|
Post by Novi Pazar on Jun 22, 2008 21:37:57 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Novi Pazar on Jun 22, 2008 21:39:43 GMT -5
|
|
Kanaris
Amicus
This just in>>>> Nobody gives a crap!
Posts: 9,587
|
Post by Kanaris on Jun 22, 2008 21:48:53 GMT -5
I always believed that.... but many Albanian youngsters know nothing of that....
|
|
|
Post by Toskaliku on Jun 22, 2008 21:55:35 GMT -5
Ofcourse it wasnt forced... it had far more to do with interests and the social-political position of Albanian in that time and the condition of the church, videos like this are hogwash by the religious minority that need to make themselves feel good.
The reason why Albs converted is an extremely complicated one, but actual faith doesnt play the strongest role since its only recently that Albs were introduced to the "proper" kind of Islam. For most of our history there was a mixture of things practiced in the various parts of the country.
|
|
|
Post by bordura on Jun 22, 2008 22:46:31 GMT -5
A force can be violent and non violent. I don't think a violent type of force was used against Albanian population to make it convert to Islam.
I do on the other hand think that was indirect or direct pressure forced upon their life with result conversion.
As Toskali mentioned reasons and factors leading to conversion are very complex.
Also the fact that Islam was at the time the religion of the occupation forces can't be ignored. If lands when Albanians where living at that time was not to be occupied from an Islamic force, then: Would Albanians had convert to Islam?
Between many things the occupation brought/influenced in to our lands was the new religion! Forced or not was imported from an occupying power.
One of the most important reasons accepting Islam was the need to protect and keep property. The one marking itself as different from the other in a way had established boundaries. If you notice in the areas when Albanians live, the outer ring or the perimeter of Albanian population is almost 100% Muslim. The inner population it is less religious and more mixed. Obviously the need of Albanian people living in frontiers or the outer ring of Albanian populated lands had more pressure from neighbors in property and land issues, hence distinguishing themselves from them was means of marking the territory.
If you look at todays Balkan's map Serbia, Fyrom, Bulgaria, Romania, Greece all have this soft mixing of heritage/property/right in border lines. They all are of one religion. Albanians by converting in a way marked a clear territory. Look at todays FYROM what are they? Bulgarian, Serb, Greek, as they themselves say Macedonian?
|
|
|
Post by terroreign on Jun 23, 2008 2:25:08 GMT -5
The catholic albos I respect highly
|
|
|
Post by kasso on Jun 23, 2008 5:21:38 GMT -5
I don't agree with the arguements that Albanians converted voluntarily. They were forced to convert because they were rebellious and this was the only way to subdue them.
|
|
|
Post by albaniansoul on Jun 23, 2008 11:26:48 GMT -5
Last two replies... You 2 should marry eachother. A retarded one and a delusional one.
|
|
|
Post by telemaque on Jun 23, 2008 12:35:47 GMT -5
they were forced to...undenieable...that's one of the reason many left to Italy; avoid islamic conversions...
|
|
|
Post by captainalbania on Jun 23, 2008 13:33:56 GMT -5
>they were forced to...undenieable...that's one of the reason many left to Italy; avoid islamic >conversions...
Bingo, half our population went to Italy at the time.
|
|
|
Post by panagiotopoulos on Jun 23, 2008 14:31:08 GMT -5
>they were forced to...undenieable...that's one of the reason many left to Italy; avoid islamic >conversions... Bingo, half our population went to Italy at the time. Hawgwawsh!!!!
|
|
libofsha
Amicus
socially inept village idiot who is having a meltdown daily
Posts: 611
|
Post by libofsha on Jun 23, 2008 16:25:34 GMT -5
to tell you the truth growing up i never knew the difference between various religeous beliefs like most albos, this idea(or better myth) of islamic albania has been perpetuated by the ill intent malicious greeks who pounce at every opportunity to point it out like its some kind of burden or worse still, a mark of shame, inadvertedly exposing their own religious paranoia and xenophobia, why do we always overlook this fact?!! like its become some sort of a socially accepted norm to insult someone on grounds of their religeous background, in many ways overlooking the fact that the greek orthodox church is guilty of so many ill reputed deals with the ottoman empire to trade 'people' among each other by displacing them from their homes on the basis of their religious pertinence, in many instances their own kin solely because they were muslim, shipped them off to turkey and vice versa, isn't this a more repugnant mark of shame? yet we 'condemn' the overwhelming nominally muslim albos because they converted for survival....it just doesn't add up, the logic is very twisted, i am not muslim myself but its outrageous how greeks and serbs go on anti-islam bashing rants without setting off any alarms, people just regard it as normal....and why the fuck do albos have to make excuses about being muslim??? we don't need to justify anything to the greeks, that way we just perpetuate and inflate their ego and their sinister views on religion, the descendants of the mighty helens who gave the world democracy!!! they would have been proud of their spawn....well of their real 'untainted' offspring anyway.
|
|
|
Post by greek1234 on Jun 23, 2008 16:31:12 GMT -5
The Mujahideen (Persian/ Arabic meaning holy warrior), supported the Kossovo Liberation Army, there is no denying this, if you work with terrorists you are a terrorist.
|
|
libofsha
Amicus
socially inept village idiot who is having a meltdown daily
Posts: 611
|
Post by libofsha on Jun 23, 2008 16:46:23 GMT -5
that's a load of bulls**t mate, extremist help was swiftly rejected....i am not saying that kla couldn't use all the help they could get but that was a war strategy, you think the americans would have been so generous to offer their help if kla had accepted the help of the mudja hadin? again a claim foundamentally flawed, stop making up facts
|
|
|
Post by Toskaliku on Jun 23, 2008 17:22:10 GMT -5
Between 1/3 or 1/4 of the Albanian population fled the country in the years following the death of Scanderbeg. Another 1/4 died as a result of 30-years defense against the Ottomans.
Libofsha is right, the KLA was far better organized then other groups and many realized that allowing extremists would harm their image. On top of that the KLA was ethnocentric, they were not so much concerned with religion but rather ethnicity. Thus many who were from the middle east were rejected. In fact we even had a Turk on our forums who told of stories about Turks from his area(he lived in Kayseri) who went to fight but were rejected and came back frustrated and angered by the KLA.
Accepting Islamists or Arabs might have had its advantages but it could very easily cross the very thin line between liberation army and separatist terrorist...
|
|
|
Post by redbaron on Jun 23, 2008 17:47:39 GMT -5
The Mujahideen (Persian/ Arabic meaning holy warrior), supported the Kossovo Liberation Army, there is no denying this, if you work with terrorists you are a terrorist. If you come from a nation of fags you are a fag.There is no denying of this.
|
|
libofsha
Amicus
socially inept village idiot who is having a meltdown daily
Posts: 611
|
Post by libofsha on Jun 23, 2008 17:52:57 GMT -5
they're not denying it!...they are embracing it
|
|
|
Post by albaniansoul on Jun 23, 2008 22:38:31 GMT -5
"The Mujahideen (Persian/ Arabic meaning holy warrior), supported the Kossovo Liberation Army, there is no denying this, if you work with terrorists you are a terrorist. "
Really, well I was in UCK, and I support Greeks = Greeks are terrorists. How do you get "work with" into the picture. They supported Kosova and offered help, we said no fucking thanks.
Stupid ape.
|
|
|
Post by greek1234 on Jun 23, 2008 23:07:49 GMT -5
Greeks are Christians. The Albanians worked with Al-Qaeda. Its disgusting what the Kossovo Albanians did to the churches during the Yugoslavian War, the Albanians and other Islamic people persecuted the Christian populations such as the Serbs. Albanians today cross the Greek border and disfigure the icons. Albanians are a barbaric people.
|
|
|
Post by Toskaliku on Jun 23, 2008 23:10:55 GMT -5
Doesnt seem to have influenced the high level of pro-Palestinianism in Greece. I dont think most Albanians have very pro-Israel views, but I havent seen nearly as big a level of pro-Palestinianism among us as I have with Greece...
|
|