Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 14, 2010 6:22:44 GMT -5
I have come across quite a few Macedonians who are clearly not southern European but, I'm curious, what actually are they? Are these people actually Slavs? They don't really look Slavic to me. Even if you consider their hair to be bleached (which probably isn't since light hair isn't that rare in Macedonia) they are still very fair and non-med looking. These are just a couple of examples I've come across recently when watching Macedonian news.
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 14, 2010 6:30:09 GMT -5
you can see such faces all over the balkans man. about 20% in Bulgaria/Serbia/Makedonia, 30% in Bosnia, 50% in croatia.
|
|
Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 14, 2010 6:35:36 GMT -5
you can see such faces all over the balkans man. about 20% in Bulgaria/Serbia/Makedonia, 30% in Bosnia, 50% in croatia. They must be whatever Slovenians are if their frequency increases the further north you go. Because when I was in Slovenia, more than 50% of the people there were like that, very fair and blonde. Though they were also shorter.
|
|
|
Post by ulf on Sept 14, 2010 7:14:00 GMT -5
First woman looks Uralic. Second probably just coloured her hair
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 14, 2010 7:39:38 GMT -5
you can see such faces all over the balkans man. about 20% in Bulgaria/Serbia/Makedonia, 30% in Bosnia, 50% in croatia. They must be whatever Slovenians are if their frequency increases the further north you go. Because when I was in Slovenia, more than 50% of the people there were like that, very fair and blonde. Though they were also shorter. its hard to tell Nikola. In one village they are like that, in another village they are different. In southern Serbia, in Nis they are dark, in Leskovac they are whiter, in Zajecar they are huge and in Kladovo blond. It depends.
|
|
Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 14, 2010 7:56:23 GMT -5
its hard to tell Nikola. In one village they are like that, in another village they are different. In southern Serbia, in Nis they are dark, in Leskovac they are whiter, in Zajecar they are huge and in Kladovo blond. It depends. Typical Balkan demographics then, lol.
|
|
Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 14, 2010 10:04:47 GMT -5
Here is another one, Jovanovski. He was the main character in the movie Balcancan. They are not the best pictures (the only ones I can find) but when I first saw him in a movie, I thought he was Scottish or something.
|
|
|
Post by andromeda on Sept 14, 2010 11:02:55 GMT -5
That was a crazy movie. LOL.
|
|
|
Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Sept 14, 2010 19:32:35 GMT -5
Those people you posted are rufous and I think the most rufous people I have seen are from Albania and FYROM. Not that they look particularly Albanian or FYROMian but... I have no idea where it could be from. Unrelated to those people you posted I think south Serbia, Bulgaria, FYROM has some sort of element more akin to northern east slavs that is absent in Croatia, Bosnia, Monte/Serbia. I think this could be accounted for by the miscellaneous type slavs said to have migrated to the region. This Serbian tennis player (Karolina Jovanovic) has a look straight out of Moscow... I've seen this look in Bulgarians, FYROMskis & southern Serbs but not in Bosnia, Croatia or Montenegro...
|
|
|
Post by EriTopSheqeri on Sept 14, 2010 20:20:43 GMT -5
None of the people on those pics look even remotely Albanian...Czech maybe
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 15, 2010 4:44:45 GMT -5
Arsenije, i dont know, in Sarajevo and Brcko (Posavina) i have seen faces like her all over. I think Bosnians (Serbs/Muslims) are blonder than Srbijanci in general. But for Serbs from Krajna tho, (my wife included) i think are more dark. Its so hard to tell.
Also look at the Croat soccer/basketball teams. They are blonder than the Serbians in general. In croatia, Gunja, Zupanja, etc... i see, while driving, a lot of blond faces, but maybe we need more traveling to these places (or simply ... vacations lol ;D)
|
|
|
Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Sept 15, 2010 6:23:09 GMT -5
Piros, bratko I dunno man. You look in the Miss BiH thread none of the girls look anything like this Karolina Jovanovic. Round head and kind of rounder/softer features. Nah man people in Croatia, Bosnia, Monte/Serbia don't look like her. They have sharper harder features more akin to Coons Dinaric classification. I'm not saying shes typical for Bul/FYROM/SE Serbia but that this rare type is found more typically in Bul/FYROM/SE Serbia. I seem to remember there's some Bulgarian Torlaks on youtube singing who look like her. Honestly it's all so mixed but one thing man I've never heard Serbs talk amongst themselves much about being physiologically different. Bosnian Serbs never say oh we look any different to any other Serbs. All we might say is Monte/Hercegovinans are taller but not really much different in features though I've also heard south eastern Serbs & FYROMians are darker and shorter that's for sure. But then again this girl looks more like someone you'd find in Bul/FYROM/SE Serbia. I think from Dalmatian Croatia & Krajina to Serbia and blending into FYROM it is the same stock of people. I think you're best off applying a physiological classification corresponding essentially to Stokavians. Going beyond that is possible but it's more micro, more political, more bulls**t. Stokavians are for the most part root Serbian in origin man that's what I think.
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 15, 2010 6:31:40 GMT -5
Yes, the shape of the head/angles is a factor as well. I know also a woman from Beograd (with last name -ski) who is round and blonde. Her son is round as well. Her husband is from Greek makedonia, so i suppose this family to be full-southern slavs makedonians. lol! You are right, Bosnians/Croats/Serbs are not that round, but have sharper corners.
|
|
Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 16, 2010 0:48:55 GMT -5
And then you have people like this. Where are they from? They clearly have an Asiatic appearance.
|
|
Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 16, 2010 0:56:29 GMT -5
I think from Dalmatian Croatia & Krajina to Serbia and blending into FYROM it is the same stock of people. How would you guy's draw this range of people on a map? Here is a blank map, could you colour in the sections you think people are of the same stock? I have seen some maps on the Balkans made by westerners but all of them were wrong imo.
|
|
Kralj Vatra
Amicus
Warning: Sometimes uses foul language & insults!!!
20%
Posts: 9,814
|
Post by Kralj Vatra on Sept 16, 2010 1:32:40 GMT -5
Nikola, Tose Proeski was a Vlach. Same as Tosic the serbian soccer player. Same as Averov Tosicas (Tosic-as) the great greek Vlach donor. Same as Branislav Nusic, who was originally from greek western makedonia. Frankly, i believe from 400 AD-1000AD, no Greek speakers existed in Greece. The few non-slav inhabitants were latin speakers (Vlahs) and most probably looked like Jelena or Tose proeski. If those ppl were formerly proper "ancient" Greeks pre-400AD, that i dont know, but it is very possible, since the exact same faces you can find in Cyprus or Crete where no vlach ever existed. In Greece the slavs prevailed over the locals and assimilated them in a big degree. Thats way the toponyms even in pure-vlah areas were still slavic. Byzantines after 1000 started a hellenization campaign with the help of Armenian military and the transfer of grekophones-albanians from Asia and as a result the Slavs moved to the north. That can explain why there were over 10,000 of slavic toponyms all over Greece before 1927. The remains of those slavs+old local vlahs+hellenized vlahs+greko-phones from Asia+hellenized albanians constitute the todays modern "hellenic" race. I think we are an artificial race engineered by the byzantines when they spoiled relations with the local slavs of Greece. The proof of why todays Greek are not natives, comes from the fact that no one bothered, still after 1500 years, to change certain toponyms of huge natural elements. (e.g. Mount Olytsika, Smolikas huge mountain in Ipirus still have the slavic names), and the examples are countless, which show that History is not so "simple" as the English are trying to portray. So Tose is 100% native balkanian (greko-vlah) while Jelena has smth germanic/hunic/asiatic in her face. Now about the map i think the best answer is this one: although things would be more interesting if we could zoom into this map.
|
|
Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 16, 2010 5:03:13 GMT -5
Thanks Pyrros. See, I feel no insult when you talk about matters on the Balkans because you are always willing to acknowledge that the real truth may be hidden behind centuries of propaganda, including from your own country.
Btw, that map you just posted could explain an encounter I had with a girl from Moldova, here in Australia last week. She is the first person I have ever come across that was from Moldova, and as soon as we saw each other, we both just clicked and knew we were from a similar ethnic background. Her name was Svetlana and I felt very comfortable around her, more comfortable than any Greek or Italian I come across every single day. She was also very attractive and I should have asked her out but it was not to be, lol.
|
|
donnie
Senior Moderator
Nike Leka i Kelmendit
Posts: 3,389
|
Post by donnie on Sept 16, 2010 5:07:44 GMT -5
I find it ironic that you and Novi continuously rant about evil westerners (in particular Germans) distorting "real" history for the sake of some agenda .. and here you're in complete agreement with one of such (in)famous theories presented by several Germans, lol. Remember Fallmerayer? He said the same thing basically as you.
PS We can conclude that your view of your own "nation" is that it was engineered artificially by the Byzantines for the sake of getting back at the superior Slavs, and that it is conclusively a degenerated mixture of unwanted elements, right? Would you have prefered that Greece was a Slav country? That is my question.
|
|
|
Post by Caslav Klonimirovic on Sept 16, 2010 5:17:19 GMT -5
lol Nikola if her name was Svetlana she is almost certainly a member of the >20% slavic community in Moldova of which most are Ukrainians. Nikola, the map you are asking for is a Stokavian map. Standardized Stokavian is based on the red area around Hercegovina.
|
|
Nikola
Senior Moderator
Posts: 1,835
|
Post by Nikola on Sept 16, 2010 5:30:17 GMT -5
She was Slavic Arsenije. She even spoke with that sexy Russian/Ukranian accent. ;D
And thanks for the map.
|
|