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Post by Shqipni13 on May 26, 2012 0:23:22 GMT -5
^Enlighten us oh wise one.
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Post by groet on May 26, 2012 7:31:49 GMT -5
Lets give you Albanians alittle peep into the Albanian hand of the HOLOCAUST: In the holocaust chronicle they mention between 10 to 12 Jews from Albania were sent to Bergen-Belsen to be EXTERMINATED! US documents state only 200 Jews are inhabiting Albania, so do the math, 12/200 x 100/1% = 6 percent of Albanian jews from only Albania proper were exterminated. Read from: www.holocaustchronicle.org/HolocaustAppendices.htmlAlso from the chronicle it says the following: What have l been telling you guys? Do you want me to reveal more because this 37 year old man with 3 children can do so. You're going to have to prove that they were turned over by Albanians. The claim has never been that no Jew living in Albania wasn't caught, just that they weren't turned over by Albanians. Our government gave them new identities and Jewish refugees were admitted immediately, the government also refused to give the Germans any form of information on their Jews. At the same time, the people took them in their homes and protected them. Do also note that your own link states that no Jews were killed in Albania, not one Jew and not one percent. Probably due to what I referred to earlier and/or that those weren't killed. We can at least say that your own source chooses not to put up any Jewish death toll on Albania and therefore has the opposite understanding of this than you do. So they weren't exterminated and they were most likely not turned over. The Évian Conference isn't much of a source either as your chronicle lists it as. The Évian Conference was before the war and the Holocaust had started. Also, Bergen-Belsen didn't become operational before 1940, it would have been very weird if 10-12 Jews were sent to what was a military training camp for Germans. Conveniently, the Italian Zones of Occupation were a very small part of Croatia, less than half of Slovenia and parts of Montenegro. Overall, not a lot, depending on whether you consider protectorates as Zones of Occupation or not. We did not willingly turn over Jews to the Germans and we protected them. Unfortunately for you, your country managed to kill off 94% of its Jewish population, some of those who didn't die as a consequence of the Serbs compliant cooperation with the Nazis fled to Albania. In fact, there's not one single person from Serbia that is among the Righteous Among The Nations list, meaning that there were no Serb person willing to save a fellow human being. Anyway, do you really think that we have fooled the Jews into accepting what is currently believed? I don't think they give out the medals without some research.
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Post by vinjak on May 26, 2012 8:43:53 GMT -5
In fact, there's not one single person from Serbia that is among the Righteous Among The Nations list,
I did a quick search and there is 130 Serbs on that list, 69 Albanians,106 Croats and 40 Bosnians.
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Post by Novi Pazar on May 26, 2012 9:56:57 GMT -5
Groet, this topic is not about serbs, its about the ridiculous claim Albanians saved Jews. Please spare me the babble!
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Post by groet on May 26, 2012 14:20:06 GMT -5
In fact, there's not one single person from Serbia that is among the Righteous Among The Nations list,I did a quick search and there is 130 Serbs on that list, 69 Albanians,106 Croats and 40 Bosnians. Yes, you're right. I just checked it up again and I hadn't noticed that. My bad. Groet, this topic is not about serbs, its about the ridiculous claim Albanians saved Jews. Please spare me the babble! Ok. You're still far worse than us anyway. You'll just have to disprove this "ridiculous claim". Until now, you haven't. Since you are so confident it's all a lie, you should be able to back that confidence up with some facts. You haven't until now and you have only managed to bring up falsities. Until then, good luck.
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donnie
Senior Moderator
Nike Leka i Kelmendit
Posts: 3,389
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Post by donnie on May 26, 2012 20:20:18 GMT -5
There is smth we've forgotten to mention here.
Unlike in our case, where the collaborationist element came about as a result of our precarious political position, fascism in Serbia was homegrown and preceded the Nazi invasion. Just take a look at the Jugoslovenski narodni pokret (Yugoslav National Movement) or "Zbor" founded by D. Ljotic, an admirer of Hitler, in 1935. Its ideology was inspired by Italian fascism and German National Socialist ideas, and it later also formed the armed group of Srpski dobrovoljaèki korpus, its military arm that assisted the Nazis in persecuting the Reich's enemies, including Serbia's Jewry.
Serbia was also a pioneer in legislation that discriminated the country's Jews almost a century before WWII, in the 19th century. One such example was the creation of ghettos. The extremely high rate of Jewish deaths in Serbia is in retrospect not so surprising.
Therefore, it's highly amusing and bewildering having Serbs teach us about the subject and criticize our role during WWII. Then again, the fact that Novi does this is hardly surprising, he's dumber than a mule and is only worth using as a packhorse.
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atdhetar
Amicus
tonight we dine in hell!
Posts: 3,124
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Post by atdhetar on May 28, 2012 14:37:07 GMT -5
its about the ridiculous claim Albanians saved Jews. look here idiot person, it is the jews that are saying that, it is the jews who are honouring us, this is not an albanian claim, your beef is with jews, you need to go to israel and convince them that albanians did not save jews, what a fucking retard, my Lord.
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Post by Novi Pazar on May 28, 2012 22:59:38 GMT -5
Donnie, is this topic about Serbs or about Albanians. I've come here to argue that Albanians didn't save her Jews as they lie to the rest of the world but to point out they in-fact CONTRIBUTED to the final solution.
PS Just the tiniest peep and you guys turn wild about it all LMAO
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Post by Novi Pazar on May 28, 2012 23:01:49 GMT -5
"You're still far worse than us anyway."
Its much worse to lie and pay some American Jews to fabricate BS about this matter, Groet, agree?
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Post by Duke John on May 29, 2012 2:18:05 GMT -5
"You're still far worse than us anyway." Its much worse to lie and pay some American Jews to fabricate BS about this matter, Groet, agree? Novi when was the last time u been in Balkans? Here are the Jews telling the storry. What a bitter man you are.
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atdhetar
Amicus
tonight we dine in hell!
Posts: 3,124
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Post by atdhetar on May 29, 2012 4:41:28 GMT -5
you forgot about uz but otherwise a very accurate assessment
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Post by Novi Pazar on May 29, 2012 5:02:32 GMT -5
It doesn't matter, Albanians have paid certain American Jews to write a fabricated story how Albanians saved Jews. I've shown above a link that tells 10 to 12 Albanian Jews were deported to Bergen-Belsen to be exterminated. I'll show more at a later time
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Post by groet on May 29, 2012 7:50:35 GMT -5
you forgot about uz but otherwise a very accurate assessment The etc. was meant to be Uz, he's not worthy of a mention by name I guess. It doesn't matter, Albanians have paid certain American Jews to write a fabricated story how Albanians saved Jews. I've shown above a link that tells 10 to 12 Albanian Jews were deported to Bergen-Belsen to be exterminated. I'll show more at a later time Oh yes, if something doesn't fit your own biased pov, it has been fickled with, there must be a conspiracy behind it. This is part of the Serb mentality, and this is why so many Serbs turn to conspiracy theories, the world just doesn't fit their world view and unless it never fully bends to the Serb will, the world will always be a world of conspiracy against the Serb nation. This is why I think of them as rather primitive and ignorant, the primitive and ignorant human of old thought that he and his little insignificant planet was the greatest and most important in the universe, and all that was existed for him and his species. In the same fashion, Serbs think they are so important as to have the whole world plot against them, all the time. These Satanic plots against the heavenly people, the people of God, the Serbs. Something I see with Serbs is that they all want some special treatment. Rather nasty creatures, these Serbs. Your own source disagreed with you, Novi. The Eviane conference had nothing to do with the extermination of Jews, this was before the Holocaust and no one knew or could have known about the concentration camps before the war was over. Bergen-Belsen wasn't a concentration camp before 1940, even then it only became a concentration camp in the later stages of the war, it took military prisoners at first. Before 1940, it had been a military training camp. All in all that is shady in itself, as well as you misinterpret it.
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atdhetar
Amicus
tonight we dine in hell!
Posts: 3,124
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Post by atdhetar on May 29, 2012 8:02:34 GMT -5
word to the wise,
don't try to reason with novi, he has an inpregnable forcefield of stupidity around him which logic is unable to penetrate
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atdhetar
Amicus
tonight we dine in hell!
Posts: 3,124
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Post by atdhetar on May 29, 2012 19:12:11 GMT -5
there are some serbs i can absolutely respect in here, vinjak is fairly level headed and doesn't really get involved....uz on the other hand is the antithesis of reason, it like talking to a brick wall, not bright enough...i see where you are coming from, dim people can be adorable at times what with their impressionable dimwitted innosence, its cute at times.
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Post by Novi Pazar on May 29, 2012 23:22:30 GMT -5
Whats biased Laughing? I've shown to all you Albanians that Jews were deported out of Albania because they were Jews, they weren't saved at all, the intent was to exterminate them.
Serbs killed Jews, some collaborated with Nazis when the puppet government was installed to rule. This is my point, Serbs don't lie and say they saved Jews, whereas the Albanians and their lobyists are buying out American Jews to write fabricated information that Albanians SAVED jews.
There is nothing biased, just transparent information and honest debating.
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Post by Shqipni13 on May 29, 2012 23:33:42 GMT -5
its about the ridiculous claim Albanians saved Jews. look here idiot person, it is the jews that are saying that, it is the jews who are honouring us, this is not an albanian claim, your beef is with jews, you need to go to israel and convince them that albanians did not save jews, what a f**king retard, my Lord. This pretty much ends the debate.
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Post by Novi Pazar on May 30, 2012 1:55:17 GMT -5
^ It doesn't end the debate!
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on May 31, 2012 7:16:01 GMT -5
The SS Handzar were officially a Croatian Muslim division comprised of mostly Bosniaks, some (Catholic) Croats, and a host of other Muslims including Albanians.
Bosniak revisionists like to gloat over their heroism and prop them as Bosniak national heroes because the Handzar chain of command didn't go directly through the Croatian government at the time but reported directly to German superiors. They were autonomous of the NDH command structure. But most of the Handzar Bosniaks were loyal to Croatia nonetheless. The 'vice dictator' ( second in command to Pavelic - and not as psycho as Pavelic) Dr Dzafer Beg Kulenovic wrote extensively about it and I am an owner of those writings if anyone is interested. People associate the fact that they were an 'SS' division that they were automatically evil. Not the case. Bosnia , much like the last war , was a no man's land of wonton murdering by all the factions. The NDH never really controlled a lot of its own territory as large swaths of it were out of the control of Croatian forces , especially eastern Bosnia. Eastern Bosnia was one of the places the Cetniks were as cruel as anyone can get. Mass graves of Muslims and the Croat population there was virtually wiped out. In this region if you were a Croat you were automatically marked for death, no exceptions. If you were a muslim you bow down or die. 'evil sounding' divisions like the Handzar and the Black Legion actually saved tons of civilians from certain death and that stuck with the people that survived which is why in some isolated village still if you find old people with memories of that era will praise them or else they would be dead.
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Post by Novi Pazar on May 31, 2012 23:22:04 GMT -5
^ Good for another topic, but we are talking about Albanians, right?
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