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Post by srbobran on Nov 1, 2011 15:26:32 GMT -5
Bulgaria was the only Axis country to end up with more territory after the war than before. Pre WWII was essentially today's Bulgaria minus Southern Dobrudja (or however you spell it lol) which was gained after WWII. The terrtiory that you "lost" was acquired during WWII so that doesn't count.
The Bulgarian government was very smart during WWII. Tsar Boris, even if he techincally comitted to joining the Axis bloc (Germany had essentially given Bulgaria an ultimatum) kept his people from fighting a war they had no business being in. No Bulgarians went to the Eastern front and no Bulgarians were sent to fight the French, British etc. He did what any good leader would do.
Regent Paul did the same for Yugoslavia but was unfortunately ousted in a coup. The Balkans had no reason to fight in that war but as always, we got pulled into it.
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ivo
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Post by ivo on Nov 1, 2011 16:48:08 GMT -5
This is a more accurate way of putting it as the resulting map can hardly be called a "gain".
San Stefano Bulgaria designates the rightful Bulgarian lands agreed upon by the Ottoman Empire and Russia based on the natural areas of Bulgarian habitation where ethnic Bulgarians composed the vast majority of the population.
"Official" alterations of those borders following 1878, have been artificial and driven by politics with the purpose of ensuring that Bulgaria will not be the dominant power in the Balkans.
During WWII, the rightful Bulgarian lands were once more under Bulgarian control. Following WWII, the only part that remained was Southern Dobrudja.. even so, the loss was significantly greater than the "gain".
The problem with the term "gain" is it insinuates the taking of something that wasn't yours.
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ivo
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Post by ivo on Nov 1, 2011 16:51:03 GMT -5
Another tough talker trying to prove that his people are something more than the common conception, yet they've failed to prove that themselves throughout history.
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Post by Shqipni13 on Nov 1, 2011 17:02:54 GMT -5
Chento, yep, the pictures you have above are Nazi Kosovo Albanian SS-Skanderbeg rats. Those Albanians chose the right side at that time. What good came out of fighting alongside serb partisans? Tivar (Bar massacre) ring a bell? The appreciation shown by the serbs huh? Now go beg mommy dearest to teach you her language silly faggot.
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Nov 1, 2011 19:21:02 GMT -5
Chento is a so peculiar case. He is so anti-serb, anti-greek, anti-bulgarian, anti-alb, that i think he is one (of the very very few) unique case in FYROM. And UZ, i think the answer to the funding question is USA. don't worry Pyrros, there are plenty like me out there. many are in the current Macedonian govt...thankfully
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Post by uz on Nov 1, 2011 19:30:49 GMT -5
Chento is a so peculiar case. He is so anti-serb, anti-greek, anti-bulgarian, anti-alb, that i think he is one (of the very very few) unique case in FYROM. And UZ, i think the answer to the funding question is USA. don't worry Pyrros, there are plenty like me out there. many are in the current Macedonian govt... thankfully ^ hahahahaha
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Post by Anittas on Nov 2, 2011 1:36:06 GMT -5
Another tough talker trying to prove that his people are something more than the common conception, yet they've failed to prove that themselves throughout history. Everything is relative. Compared to you, we are great. But indeed, since we didn't have Western European neighbors, our achievements are modest. I mean, who would be impressed if we tell them we eliberated the sorry ass Bulgarians from the Turkish yoke? Not even the Bulgarian would be impressed.
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Post by Anittas on Nov 2, 2011 1:45:55 GMT -5
This is a more accurate way of putting it as the resulting map can hardly be called a "gain". San Stefano Bulgaria designates the rightful Bulgarian lands agreed upon by the Ottoman Empire and Russia based on the natural areas of Bulgarian habitation where ethnic Bulgarians composed the vast majority of the population. "Official" alterations of those borders following 1878, have been artificial and driven by politics with the purpose of ensuring that Bulgaria will not be the dominant power in the Balkans. During WWII, the rightful Bulgarian lands were once more under Bulgarian control. Following WWII, the only part that remained was Southern Dobrudja.. even so, the loss was significantly greater than the "gain". The problem with the term "gain" is it insinuates the taking of something that wasn't yours. I would't refer to the word "gain" as a "term". If you think it is a term, what terminology would it belong to? And no, to gain something, as in this case a province or a region, does not "insinuate" that the land was not rightfully yours. The problem is that you can't comprehend what is being written by others. A gain is a gain. Even if you didn't get to keep all that you feel was rightful yours, it is still a gain. Get a brain, will you?
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Nov 2, 2011 3:44:47 GMT -5
Chento is a so peculiar case. He is so anti-serb, anti-greek, anti-bulgarian, anti-alb, that i think he is one (of the very very few) unique case in FYROM. And UZ, i think the answer to the funding question is USA. don't worry Pyrros, there are plenty like me out there. many are in the current Macedonian govt...thankfully No. Normal makedonians are Nikola, Ljubotan, etc... well ljubo is on the other extreme, but thats the pattern : - 20% pro-serb (ljubotan) - 50% neutral, pro-serb bias (Nikola) - 20% pro-bulg ( non from here) - 10% "alexander-type" maks who rule over the overs, write on forums, buy/resell cheap propaganda, execute USA orders, etc... (you)
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Post by Novi Pazar on Nov 2, 2011 6:15:54 GMT -5
"I agree srbobran, but we also lost alot of territories which (at the thimes) were populated with Bulgarian majority."
I think you should be extremely greatful for the terrority BuLgarska has kept upto 2011 because in-reality the ONLY real BuLgarska is Pliska/Ruse (N.E BuLgarska) everything else is questionable.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Nov 2, 2011 6:23:12 GMT -5
"10% "alexander-type" maks who rule over the overs, write on forums, buy/resell cheap propaganda, execute USA orders, etc... (you)"
Pyrro, l would also add that there is a tinge of BuLgarski bias with Chento's propaganda too. What do think brate that his grandfather fought with the disguisting BuLgari to murder Serbs.......l dream to get Miletich's decendants and rip their heads off, garbages, serbs jumping on the enemies side to kill serbs......is this retardation or what?
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Nov 2, 2011 7:22:00 GMT -5
Yes, i have noticed that too. He pretends to be anti-Bulgar, but his tactics/style is identical. (must be the self-hating equivalent in Bulgars lol)
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Nov 2, 2011 18:01:29 GMT -5
Sorry to interrupt you guys, I don't hate any of our neighbours. I consider them all fellow Balkanians, but I do stand up for my nation and people. I am on the side of Macedonia, when it comes to any anti-Macedonian (whether they are Serb, Bulgar, Greek or Albanian) argument. As I've said before modern Macedonian DNA is a combination of Slav and pre-Slav elements. I am not a Macedonian who denies their Slavic past. I do however, also celebrate our non-Slav past.
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Nov 3, 2011 1:14:57 GMT -5
I think you should be extremely greatful for the terrority Bu Lgarska has kept upto 2011 because in-reality the ONLY real Bu Lgarska is Pliska/Ruse (N.E Bu Lgarska) everything else is questionable. its kind of ironic that in 2011 those words come from a serb. But then again you are not even serb.
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Post by Shqipni13 on Nov 3, 2011 1:43:28 GMT -5
^It's just too easy man.
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Post by Novi Pazar on Nov 3, 2011 4:29:22 GMT -5
"Yes, i have noticed that too. He pretends to be anti-Bulgar, but his tactics/style is identical. (must be the self-hating equivalent in Bulgars lol)"
Exactly brate!
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Post by kroraina on Nov 8, 2011 8:01:53 GMT -5
That's quite low coming from you, Chentovist. You were trying to be more balanced and to present a fuller picture of past events. Regarding the story behind this feeble and tasteless attempt of Macedonist propaganda: The football club " Makedonija" from Skopje played during the war in the Bulgarian league, in one geographical group with clubs from Sofia, such as "Levski", the best club in pre-war Bulgaria. "Makedonija" performed very well and they almost became champions of Bulgaria after some epic games against Levski!, but the unfair refereeing gave advantage to "Levski". Now, consider this: - The Skopjean club "Makedonija" was created by the Bulgarian authorities in 1941, after coming to power in Skopje! There was NO "Makedonija" in the decade BEFORE the war, as for the Serbian authorities this land was judt "Southern Serbia", "Vardarska Banovina". It was under the "ghastly fascist occupiers" when Skopjani were allowed to chant "Makedonija! Makedonija!". (Another "Makedonija" club was also created by the Bulgarians in Bitola.) Have a look at this video - Vasil Dilev, The Last Living Player of FC Macedonia , and have a look at the Sofia newspapers from 1941-1942 and their reports of the "Makedonija"-"Levski" games - www.levskifc.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=248to see that the play and the players of "Makedonija" were admired by everybody and that the Bulgarian newspapers hailed the players as "the best sons of the Macedonian land". - also consider that after the war, "Makedonija" dissapeared, i.e. the new Yugo-Macedonian authorities renamed it into "Vardar" (after joining it with another local club). Yes, "Vardar" was the mightiest yugomacedonian club, until very recently, but doesn't it make you wonder why it got renamed with this "geographically more neutral" name, after the river of Vardar, eh?... - the coach of "Makedonija", a Hungarian Jew, was indeed to be sent to the Nazi camps, but the Bulgarian mayor of Skopje, Kitinchev, a local lawyer btw, intervened and saved him. After the war Kitinchev was shot by the invaders, by the Titoist gangs, who took the power, as "a fascist". - leaked pictures from the filming of the Macedonian film "Third Halftime" (sponsored heavily by the government of Gruevski!!) show the Bulgarian flag flying over the concentration camp (Treblinka?) where the poor Macedonian Jews are shipped for extermination. A Bulgarian flag flying over a German camp in Poland!? Such historical frivolity, if confirmed in the final release of the movie, is amazing and you could expect a responce, on governmental level, from Bulgaria, and not just from some MEPs.
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Kralj Vatra
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Post by Kralj Vatra on Nov 8, 2011 8:34:32 GMT -5
Dude, In Vitosa museum, about WWII, i saw that also a much larger number of pro-Axis Bulgarians were executed by the communist Bulgarians which came into power. Every balkan nation had civil wars back then. Do not try to exploit what happened between yugoslavs for your own political purposes.
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Nov 8, 2011 9:07:23 GMT -5
Uou, kroraina, tnx alot about the info. Another proof that the Macedonian Bulgarians back then were treated like our brothers who suffered alot in the hands of the Serbs. Obviouslly all of Bulgaria was proud of the team Macedonia.
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Post by missanthropology58 on Nov 8, 2011 9:16:56 GMT -5
Avgis Golden Dawn.
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