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Post by szorostalpu1 on Dec 23, 2008 16:12:51 GMT -5
"The numbers have nothing to do with the rights of minorities. " really....then why are govn't functions, schooling in ones mother tongue only allowed...and bilingual signs only posted when Hungarians constitute more then 20% of the population in a city or town. What a convenient law since all the major cities in Transylvania which had Magyar majorities have now been diluted by wallachian and moldavian colonists. oh the hypocrisy of this olah "Your both versions are wrong. AGAIN." well what do you people like to be called then... since you've changed your names several times throughout history? dacs,vlachs,ruman,rouman,români" ?? how about the Magyar version....hulye cigany lol
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Post by Dragos Voda on Dec 23, 2008 18:02:39 GMT -5
Really, Wikipedia is biased? Although mostly controlled by Hungarians during the last millennium, Transylvania had been a multi-ethnic region with Hungarian, Romanian, Saxon (German) and other inhabitants (inter alia, Pechenegs, Cumans, Berendeys, Khwarizmian and Armenian immigrants) since medieval times. In spite of Magyarization policies by the Hungarian government after the Ausgleich in 1867, ethnic Romanians remained in the majority. At Babeş-Bolyai University Cluj-Napoca, the largest state-funded tertiary education institution in Romania, more than 30% of courses are held in the Hungarian language. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarian_minority_in_RomaniaSapienta University was set up in 2001 as a private and independent Hungarian-language university with four branch campuses in Transylvania: Cluj (Kolozsvar), Targu Mures (Marosvasarhely), Miercurea-Ciuc (Csikszereda) and Oradea (Nagyvarad). The last one is ran today as a separate Hungarian language institution known as the Partium Christian University. www6.gencat.net/llengcat/noves/hm04tardor/docs/constantin.pdfIt's true that Hungary has a unique minority self-government system. However this is not because it loves its minorities so much, but because of the Hungarians living in neighbor states. The logic being that if Hungary changed it's policies towards minorities than they have a right to demand that their neighbors change their policies also. I don't think it's because Hungarians are so much more tolerant, they only did what was in their self interest. If they didn't benefit from granting rights to minorities they wouldn't have done it.
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yeni
Moderator
gulash freak
Posts: 327
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Post by yeni on Dec 23, 2008 18:06:02 GMT -5
What rights should we give them what they don’t have currently and they demand? They already have the rights, they should use them more if they don’t want their language to disappear . They can use their language legally in every part of their life. But what should Hungary do? Force them to speak Romanian?
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Post by lvl100 on Dec 23, 2008 18:29:33 GMT -5
"The numbers have nothing to do with the rights of minorities. " really....then why are govn't functions, schooling in ones mother tongue only allowed...and bilingual signs only posted when Hungarians constitute more then 20% of the population in a city or town. What a convenient law since all the major cities in Transylvania which had Magyar majorities have now been diluted by wallachian and moldavian colonists. So what minimum limit you propose for biligual signs ? A minimum 0,1% is it good for you ? That law makes sense becouse its affects a whole city, so of course you need to be an important minority, otherwise every plate would have 8 names for the same city. How about to learn how to spell your cussing after the TODAY`s rules ? Maybe that way you will avoid looking like that.
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Dec 23, 2008 22:39:55 GMT -5
"so of course you need to be an important minority,"
yeah...Hungarians are an important minority, considering the FACT that Transylvania was either a part of Hungary or an independent Hungarian principality for over 1000 yrs. and was given to you români unjustly through deciet and treachery in 1920.
"So what minimum limit you propose "
you're the one that said "numbers have nothing do with minority rights" ...idiot do you have memory lapses?
"How about to learn how to spell " "biligual signs "
hulye cigany...lol
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Post by lvl100 on Dec 24, 2008 2:09:42 GMT -5
"so of course you need to be an important minority," yeah...Hungarians are an important minority, considering the FACT that Transylvania was either a part of Hungary or an independent Hungarian principality for over 1000 yrs. and was given to you români unjustly through deciet and treachery in 1920. Yeah , history is nice. Bilingual signs are more an aesthetic part than "minority rights". I was referring to the important ones , like the right to speak your own language and so on. And here it shoulnd matter the numbers. But as usually you decide to choose a moot point, as long is not viable for any country to write their town names in 8 languages. But, that doesn't make invalid the other rights, so my idea stands. Hmm intersting, the same racist slurs about gypsy. You poor thing, i`m sure the dissolving of Hungarian Guard ruined your world. Dont worry, you will survive and i`m sure you find another extremist organisation to join.
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wbb
Moderator
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Post by wbb on Dec 24, 2008 2:43:41 GMT -5
Hey Romanians, let me explain it to you this once and for all, Romanians in Hungary, expecially in Mehkerek or Michirechi or whateva fukin stupid language u using for a typical Hungarian town with Romanian majority have everything there!!! school, orthodox churches, houses they owned under their typical romanian names, Olah utca, Avram Iancu utca, (utca=street in Hungarian), what da fuk else u want? Some of them in Mehkerek even put romanian flags front of their houses (errrm it's suppose to be illegal but we let them) which romanians dont let hungarians to do so in Transylvania, i been there 2 times, i've seen it, all those Romanians live quite well and they are far more educated than all of u ultra xenophobic romanians. These Romanians dont favour lust for Greater Romania like u guys do, these romanians work, raise their family and live in reality not fantasy. Why the language slowly dissapearing? i got the answer for that, because most young romanians speak hungarian better or as their mother language, only the romanian oldies speak romanian, many of them speak far better hungarian than romanian, they are assimilated and well integrated, they are not hostile in Hungary like ur friken gypsy roma cousin of urs and the jews ( ur greatest friend). We treat those romanians with love and respect as we treat our own people. Now many Romanians decide to become Magyar sooner or later, what a miracle!!! All because of our kind warm heart, not like in Romania where treat Magyar as aliens, no wonder why Magyars in Transylvania never want to assimilate. There's a big difference here, forced assimilation and volunteer assimilation, Romanians in Hungary are volunteer assimilated. I would wonder what those romanians in Hungary would say if any of u guys will talk chit about Hungary, i can guarantee you all they will bash the chit out of ya right in front of ur wife and ur mother to see, and huh!!! They are exactly the same romanians like u guys are.
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wbb
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Post by wbb on Dec 24, 2008 3:11:46 GMT -5
Look what i found, pictures of Mehkerek. Casasatuluihehe, a good proof for Romanians who want to cause trouble with Romanians in Hungary.
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Post by lvl100 on Dec 24, 2008 3:47:34 GMT -5
Hey Romanians, let me explain it to you this once and for all, Romanians in Hungary, expecially in Mehkerek or Michirechi or whateva fukin stupid language u using for a typical Hungarian town with Romanian majority Hmm interesting . Trying to show us how good minorities are treated in Hungary and using insults about their language in the same sentence. Thats a classic. Good think that the majority of Hungarians have nothing to do with hatemongers lurking trough this forum.
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wbb
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Post by wbb on Dec 24, 2008 4:26:26 GMT -5
bah!!! bah!!! bah!!! bah!!! bah!!! You are being smartarse now arent ya? bah!!! bah!!! bah!!! And Romanians in this forum are being xenophic, bullchit mongers. bah!!! bah!!! bah!!! bah!!! where's my mummy's milk? bah!!! bah!!! bah!!! guess what i link u this article, to keep your mouth shut, how's that, instead of going over and over again with the same bullchit disscussion. Another thing, do u have trouble looking at the pictures? i'll post u different one, we'll see if Romanians are treated like chit or not. www.lingref.com/isb/4/025ISB4.PDFPostcard from Mehkerek.
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Post by lvl100 on Dec 24, 2008 5:28:48 GMT -5
According to your link , for 10000 Romanians there are only 6 elementary schools (even here Romanian its used only in Romanian teaching classes) and 1 (one) secondary school. Yeah, thats what I call supporting your minorities.
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yeni
Moderator
gulash freak
Posts: 327
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Post by yeni on Dec 24, 2008 7:03:51 GMT -5
Consider that among the 8-9000 Romanians in Hu roughly half of them lives in Bekes county and they are majority only in two villages. The rest are scattered in the country. In the 2001 Hun census among the 10 198 315 ppl, 1 875 089 were between the ages 5-19. thats 18,4% of the population. So this is the national avarege. Now lets assume the age structure is roughly the same in the Hun Ro minority and assume there are 10,000 Romanians (there are fewer actually). That means there are 1840 Romanians in the whole country who are between the ages 5-19. (half of them, 920 are scattered in the country and the parents usually choose the closest schools near their residence..) So how many schools do they need? (btw if the number of the schools is not enough, create newer schools, its that simple.)
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Dec 24, 2008 9:14:22 GMT -5
"Yeah , history is nice."
superb counter-argument
"While numerous Hungarian newspapers, books, other publications and even broadcasting hours on public television have existed in Romania even during the Ceauºescu regime, their number and diversity started decreasing after the 1989 revolution. The same is true for the number of elementary schools, high-schools, colleges and universities teaching in Hungarian, as well as for cultural institutions such as Hungarian theaters and opera houses funded by the Romanian state.
Today in Moldavia, the language of the school and the church is Romanian. There is local teaching in Ukrainian and the study of Polish, Roma and Russian as mother tongues. Despite the provisions of the Romanian law on education and the repeated requests from parents there is no teaching of Csango language in the Csango villages. As a consequence, very few Csangos know how to write their mother tongue.
Also the thousands of Hungarian church properties that were stolen by the romanian gov'nt and nationalized, only a small percentage being returned thus far.
"Yeah, thats what I call supporting your minorities."
olah hypocrisy at its best
If romanians act like gypsies you deserve to be called gypsies.
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Post by lvl100 on Dec 24, 2008 10:23:22 GMT -5
Consider that among the 8-9000 Romanians in Hu roughly half of them lives in Bekes county and they are majority only in two villages. The rest are scattered in the country. In the 2001 Hun census among the 10 198 315 ppl, 1 875 089 were between the ages 5-19. thats 18,4% of the population. So this is the national avarege. Now lets assume the age structure is roughly the same in the Hun Ro minority and assume there are 10,000 Romanians (there are fewer actually). That means there are 1840 Romanians in the whole country who are between the ages 5-19. (half of them, 920 are scattered in the country and the parents usually choose the closest schools near their residence..) So how many schools do they need? (btw if the number of the schools is not enough, create newer schools, its that simple.) Thx for the math. But its still doesnt make sense no matter how we divide so many youngsters for 1 (one) secondary school. Also , its worth noticing that basically there are no Romanian elementary schools. The only classes in Romanian, are only about the Romanian language. And even so,(without any need for special setup, other than 2 romanian teachers) there are only 6. "Yeah , history is nice." superb counter-argument Not superb, just ontopic. History its indeed nice, but it doesnt have any relevancy regarding realpolitik. After Revolution, like in the other former socialist states there was an explosion of mass-media. In just a few seconds i found on google and wikipedia more than 30 newspapers , magazines etc writen in Hungarian. Im sure i can find more tho. But thats already more than before `89 From your own source, the same source for your quote above" Romania has been referred to in many instances as an example to follow in respecting minorities' rights. In an address to the American people, President Clinton asked in the midst of the air war in Kosovo: Who is going to define the future of this part the world… Slobodan Milosevic, with his propaganda machine and paramilitary forces which compel people to give up their country, identity, and property, or a state like Romania which has built a democracy respecting the rights of ethnic minorities?"
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Post by szorostalpu1 on Dec 24, 2008 12:25:02 GMT -5
"History its indeed nice, but it doesnt have any relevancy regarding realpolitik. it's very relevent....but I can see why romanians wish to forget about it, because in your case, its not a very pretty picture. "Romania which has built a democracy respecting the rights of ethnic minorities?" Six Human Rights Violations against the 1.5 Million Hungarians of ...Six Human Rights Violations against the 1.5 Million Hungarians of Romania. In October 2003, the Hungarian Human Rights Foundation (HHRF) submitted a written ... www.hhrf.org/hhrf/en/sixviolations.htm - 32k You complain about the 10,000 romanians in Hungary...while you deprive the csango schools and church services. gypsy hypocrisy
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Post by lvl100 on Dec 24, 2008 16:51:07 GMT -5
"History its indeed nice, but it doesnt have any relevancy regarding realpolitik. it's very relevent....but I can see why romanians wish to forget about it, because in your case, its not a very pretty picture. You must be kidding me. Do you think that anybody gives a damn about who first pissed behind a specific tree 1000 years ago ? Maybe on this forum. In real life it doesnt matter if indians and Winnetou owned North America, if you catch my drift. 1) Breaking news : its 2008 now. Please update your sources That was the whole ideea. You offer ridiculous condition for Romanians, like 1 secondary school for thousands of kids and while you cry us a river for your own minorities Your so obsessed about gypsy. Normal kids when the lights are off are looking for boogie man. In your case , i`m sure your looking after gypsies under your bed when its dark.
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yeni
Moderator
gulash freak
Posts: 327
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Post by yeni on Dec 24, 2008 20:22:05 GMT -5
The Educational Act allows full minority language education. its up to the minority school to determine in what depth do they want to teach the minority language, every subjects (except Hungarian language and literature), two languages equally or only teach the minority language in special classes etc. It usually depends on the minority communities, most are already very assimilated (for historical reasons they have small numbers and they live in mixed areas..), for many students the minority language is a foreign language.
the one secondary school... Among the 1800-1900 5-19 years old Romanians how many can be in secondary school age, (14-18) 500-600 maybe. as roughly half of the Romanians is concentrated in one county (and there is the location of the Romanian secondary school, in Gyula, Bekes county), the rest live in different parts of Hungary. do the Romanian minority wants more secondary schools? Are there enough students to maintain another high school too in another location? i think the Hungarian state gives quite big freedom in this field so if there is a need, why dont they create a new school. do the Hun state try to prevent it in any way?
craciun fericit!
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wbb
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Post by wbb on Dec 25, 2008 1:24:44 GMT -5
can i tell u something? according to the suicide rates, Hungary has dropped down to 5th from 1st, from 44.2 to 26.0 thanx god. They are getting back to reality, only the stupid old people kill themselves now days. But something more interesting happens in Romania and Moldova today, but u told Unguro to cut his wrist with razor, well let's have a close look at the suicide rates of Romania and Moldova. Romania is 12.5, but Moldova, another Romanian nation is even higher =17.8, if we add Romania and Moldova together as one nation, the answer is....Romania will be the 4th nation to have high suicide rates, 17.8 + 12.5 = 30.3 while Hungary will dropped down to 6th as 26.0. That means 2 Romanian nations are doing 4.3 times more suicide than Hungary itself. Go and do hara-kiri to yourself with a Japanese or Damascus knife. Damascus knife is better, extra sharper to cut your worthless stomach.
Romanians in Hungary doesnt give a chit about being Romanian or having more Romanian schools, u can blame on them instead of entire Hungary. Vasile Miriuta..do u know who he is? a Hungarian football player of Romanian background who played for Hungary, the best country ever but ever walked on this earth for more than 1000 years. Tell Vasile, that Romanians need more Romanian school in Hungary, go on!!! Vasile will laugh his head off, i can guarantee u that by 1-100%.
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Post by lvl100 on Dec 25, 2008 2:21:45 GMT -5
why dont they create a new school. do the Hun state try to prevent it in any way? craciun fericit! Your right, i have nothing to comment here. The only reason i brought this in question is that when its about Hungarian minorities, everytime the State its blamed even someone lacks a pencil. Kellemes karácsonyi űnnepekat kivának well let's have a close look at the suicide rates of Romania and Moldova. Romania is 12.5, but Moldova, another Romanian nation is even higher =17.8, if we add Romania and Moldova together as one nation, the answer is....Romania will be the 4th nation to have high suicide rates, 17.8 + 12.5 = 30.3 Your lack to grasp even the most basic things its truly amazing. If you want to find the overall % you dont make the sum Einstein. Because if you make the sum of all areas inhabited by Romanians you will probably reach 100%. And that would mean that all Romanians are dead now. Which its absurd. You use the AVERAGE , my little rocket scientist. 17.8 +12.5 / 2 = 15.1
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wbb
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Posts: 733
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Post by wbb on Dec 25, 2008 3:57:08 GMT -5
Romanian government and Hungarian government are 2 different thing, Romanian government are 75 times more extreme than Hungarian government itself. Hungarian government looks after their minorities in Hungary, while Romanian government is secretly behind all this extreme conspiracy against Hungarians in Transylvania. Your denial is sickening.
aha i see, so u either didnt learn maths well or u have a denying disorder. What fukin average? How could 2 Romanian nation have 15.1 when friken Moldova itself is already 17.8? get ur facts right. Romania is doing more well than Moldova, Moldova is the worst Romanian country for suicide as it was always been. and i didnt mention Romanians, i mention Romania and Moldova as whole, u fukwit.
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