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Post by Kassandros on Oct 10, 2008 9:50:12 GMT -5
quite a discussion eh givemebeer? We speak about 300 Greeks at the most.... without not even one evidence they killed at least ONE unarmed citizen. On the other hand we dont speak about Mujahendins and Turk mercenaries who fought for Bosnia and they were 10 times more. We speak about the crimes of Serbs. On the other hand we dont mention not even ONE crime of Bosnians. We speak about the friendly feelings of Greeks towards Serbs during the war. On the other hand we dont mention the friendly feelinings of Germans toward Croates and Turks toward Bosnians. We speak about Greece didnt arrest Karajits or Mladic who killed people with their orders. On the other hand we dont mention why Greece didnt arest Bush or Clinton too for killing more people around the world with their orders too. And finally, the same and the same suspects. A "Dutch" reporter. What it troubles me is why always the reporter has to come from a country that follows the American external policy in the best way. I'm bored to see antiGreek articles in English, Dutch, US, Turkish, Slovenian, Ukrainian,Polish,Fyromian,Albanian newspapers. Why I have NEVER seen a relatively hostile report from a reporter from France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Louxembourg, Belgium etc etc?? Thats my internal question. These countries dont have good reporters... or the good reporters are all gathered in the sphere of influence of Pax Americana? I really wander that? Is it a symptosis that Holland is the FIRST country in Europe for American money invests? Is it a symptosis that Holland was the first country that recognized Fyrom as "Macedonia". .even faster than US! ? Is it a symposis that Holland ALWAYS comes in confrontation with the hard core EU countries in the EU meetings? Is it a symptosis that the French minister told to the Dutch minister in the EU meeting "I cant have a descent converation with you. Its like speaking directly with the White House over the future of EU"? Come on mate... dont try to sell bs here. We know what is going on in this world. Dont try to play your American games with Greeks. We read a lot and we read different sources.. not just the sources of Pax-America.....
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Demonel
Amicus
I am Jack's regained insanity.
Posts: 833
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Post by Demonel on Oct 10, 2008 11:34:58 GMT -5
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Post by greek1234 on Oct 10, 2008 11:42:31 GMT -5
If Greeks did such things, they only did it in defense of the Orthodox Christians and Churches who where being persecuted and burnt.
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Post by epiroti on Oct 10, 2008 11:44:36 GMT -5
I need help... come hold my left teste..... War is dirty.... you do what you have to...... I come from an island that 75% of the population was massacred .... so don't lecture me on what's right and wrong... If anything, you should be more againt massacres... You need psychiatric treatment mate.
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Oct 10, 2008 12:35:57 GMT -5
Do any of you Greeks understand how many innocent civilians died in Bosnia ??
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Demonel
Amicus
I am Jack's regained insanity.
Posts: 833
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Post by Demonel on Oct 10, 2008 12:53:34 GMT -5
How many Orthodox Churches were burnt in Bosnia?
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Post by givemebeer on Oct 10, 2008 13:12:17 GMT -5
quite a discussion eh givemebeer? We speak about 300 Greeks at the most.... without not even one evidence they killed at least ONE unarmed citizen. On the other hand we dont speak about Mujahendins and Turk mercenaries who fought for Bosnia and they were 10 times more. We speak about the crimes of Serbs. On the other hand we dont mention not even ONE crime of Bosnians. We speak about the friendly feelings of Greeks towards Serbs during the war. On the other hand we dont mention the friendly feelinings of Germans toward Croates and Turks toward Bosnians. We speak about Greece didnt arrest Karajits or Mladic who killed people with their orders. On the other hand we dont mention why Greece didnt arest Bush or Clinton too for killing more people around the world with their orders too. And finally, the same and the same suspects. A "Dutch" reporter. What it troubles me is why always the reporter has to come from a country that follows the American external policy in the best way. I'm bored to see antiGreek articles in English, Dutch, US, Turkish, Slovenian, Ukrainian,Polish,Fyromian,Albanian newspapers. Why I have NEVER seen a relatively hostile report from a reporter from France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Louxembourg, Belgium etc etc?? Thats my internal question. These countries dont have good reporters... or the good reporters are all gathered in the sphere of influence of Pax Americana? I really wander that? Is it a symptosis that Holland is the FIRST country in Europe for American money invests? Is it a symptosis that Holland was the first country that recognized Fyrom as "Macedonia". .even faster than US! ? Is it a symposis that Holland ALWAYS comes in confrontation with the hard core EU countries in the EU meetings? Is it a symptosis that the French minister told to the Dutch minister in the EU meeting "I cant have a descent converation with you. Its like speaking directly with the White House over the future of EU"? Come on mate... dont try to sell bs here. We know what is going on in this world. Dont try to play your American games with Greeks. We read a lot and we read different sources.. not just the sources of Pax-America..... ehem, I said that the arabs who came to fight for the bosnians, were the same scum as the greeks who fought for the serbs, so.. learn to read mate...
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Oct 10, 2008 13:26:34 GMT -5
How many Orthodox Churches were burnt in Bosnia? whats that have to do with rape and murder ? ................. more important : what were Orthodoc Christian serbs doing bringing down Christian Catholic Churches for ?other wise burning the mosque or church means nothing in the balkans its a time proven power play thing ....
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 10, 2008 13:40:05 GMT -5
In the second video,the Greek "volunteer" who speaks in a Greek radio station supposed to be real ;D (00:47) I agree totally with Greece's position to go against NATO's anti-Serb stance. At last,one time that Greece showed that has arxidia. This doesn't mean that Greece approve(d) massacres from the Serb side, but I wait someone to say that Bosnaks were angels...
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Post by givemebeer on Oct 10, 2008 13:49:55 GMT -5
In the second video,the Greek "volunteer" who speaks in a Greek radio station supposed to be real ;D (00:47) I agree totally with Greece's position to go against NATO's anti-Serb stance. At last,one time that Greece showed that has arxidia. This doesn't mean that Greece approve(d) massacres from the Serb side, but I wait someone to say that Bosnaks were angels... I was only adressing the Greeks who went to BOsnia to take part in the war, I honestly do not care about the Greek stance on NATO operations...
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Oct 10, 2008 13:55:40 GMT -5
Bosnaks were angels...
Bosnians in their wildest dreams would of never thought that serbia/serbs would unleash on its people/cousins ....
they woke up one day and their was a war they were in ....repercussions by bosnians or any other is typical ...
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Kanaris
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This just in>>>> Nobody gives a crap!
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Post by Kanaris on Oct 10, 2008 14:17:36 GMT -5
Why does this concern Albanians? Did any Albanians die?
Or ,do you want me to whip out the link again where it says Albanians scaled the walls of Psara to attack helpless civilains and children. 17,000 people got butchered by hideous Mohammedan Albanians... I call them hideous cause it's the same dickheads that praise Scanderbeg for fighting the Turks..... you get my drift?
This fuggen guys forgot what themselves have perpetrated upon others.....
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 10, 2008 14:27:46 GMT -5
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Post by meltdown711 on Oct 10, 2008 14:44:17 GMT -5
The first link, that of George Finlay, is a very very interesting ethnographic description.
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 10, 2008 15:14:30 GMT -5
The first link, that of George Finlay, is a very very interesting ethnographic description. Yes it is,I've read it all.And many other about this period...I'm glad that they've written so much about Greece and Greeks of 19th century so we can know a lot today... And beacause I think I understand what are you trying to say,about the number of Arvanites in southern Greece...200.000, according to him , just note that the same author when he was asked about the number of the arvanites in Greece from your friend Von Hahn talked about 100.000 ... Johann Georg Von Hahn, Albanesische Studien, Jena 1854,σελVI,14.31.32Do you have the book? And its an opportunity to learn more about the massacre of 1770' in Morea, Patra remembers it till now...
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Oct 10, 2008 15:31:13 GMT -5
Why does this concern Albanians? Did any Albanians die?
yes..from the same regime ...
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Post by kapetan on Oct 10, 2008 15:42:20 GMT -5
If Greeks did such things, they only did it in defense of the Orthodox Christians and Churches who where being persecuted and burnt. LOL Genocide in the defense of Orthodoxy! We all know Bosnians were on the verge of destroying and wiping the Orthodox religion off the face of the Earth. Or were we fighting for land and didn't give 2 s**ts about Orthodox religion? That's a tough one! I guess you love Mujahideen too then? Why does this concern Albanians? Did any Albanians die? Or ,do you want me to whip out the link again where it says Albanians scaled the walls of Psara to attack helpless civilains and children. 17,000 people got butchered by hideous Mohammedan Albanians... I call them hideous cause it's the same dickheads that praise Scanderbeg for fighting the Turks..... you get my drift? This fuggen guys forgot what themselves have perpetrated upon others..... Uhh, actualy yes a small number of Albanian civilians and soldiers did die. The Albanians living in Bosnia died from and fought the VRS agressor just like Bosnians and Croats and even asignificant number of Bosnian Serbs did. Not much choice, when your town is under seige all ofa sudden. The mortars hiting the streets don't really recognize ethnicity.
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Post by meltdown711 on Oct 10, 2008 15:44:50 GMT -5
Finley makes a number of mistakes and his attitude is very 19th century. He generalizes much and overuses terms like "race". Anyway, he makes a number of mistakes in his treatment of Orthodox Albanians. If you read "The Muslim Bonaparte", a modern treatment of Ali Pasha and Greece, the author talks about how relations between Muslim and Christian Albanians were quite close and there was a very strong awareness of common ethnicity among the two and a need to maintain some kind of ethnic unity. Another interesting study posted up on this forum a while back on the chams showed (in Albanian though), showed how there were a high number of intermarriages between Muslim and Christian Albanian families in order to create alliances and help each other out. These intermarriages could, at times, involve Greeks and the children do not seem to have been put under much pressure to go to the Muslim side.
Finlay never saw this apparently and probably didnt look close enuff into the societies he was studying to see it. He cared too much for generalizations.
As if I can find this book where I am...
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Patrinos
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Post by Patrinos on Oct 10, 2008 16:01:55 GMT -5
Btw do you have the original dictionary of Kristoforidhi(in greek alphabet)...?
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rex362
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Post by rex362 on Oct 10, 2008 17:33:56 GMT -5
kapetani .....that circling oily azz is still making me dizzy ....I'm going to put a complaint in to high command here... bcs I cant keep my eyes on your written words ... I'm serious ....
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