 2012 22:07:31 GMT -5
And the first thing their president annouces after the result is all the cuts that are up ahead and reforms in law.
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Post by Anittas on Jan 23, 2012 22:20:44 GMT -5
"Colonized with somebody"? That makes no sense. Croatia is not going to be colonized by anyone. The EU is a union, no one was forced to join. The Croats voted to join the union. Most countries are proud of being a part of the EU, even if they disagree with some policies. You guys are anti-EU just because you accuse Germany of dissolving Yugoslavia and due to the recognition of Kosovo by the European powers.
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Post by uz on Jan 23, 2012 22:29:20 GMT -5
Not really, I think we're passed that. I just think the EU is a threat to a nations sovereignity.
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