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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 27, 2010 14:42:48 GMT -5
I don't think we need to implement western values into the more east parts of Turkey as I doubt it would work, It would prolly end up with lots of honour asnd namus killings. however, up until ankara is fine. Those things are not specifically Western values. The Westerners call it Western values because they got nothing better to do. It's really part of human nature. Exactly.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 25, 2010 14:52:10 GMT -5
Last week I met with one of my childhood friends. I haven't seen her for 16 years. Anyway, we talked about vacation and she mentioned that when she was in Greece, altough the whole deal was cheap, the services there have started to crumble. Then this year, she chose Turkey, even though it's more expensive. She had a great time there. I'm glad tourism in Turkey is growing. You can now focus more on quality. I haven't had the pleasure of vocating in Turkey, but here's why I was impressed with the way Turkey has promoted its tourism over the years: 1. Turkey promoted its different sights and monumental heritages (Hittite, Greek, Roman, etc) without shame or pride; 2. Turkey promoted healthy tourism, that is: families and singles were provoked to go on adventure, they were promised an unforgetting experience, they were encouraged to discover its treasures. Turkey showed of its great infrastructure--it did not brag. Other countries (that I will not name) messed up repeatedly by not enforcing order on situations that got out of control and ruined its image with poor services, poor hospitality, overcrowded areas, arrogance, and bad juridical system. Still, from what I hear, Turkey needs to fix some of its road infrastructure, enforce better traffic conditions and become more liberal in its sexuality view. It's not all about golden beaches. You have some valuable points. Turkey needs to improve in some areas, not just roads but railways, maritime lines, and domestic airports. Sex is one of the many social aspects that must be improved along with driving skills of the residents. By the way, I think things are getting better every year.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 21, 2010 9:37:15 GMT -5
^ ok fair enough. I accept that the China analogy was a little overboard. But I still think Turkey can make a big impact on the world stage. They have a lot of potential to be up there. Thats all. You are right. Nationalism in Turkey is still a problem. Kurds of Turkey have been demanding more rights for decades, and their demand for regional autonomy has been neglected by the state for so far. However, it is impossible to assimilate native peoples whose population is as large as Greece. It is best affilate them to the country they live in by providing more rights on cultural basis. In a sense, if there was no Kurdish problem, then Turkey's per capita income could have been double of the current one. Turkey has no problems with Syria, Bulgaria, Azerbaijan, Iran, and Iraq. Problems with Greece are not very big, could be sorted out if both countries wish to. Relations with Armenia is more problematic, and it could be sorted out if a top Turkish administrator officially apologies for the losses that the Armenians suffered during the WWI. Apology for the Greeks? Why not. I personally state that I am sorry for all losses Greeks suffered due to past policies of the Turkish administrations. I will be happy to see more Greeks in Turkey, of course for good. Finally, Turkey as a superpower? In my opinion, Turkey could be a significant power as much as Italy, Germany, Japan, France or the UK are, but not as major as Russia, China or the USA.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 20, 2010 9:59:26 GMT -5
What makes you think the Pomaks have more of a chance to be descended from the original Turkic Bulgars than other Bulgarians? If anything its less likely they have Bulgar influence compared to other Bulgarians. Original Bolgars were Turkic peoples who tugged Slavs into the Balkans. They mixed with Slav and local masses, and over centuries they adaped the Slavic language. However, they also allowed migration of Turkic tribes like the Cumans into the Bulgarian territories. In that sense, let us bear in mind that there is no such thing like Bulgarian influence. There are three different ingredients of the Bulgarian ethnicity. Turkic, Slavic, and Local ones. After all, let us bear in mind that there exists linguistic and cultural relations between Turks and Pomaks. There are also such relations between the Pomaks and the Bulgarians. However, with regard to social relationships, I must conclude that the Pomaks are surely closer to the Turks and definetly can be deemed as seperate ethnic identity. I am a Karachay-Balkar. My grandfathers were from the place where Great Bulgaria was formed. The original Bolgar settlement was in fact a mountainous place as you could see from my avatar. ;D You might conclude so. However, the evolution of their ethnic identity is quite related to their political and cultural leaning. Alevis were mainly Turkmen populations, and it is true that they sided with the Azeris of Iran and Caucasus. That is why, Azeri identity evolved differently than the Turkish one even though Turkey and Iran (Iran ruled by the Azeris until the early 20th Century) did stop waging war on the other since 1638. Karamanlis were the Turks following Orthodox faith. With the implementation of the Population Exchange Agreement, Karamanlis ended up in Greece whilst Muslim Greeks ended up in Turkey. That was not some coincidence since evoluation of the ethnic identities in the Ottoman Empire differed from the ones evolved in other European states. Since the party has ethnic roots.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 20, 2010 6:24:05 GMT -5
Golden Apricot went to Turkey July 19, 2010 | 11:35 The 7th Golden Apricot International Film Festival is over. The awarding and closing ceremony took place in the Moscow cinema. The festival received 500 entries and about 120 films were screened. Forty-five films were involved in 3 international competitions judged by 5 international jury members. International Feature:Golden Apricot for the Best Feature Film to the Turkish director Reha Erdem for “Kosmos” Silver Apricot Special Prize for Feature Film to Sergey Loznitsa for “My Joy” International Documentary:Golden Apricot for the Best Documentary Film to Pavel Kostomarov for “Together” Silver Apricot Special Prize for Documentary Film to Vadim Jendreyko for “The Woman with Five Elephants” Armenian Panorama:Golden Apricot for the Best Armenian Film to Arman Yeritsyan and Inna Sahakyan for “The Last Tightrope Dancer in Armenia” Silver Apricot Special Prize to Comes Chahbazian for “Down Here” Special Mention to Nikolay Davtyan for “Uncle Valya” FPRESCI Jury Award went to Jasmila Žbaniæ for “On the Path” Ecumenical Jury Award went to Suren Babayan for “Don’t Look in the Mirror” and the Special Recommendation to Aleksei Popogrebsky for “How I Ended This Summer” Hrant Matevosyan Prize went to Marat Sargsyan for the short film “Lernavan” that also received the Best Short Film Award by the British Council of Armenia. Golden Apricot film Festival is held under the auspices of the Armenian Culture Ministry. VivaCell Company is the main sponsor of the festival. news.am/eng/news/25343.html
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 20, 2010 6:08:38 GMT -5
exactly, its just your oppinion, not shared with anyone outside of turkey... its nationalistic view and the most probable reason why bulgarians will never trust turkey... because you are always so temped to interfear into bulgarian affair, including the matter with the Bulgarian muslims. Of course my views are shared by many people, particularly by the people who are not ultra-nationalist Bulgarians. Ioan, Do you think that Pomaks of Greece, Bulgaria, Turkey and Albania want to be named as " ethnic Bulgarians"? Well, if you think so, then I have news for you: That is just nationalistic dogma, more like the ones once existed in Turkey which did not even want to speak of the Kurdish identity. Luckly for us, we passed that stage. Now we have the Kurdish, Arab TVs broadcasting in native tongues all day long whilst you in Bulgaria have parties trying to ban such basic rights of the minorities. It is good to celebrate your diversity rather than trying to fit everyone into some nationalist perceptions.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 20, 2010 1:14:46 GMT -5
Pomaks are ethnic Bulgarians there really is no point in arguing about this fact, Of course it could be argued on basis of historical facts. Bulgarian Nationalistic Dogma is simply not enough to counter the arguments asserted in relation to the origin of Bulgarians or Pomaks. In fact, when the origins of the Bulgarians are deemed to be Turkic by the bulk of world historians (excluding Danube Bulgarian ones), it would be funny to talk about Pomaks as some ethnic Bulgarians, particularly when those Pomaks were the ones who sided with the so called " evil Turks" against ethnic Bulgarians during 1877-1878 War and beyond. I suggest you to a map of last election results in Bulgaria, and to which party Pomak regions voted for.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 20, 2010 0:34:03 GMT -5
how are the Pomaks ALWAYS classified UNDOUBTEDLY? As south slavs! So south slavs CAN NOT speak Turkish, otherwise they wouldnt be called slavs, but turks. Their language is Bulgarian, not Turkish! On the one hand, the Pomak language is heavly influenced by the Turkish langage, and bulk of Pomak population speaks Turkish as good as the Turks do. On the other hand, it is true that Pomaks speak a South Slavic dialect. However, let us also recall that Cumans who settled in Hungary now speak Hungarian instead of a Turkish dalect. In my opinion, Pomaks are not some ethnic Bulgarians, bulk of Pomaks does not have any intention to become one.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 19, 2010 6:54:00 GMT -5
I m not Pomak. Some turkish words probably remained in the Southern Bulgarian dialect... Its well known fact that Bulgarian language possessed much more Turkish words that were removed after the liberation. But we all know what they mean - they are just archaic words that my grandma still uses like "ashkosum", "komshi" etc... This doesnt make Bulgarian Turkish... Its only natural that for 500 years some turkish words were adopted by us and then removed What you said could be true for the Bulgarians, but I do not think it is applicable for the whole Pomak community.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 19, 2010 1:05:45 GMT -5
Also Turkish girls like blue eyes? u mean that the darker Turks like lighter guys.... and the lighter Turks like darker guys. opposites attract That seems like true.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 19, 2010 0:59:33 GMT -5
How about we agree to condemn every violation committed to humans regardless of what ethnicity, race, or religion they belonged to? I totally agree with you. Very well said, Anittas.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 19, 2010 0:50:12 GMT -5
vizier, even your post says the pomaks speak bulgarian language. stop trying to fabricate our history. Source says Pomaks " speak dialects of Bulgarian and Turkish and maintain a strong and distinct identity". Are you a Pomak, Ioan?
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 16, 2010 17:03:09 GMT -5
Probably it is originally something Asian, and brought to Anatolia by the Turks as Basil states. In my opinion, it is as Turkish as much as it is Greek. After all, it is some form of art enjoyed by both peoples in the past.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 16, 2010 16:57:50 GMT -5
ok. .so what? Do you belive we have survived as a nation, culture, language, traditions etc etc almost 5000 years with 1 million wars and occupation always from biggerst nations.. by chance? We will just keep doing what we are good in; survival. Alone or not alone.. we're good at it. I respect Greek people, and I am on your side. It is the American strategists who do not seem to agree with you. It looks like they have plans for Greece.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 16, 2010 16:49:08 GMT -5
Pomak is the name of their nation. They are not Bulgarians. That is why they call themselves as the Pomaks. 1. There is no such nation. 2. If some consider themselves Bulgarians, whereas others consider themselves something else, then the matter is under dispute. 3. To identify yourself as something doesn't exclude the posibility if belonging to another group of people. They could be a subgroup of Bulgarians; or it could be a regional identity. I think people could have different opinions on this subject. About the Pomak NationThere is a large minority nation in the Balkans which is mostly overlooked and neglected, even if they used to have an independent and recognized state of their own not so long ago. Minahan doesn't count them at all among many nations of One Europe. They number @ 500 000 - (150 000-200 in Bulgaria, 35 000 in Greece, some in Macedonia, and a large diaspora in Turkey -@ 300 000), speak dialects of Bulgarian and Turkish and maintain a strong and distinct identity. Their homeland is in the Rhodope Mountains. Bulgarians and Greeks consider them mostly converted to Islam Slavs. The Turks, on the other hand, like to believe they are descendants of ancient Cumans who accepted Islam from the early Muslim missionaries. When the Bulgarian Principality was created in the aftermath of the Russo-Turkish war, the Congress of Berlin 1878 established, at British insistence, an autonomous, but largely independent province of Eastern Rumelia with the Christian governor who was, nominally only, appointed by the Ottoman Sultan. The Pomaks rebelled against the Bulgarian-dominated Eastern Rumelia and established, with the British help, an independent Pomak Republic of Tamrash which lasted until the military coup brought Eastern Rumelia into the Bulgarian State in 1886. The territory of the Republic was then reincorporated into the Ottoman Empire. The Tamrash Pomak Republic used the flag of three horizontal bands of red-green-black. flagsvancouver.com/fotw/flags/bg_pomak.html#about
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 16, 2010 8:07:22 GMT -5
ational identity? what national identity? they are bulgarians. all other teories are fairytales fabricated mostly by Turkey. Pomak is the name of their nation. They are not Bulgarians. That is why they call themselves as the Pomaks.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 16, 2010 6:14:59 GMT -5
Pomaks of Turkey of course identify as Turks, otherwise they wouldnt have moved to Turkey. But the Turks have to accept that growing number of Pomaks do identify as Bulgarians and should stay out of the Bulgarian affairs. Growing number of Pomaks identifying themselves as Bulgarians? That is tricky affirmation. If the percentage of the Pomak population distancing themselves from Bulgarian Nationalism is higher than the ones who jump into the Bulgarian National Dogma Wagon, then your assertation could be deemed as false. In the case of Pomaks, I witness growing awarness of their own national identity, which differs substantially from the one that commonly exists amongst ethnic Bulgarians.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 16, 2010 1:31:12 GMT -5
I will be going there in a month! Whopee ! Good choice. Next time you go, perhaps you might like to check out this one. I think about staying there next year. www.7800cesme.com/
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 16, 2010 1:23:25 GMT -5
By the way, alot of Pomaks do identify as Bulgarians. For example, the father of Tom Hanks' wife is Bulgarian muslim. I saw an interview with Tom Hanks about the Terminal, where he talks in Bulgarian. He said that his father-in-law, who is "Bulgarian" though him to speak "bulgarian language". Also lots of young pomaks who are not religious do identify absolutely as Bulgarians. Presently, Bulgarians are not too religious. I think the majority of the Pomaks do see themselves as Bulgarians. Turks should stay away. I am sorry but, I have not met a single Pomak so far claiming some Bulgarian ancestry even though I met so many of them. Nevertheless, it is well known fact that the Pomaks in Turkey and Greece are particularly assimilated into Turkish culture, and their Pomak identity happens to be cluster of a larger layer common amongst Balkan Muslims. In Bulgaria, Pomaks have been the target of Bulgarian Nationalist dogmas since 1878. For this reason, some fraction of the Pomak populations must have been assimilated into the Bulgarians masses in order to evade ongoing prosecution. However, even today most Pomaks identify themselves as a minority together with the Turks rather than with the ethnic Bulgarians. That shows their overall perceptions.
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Post by Vizier of Oz on Jul 15, 2010 5:06:58 GMT -5
CesmeWith its golden sands, diamond-glinted sea, luxury beach clubs and crazy water sports, Cesme is the Aegean’s rising star. And this summer it is more determined than ever to shineGoing to Cesme is one of the most practical ways of escaping the urban stress and oppressive heat, as I quickly realized in the thick shade of a giant palm at the harbor. Little more than an Izmir backwater for years, Cesme today is a serious contender with Bodrum and Antalya for summer tourism. A boon it perhaps owes to its infinite capacity to reinvent itself. So much has changed since three years ago when I spent one of the best vacations of my life in Cesme. For one thing, there are the hotels and restaurants, which put the Spanish and Italian coasts to shame. The artsy crowd of urban escapees continue to flock here in droves. Florida photographer Charlie Ibrahim Duygulu for one, who has come here to build yachts at Alaçatý, says Cesme is even more beautiful than the Greek islands. And there are many other entrepreneurs who have settled here for similar reasons. Long story short, Cesme’s windy shore just a stone’s throw from Izmir looks like thriving this summer. THE FLAVOR OF GUM MASTICToday’s Cesme was the ancient Cyssus, a highly developed port city that once controlled the regional trade. In the Ottoman period it performed the key function of controlling the Aegean Sea, and two famous Turkish commanders, Çaka Bey and Cezayirli Hasan Paþa are among the first names that spring to mind at any mention of the town. ‘Cesme’ means ‘fountain’, and you will of course encounter a host of lovely ones in this area of historic fountains for which streets and squares are named: the Hacý Memiþ Aða, Hafize Rabia Hatun, Kabadayý, Kaymakam Sadýk Bey, Mehmet Kethüda and Mimar Mehmet fountains, to name just a few. A pleasant stroll starting from the historic city center to the castle and museum is the best way to take in Cesme’s traditional architecture. The 16th century caravanserai was built to meet the needs of traders coming from distant realms. Cesme’s houses, the newest of which are a century old, exhibit an unique synthesis of Greek and Turkish architecture. And the legendary terebinth tree with its miraculous cure for all ills continues to grow here. Spearheaded by local nature lovers, a new project aims to turn the tree’s gum mastic to economic gain. Used to flavor everything from jams and coffee to rice pudding, gum mastic makes ice cream, served in a hollowed out Cesme melon, irresistible. According to the local rag, over a hundred different herbs grow in Cesme, which is at the same time the Aegean’s purveyor of artichokes. Indeed there is no shortage of products to appeal to the palate here. You can find everything from seafood and vegetarian dishes to world cuisine and diet menus, all at quality service, in Cesme and its environs. THE SEVEN WONDERS OF CESMEWith fabulous beaches along its 29-kilometer coastal strip, Cesme is known for its variety of sands, which rival its cuisines in diversity. Among them, Ilýca is the most famous of Cesme’s many touristic areas, including Alaçatý, Ilýca, Çiftlik, Paþalimaný, Þifne and Ildýrý, all of which are in high demand in summer. At two kilometers in length, it is reminiscent of the Maldives with its dazzling white sands and turquoise waters. What’s more, a hot water spring that empties into the sea here transforms Ilýca into one big thermal pool, thanks to which swimming is possible on average six months of the year. To witness this natural wonder, often said to be therapeutic, you must go to Yýldýz Burnu. The beach also boasts courts for beach volleyball buffs. Since the water is only waist-deep even a long way from shore, it’s ideal for families with children. Opened up for tourism in the 1960’s along with Ilýca, the ‘Golden Sands’ Altýnkum beach is entirely covered with natural sand. Meanwhile Dalyan on Cesme’s northern coast, famous for its yacht harbor, fish restaurants and mermaid statue, is one of the area’s most delightful coves. Its bass, red mullet, and sea and gilthead bream come highly recommended by seasoned Dalyan fisherman Cevat Aksu. Ayayorgi between Dalyan and Ilýca is another natural cove, shaped liked a half moon, where food and drink are served in the sunbathing areas on the wooden landings and grassy lawns. Known in the local parlance as ‘the sleeping sea’, this cove is the choice of those who prefer cooler waters. When it comes to tents and caravans, the lovely beach at Paþalimaný, where the forest meets the sea, is just the spot. A portion of its pebble beach is covered with fine sand. And the water here, where even stones on the sea floor can be seen from meters up, is sparklingly pure as at all the Cesme beaches. THE UNDERWATER WORLDThe mysterious underwater world is a key tourist attraction at Cesme, where life is enhanced by the sea. You can experience memorable moments here, where unequalled diving opportunities await amateurs and professionals alike. The scuba diving points around the islands of Fener, Yatak and Eþek on Ildýrý Bay attract divers with their underwater caves. And don’t be surprised to encounter a Mediterranean seal at any moment! But the real drawing point of the region is the wind surfing at Alaçatý. The cove at Çark Plage, one of the world’s leading wind surfing areas, is a virtual surfing pool. Sports enthusiasts from around the world can be seen all four seasons here, where the wind blows almost 365 days a year and the sea is very shallow. All of this makes Cesme a major wind surf area. If you need yet another reason to come to Cesme, the Cesme Festival, the Aegean region’s leading art and culture event, is on through July 3rd. Featuring a number of renowned musicians, the international song contest at this year’s 21st festival is scheduled for the last day at Cesme’s Amphitheatre, with Bonnie Tyler as guest artist. But even if you can’t make the festival at the beginning of July, there will be many more things to please you later on in the summer. And that is why we say, ‘This summer Cesme!’ HOW TO GET THERETurkish Airlines flies from Istanbul to Izmir and back every day of the week. The Izmir-Cesme road is much shorter and safer now following construction of the new autobahn. WHERE TO STAYThere is a wide choice of lodging at Cesme, all the way from modest bed&breakfasts to five-star hotels. Alaçatý’s boutique hotels are especially popular. WHAT TO BUYGum mastic flavored taffy, milk pudding and coffee, pistachio jam, hand-made decorative items, dried flowers, scented soaps and herbals teas are available. www.thy.com/en-INT/corporate/skylife/article.aspx?mkl=2019
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