Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 15:20:12 GMT -5
And he's Victorian too, he get's my vote! :-)
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 15:18:23 GMT -5
Why didn't they do this 20 years ago ? Good on them, they should set up camp there for a few weeks.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 15:16:57 GMT -5
I wouldn't be seen dead in one of thoose lol.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 15:15:04 GMT -5
lol lead by example.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 13:34:30 GMT -5
lol he is indeed.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 13:33:44 GMT -5
hmmm, and the melody to stay the same or new one? About the more the best part of it to enjoy is driving in it and out in a matter of minutes; cause in my heart the best part physically, culturally and beauty wise of Bosnia is inland. The rivers, the mountains.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 11:41:18 GMT -5
Well I know what you mean about Tose...what a soulful voice he had; but his eyes and lips wow... The above guy, hmmm don;t care really he's got a big nose lol :-)
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 10, 2009 11:37:01 GMT -5
ohhhhhhhhhh faz i manijak, vi znate o cemu ja pricam; opet niste glupi. Clearly my ancestors didn't want to sell out. I do not practice my religion in any way; however I am at awe as to how anyone regarless of ethnicity or religion in our region werea able to keep their faith and traditions going for hundreds of years; under different regimes and different migrations. Again it's a selfless act. It had very little to do with spirituality which is why the Bosnjaks converted, however those who remained true to their faith kept it because it was shape up or ship out; which is what many did to keep true to themselves.
manijak pa onda ovijek su prodali sebe eh? od bosne do hrvatske, par puta...onda kod kengure...smijesan si :-)
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 19:09:54 GMT -5
Clearly some didn't have faith so how can you change and believe fully in the next one lol read my post above. Why convert if you don't have faith and spirit in a religion you were born into to then convert to ANY OTHER RELIGION godamit!!! but the Bartolovics from Bosna who migrated to Slavonija in the 16th CENTURY clearly did have faith and we remain Catholics to this day! :-)
About the migrations, read any book NOT written by Croats or Bosnjaks and there is your proof; so don't play dumb.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 18:58:51 GMT -5
lol women already critisice eachother and now men do, until we are seen as more than an attraction we'll get no where in the public world!...I like her name lol....hope she has good policies!
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 15:15:57 GMT -5
A better friggen life, they worked just as hard in Australia as they did back home; but for more than a piece of meat per day. For their own sanity and peace...my grandmother lives on a massive property; has everything she needs; but still lives with an old mentality. Use what you can grow; save for a rainy day. Nothing has changed, but here she is in peace and with all of her family around her. If she stayed in Croatia no doubt my father would have moved onto a larger city or country, my aunts to another...and what; everyone would be dispersed. As I said it was a selfless act; but then again she did what dida said :-)
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 15:03:46 GMT -5
First of all, we can continue this discussion via PM because you clearly don't understand my thoughts...in a sec. :-)
Secondly, I did not travel to a far away land in which I did not know the language or culture. My wonderful granparents did with their young children (which I thank them personally every time I see them). They did not sell who they were at any time and were not paid to do so (in fact the old Yugoslav govt received benefits from the Australian govt, FACTUALLY enough to release people who wished to leave after about 1967, beforehand it was harder to leave). They did so because they decided to bring up their children in a free, peaceful country full of opportunity rather than staying in a country that didn't recognise their hard efforts. This is not selling your soul or changing beliefs for ones gain. This is common sense to keep their family together, in a happy properous environment. This is again, why I thank everyrytime I enjoy peace with them, talk, enjoy food and coffee with them. That I am grateful of. I am also grateful to be alive everytime I hear the story my baka tells me of the air bomb that did not explode next to her bed in '42. I am happy to be alive. What they did was not going against their country or their friends, family, or religion. What they did was a positive and selfless act for their children and future grandchildren; not opportunistic. They did not receive payment or discounts from either government to move to a country 20,000km from their homeland. They had to start with nothing, nada not one cent.
manijak, people are not sell outs. Sounds like a sermen a priest gave us back during the war telling the whole congregation that we are all sell outs and they we should all sell up and ship back to Croatia (like you are going to take you're whole family back to a country when you and you're family have 20 years in a new country), whilst we were rallying for a better Bosnia and Croatia from day one since we settled in Australia. And not only supported voluntarily with time but also monetarily; these countries would have been nothing without the WHOLE support of the diaspora. This priest was clearly a dickhead. :-)
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 14:14:48 GMT -5
Ok first of all, because I question history, religion and politics; it is because I want to learn and I want to learn the truth. In this case I am not against Islam or the Bosnian identity; so don't take it like many do here "Oh you are the enemy". I am not the enemy or AGAINST BOSNIA. I am seeking and projecting the truth.
A soul is lost when you sell out what you believe in for a benefit, or just because other's expect that from you. i.e doing only as your parents tell you, or doing something against the law for monetary benefit; changing your religious beliefs is the same. Hope that makes sense.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 13:44:07 GMT -5
Ok an example. In a current day situation in the western world, if I was to convert religions : People would be asking me, "why on earth when you don't even believe and have faith in your own religion 100%, would you convert to another"? Makes sense which is why I wouldn't change. The people of the Balkans choose another path because it was the flavour of the month and they would have received benefits and felt a part of the group as other's were doing it around them. That among many other reasons.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 13:35:17 GMT -5
Damn I missed watching it, was out and about with my Bosnian bodyguard!!! :-) But I guessed to scoreline...
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 13:34:08 GMT -5
Basically the Bosnians sold out and mostly adopted this new religion in favour of the one they clearly did not believe in. There is proof of mass migrations from Croats into Bosnia (who LATER converted to Islam) and Croats from Bosna to Croatia (who KEPT their Catholic roots). I mean if you have amazing faith in your own religion and it's bringing you peace and happiness; why would you convert? People did it because it was convienient and there was something to gain from it. Therefore they sold their beliefs and souls. There are document showing the deportation of Croats and Bosnians out of the region; but as we know it did happen without consent. But for some reason the majority want to hide this fact as a part of our history.
thracian08, your point is meaningless. They wanted to rule and be a stronghold like all other empires before and after. If they had succeeded, which they didn't; then yes a majority of the Balkans and other regions of Europe would have converted.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 13:22:59 GMT -5
lol zvone nije sparta ahahahahaha...
Mig, you should go to Japan, it's really super. I have been twice once when I was 16 on school exchange and once later to revisit my host family.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 6:06:03 GMT -5
Well I'd like to post some pics of the Macedonian men I have come across but alas I will refrain. There have been some beaties!!! The best one up there by far is Kristijan...man what hair!!! I love Tose...I mean who doesn't??? :-)
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 5:52:21 GMT -5
I'll be buying a copy soon.
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Trazi Vise
Amicus
Today's "church" has NOTHING to do with religion.
Posts: 3,126
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Post by Trazi Vise on Jun 9, 2009 5:50:58 GMT -5
I have deleted all responses, as all of them on all sides were very distasteful!
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