CiKoLa
Amicus
Gotovina Heroj!
Posts: 3,728
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Post by CiKoLa on Mar 23, 2010 2:19:50 GMT -5
I'm confused ... what exactly do they think will happen if gays join the military?
What next .. blonde haired people as well?
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Mar 23, 2010 5:59:46 GMT -5
Allowing gays in the military will fit nicely with the new left wing world order & definitely justify the invasion of Iraq as well as reinforce the love of Team America - World Police. America, f**k yeah! Man you's have got to see Team America if yous haven't - best movie!
ps hellboy & zvone remind me of those weird misogynistic gay pedophiles. I doubt they are really attracted to women anyway.
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Post by SKORIC on Mar 23, 2010 6:46:00 GMT -5
It was my understanding that gays joined the navy instead of the army.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Mar 23, 2010 7:11:16 GMT -5
It was my understanding that gays joined the navy instead of the army. lol ;D
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Zvone
Amicus
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Posts: 525
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Post by Zvone on Mar 23, 2010 7:57:31 GMT -5
Ok.
Yes, in certain countries it is, but it does function in some other countries. I am not saying it should be the standard across the globe.
The military comprises of all three branches. Maybe I'm missing something or I don't understand...
I agree.
You're the only one to insinuate our stances come from being homosexual. Now, is this wishful thinking or are you talking about yourself?
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Post by manijak on Mar 23, 2010 8:43:31 GMT -5
I agree with MIG that this wouldn't fly in Russia and there may be quiet a bit of issues but I;m talking about normal societies. The Americans today, 75% believe this policy should be scrapped.
Though, with his opening post, its quiet clear that he is biased and a bit of a moron.
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Mar 23, 2010 14:07:59 GMT -5
I agree with MIG that this wouldn't fly in Russia and there may be quiet a bit of issues but I;m talking about normal societies. The Americans today, 75% believe this policy should be scrapped. Though, with his opening post, its quiet clear that he is biased and a bit of a moron. I don't have problems with gay people. Elton John kind of killed it for me the last couple of weeks. I don't care what your sexual preference is. Homosexuals can parade it on the streets and whatnot, but when you start doing it in the military, then you'll have a big problem. It has no place there. Trust me, I know first hand. --- In the West, namely the very liberal of liberal societies, it can work. But even then you can't count out the things that may and eventually will occur; such as violence and harassment. The Military comprises of more than those three branches. But those are the mainstream departments in most Armed Forces; unless of course you count in Strategic/Rocketry Forces to those that do operate some sort of a region-wide or world-wide EWR System and ICBM Bases/Stations.
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Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Mar 23, 2010 15:44:39 GMT -5
You're the only one to insinuate our stances come from being homosexual. Now, is this wishful thinking or are you talking about yourself? I would prefer if it wasn't true. I've just noticed that both of you like to make the odd little snide remark towards women & at least never say anything positive about them. Combine that with an obsession with homosexuality on a Balkan forum & that's the way it reads.
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Zvone
Amicus
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Posts: 525
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Post by Zvone on Mar 23, 2010 18:25:58 GMT -5
Never said it didn't, but I don't know what your initial point was. What did I say that dehumanized women? Now, you as a Christian, should not call someone misogynistic. Obsessed? Unlikely. Sounds like you're bothered by the whole theme, which makes me question whether you're being aggressive on the issue because of some closeted feelings.
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Post by manijak on Mar 23, 2010 20:54:43 GMT -5
Dude, I'm not going to for one second think you are ok with gay people when you say stuff like "they can parade it on the street but when they start doing it in the military".
First, I'd suggest you watch the videos I posted. They explain really well the rationale for coming out.
Second, many nations have done this, and it has not posed problems. From Britain, to Netherlands, to Israel to Canada. As I said, its not the time to do it in nations where society does not accept it.(that i agree with)
When you watch the videos, and if you know anything about the military, you'll understand that repealing the policy has nothing to do with parading. It has to do with following the military's own code of integrity and honor. When you are in the military, you are basically living with other people, and you are constantly talking about your lives. The gay person always has to lie. How is that proper? You are also looking out for each others lives..yet you find it ok to lie to each other about something major like this.
I think you mentioned that you were doing a police course (or not sure if you are a police officer) and I understand how you can get the perception that it would not be ok..in a group with a lot of guys who are aggresive and so forth..what you probably didn't know is that one of them is probably gay. And what you are not realizing is that military people have respect for other military people because they realize the work that it takes. How can you attack a gay person in the military when you realize that they've done as much work as you to get there? You would be dissing yourself.
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Post by vinjak on Mar 23, 2010 21:39:56 GMT -5
I think this General is a wackjob and what is scary is that wackjobs such as him are in charge of armed forces, the dutch have only one thing to be blamed for and that is tolerating armed personnel in a UN safety zone and indeed standing by as raids were conducted from a demilitarized zone. Not only that but allowing the trade of humanitarian resources by criminals in the UN safe zone. This was there failing.
You cannot claim a UN safety zone by having a operational force regrouping under a commander, an opposing force will deem it a valid target.
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Post by Pavel Chernev on Mar 23, 2010 22:34:35 GMT -5
Greetings friends,
We are lucky in Bulgaria there is no gays.
Pozdrav e Pavel.
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Mar 23, 2010 23:19:35 GMT -5
My initial point was, why didn't he mention the RAH-66 Project, and the billions of dollars the DoD spends on shit like that, only to let it go in the end? Should've clarified, my bad. ---- Whatever, that's your personal aspect. And what's wrong with saying something like that? Just because someone's a homosexual, they should have special position, and be treated differently than others? I don't think so. I may come off as a "Homo-phobe", but maybe because its your own personal view on this. I'm not trying to disrespect homosexuals, its just that some people take it too far (Again I source Elton John in this). my.hsj.org/Schools/Newspaper/tabid/100/view/frontpage/articleid/346735/newspaperid/1782/Mississippi_Prom_Cancelled_Due_to_Lesbian_Couples_Intention_to_Attend.aspxNow that's homophobic. In my opinion, its stupid to do such a thing. But it's Mississippi, so it doesn't seem so fucked up coming from such a state. Was that not his personal decision to join the military? Was he not fully aware of the consequences? I'm pretty damn sure he was. I'm only talking about the Lieutenant Colonel. The other video is a little too long to watch at the moment. Have I not said that? Is it not their choice though? Do they not know what kind of a risk they are taking when they join the military? That's roughly like taking a swim with a Shark, while you've got some steaks tied around you. The consequences are perfectly clear, and some people choose to still take the challenge. I wouldn't personally do it. But as you have read Toskalikus contribution here, its mostly those of the lower echelons of society that end up enlisting. When I did reserves, I saw a whole side of Canada I never got to see. People are ignorant. Meanwhile when you may think that even in the most liberal societies where even Same-Sex Marriage is legal, everything will be fine, it won't. Because there are always hooligans that try and do shit, and go out of their way JUST to make someone miserable for even as simple as talking in an accent. BTW, I'm still chasing a police job, but am going to Uni. in January. Just to clarify. ;D
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Post by Username on Mar 24, 2010 1:01:33 GMT -5
Lol, comon' MiG.. Im kinda hoping I misunderstood you there, but being treated differently is the last thing they want. They want equality - is that too much to ask for?
As far as you believing gays shouldn't be allowed in the military because of repercussions from fellow soldiers or whatever, that's kind of ridiculous. You're basically acknowledging that society is wrong in how they treat gays, and then condone it by pushing to limit gay rights. Huh?
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Mar 24, 2010 2:18:54 GMT -5
^ Alright. I should elaborate on what I meant. Just because someone is different, doesn't mean they should get extra attention or etc etc. I'm all for equality, which is why I think that leaving their sexual preference at home (Just like now you leave your religion at home) is what should be done. You said "You're basically acknowledging that society is wrong in how they treat gays, and then condone it by pushing to limit gay rights." That's what you get out of my argument? You guys are so jumpy and fucking sensitive on this issue. You're gonna tell me that its unconstitutional to make people leave their sexual preference at the doorstep of their home when serving in the military. It's against gay rights? What? That's a fucking joke. Where the fuck is professionalism? My entire argument here is that you should leave what you represent at home. When you join the military, you're a completely new person, with a set of ideals they will instill in you. Whether you're homosexual or not makes no fucking difference. Do you think they give a shit whether you're Protestant, Roman Catholic, Anglican, Jewish, Eastern Orthodox, or Sunni Muslim? I think that allowing gays to serve in the military is a mistake. Huge mistake. Do you have ANY idea what will happen to the men/women that admit that s**t? Jesus, the carnage that would take place. The military is one place where gay people honestly have NO business in; with all due respect of course. Let me rephrase this to the point of Political Correctness where everybody understands and takes no offense to it... Which at this point makes no fucking difference, but meh. I think that allowing the military to point out its homosexuals is a very big mistake. Huge mistake. Do you have ANY idea what will happen to the men/women that admit that s**t? You would have them pointed out, probably humiliated, and potentially put in harms way, just because of some fucking "right to be a homosexual"? The military is one place where gay people honestly have NO business in declaring themselves homosexual. Professional conduct is what the military asks for, and if the gay community wants equality, then the military is one of the few places where everyone is truly equal. You're equal at sunrise and sunset. You're equal when you eat, sleep, and shit. Also, you're equal when you're getting treated like a low-life being, with a loud-mouthed SOB right in your face. IF you think that's absolutely not right, then the military is no place for you. Ya get it?
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Post by manijak on Mar 24, 2010 7:46:43 GMT -5
MIG
This is all practical. You are living with these people. Everyday you are talking about personal stuff. Is the gay person suppose to make s**t up about having a gf? Is he suppose to talk about girls even though he has no interest? You want people to be fake? The military is suppose to be about integrity and honor. You are with people that are suppose to have your back. Lying to each other does not bring you closer.
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Post by manijak on Mar 24, 2010 7:52:55 GMT -5
And your argument about gays being in danger and that BS...don't worry about that. We have balls and we aren't scared. Gays have been coming out of the closet for a long long time, to some of the most anti-gay, violent, people..and very little bad has happened.
So maybe you should get some balls too.
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Post by hellboy87 on Mar 24, 2010 8:27:23 GMT -5
Sexual preference MiG???
It's not just that.It's a state of being,get it?
Sexual preference again? So you dont tell people you're sexually attracted to women?
It's more than sex! It also signifies behaviour and tastes.
Again,you said they shouldnt tell because the straight will freak out and mistreat them.Well,if you say that's wrong,then why giving excuses for them to still be that way?
If somebody gets mistreated like that,you report it to the authorities and they'll do something.
You are such a freakin Saudi,MiG. It's so angering that a European can be like that and not progressive,which is a symbol of the Western world.
LOL!
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MiG
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Post by MiG on Mar 24, 2010 13:13:18 GMT -5
MIG This is all practical. You are living with these people. Everyday you are talking about personal stuff. Is the gay person suppose to make s**t up about having a gf? Is he suppose to talk about girls even though he has no interest? You want people to be fake? The military is suppose to be about integrity and honor. You are with people that are suppose to have your back. Lying to each other does not bring you closer. Dude. I'll stop right there. You're right, and I'm wrong. That's that. Vazi? Samo imam jedno pitanje. Jesil ti ikad bio u Armiji? And your argument about gays being in danger and that BS...don't worry about that. We have balls and we aren't scared. Gays have been coming out of the closet for a long long time, to some of the most anti-gay, violent, people..and very little bad has happened. So maybe you should get some balls too. WTF? I don't care dude. Why are you on the subject of my balls anyway? Either way, I don't understand that "So maybe you should get some balls too." argument. What the fuck does that have to do with anything we're talking about LOL? So if they discourage me from praying, and going to church those 13 weeks of training that we have, what the fuck is wrong with encouraging people to leave their sexual preference at home? You pose a retarded argument. You act as if you're all victims of something greater then this, and something MUST be done to recognize the gay community everywhere and even the military. You are professionals. Professionals leave everything aside, and get the job done. You obviously don't know how it is, so you can, with all due respect, piss off. ----- Yes. Sexual Preference. Would you like me to use a derogatory term? Oh, is it now? So, you're telling me that you're in some higher state of consciousness? Tell me something Hellboy, am I offending you by arguing what I have to say? Why should I? BUT, wait a second. Should I have a parade for being straight? I don't think so. That Lieutenant Colonel I saw in the video didn't look or seem homosexual at all. It's just his "Sexual Preference" which he is more comfortable with, without question. Maybe for you its an "ultra-special" thing, and should be treated extra nice and special for it. If you're gay, you're gay. You're not fucking retarded, so why the special treatment? What? Man you have to clear that up. Just like they did with the Lt. Col.? Yeah, I'm sure they will. Say what? So I'm not progressive JUST because I think that you should leave your sexual preference, or as you want it, "lifestyle" at home? Now I'm Saudi? I'm not even Muslim. It's the fucking military you douchebag. Not an office job.
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Post by manijak on Mar 24, 2010 13:47:51 GMT -5
MIG, nobody wants to come out for the sake of coming out. Its just that any personal convos..you would have to lie. So unless you are a total social outcast and hate people, are you suggesting you would never talk to other military people in your battalion or whatever?
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