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Post by terroreign on Oct 18, 2011 3:57:32 GMT -5
the name Bitola is derived from the old Slavic word Obitel (monastery or abode), since the city was formerly noted for its monastery. When the meaning of the name was no longer understood, it lost its prefix "o".[4] The name Bitola is mentioned in the Bitola inscription, related to the old city fortress built in 1015. Modern Slavic variants include the Macedonian Bitola (Битола), the Serbian Bitolj (Битољ) and Bulgarian Bitolya (Битоля). In Byzantine times, the name was hellenized to Voutélion (Βουτέλιον) or Vitólia (Βιτώλια), hence the names Butella by William of Tyre, Butili by the Arab geographer al-Idrisi. The Aromanian name Bituli is also derived from the Slavic name. Another Greek name under which the city used to be best-known and which is still in use, is Monastíri (Μοναστήρι), also meaning "monastery". The Turkish name Manastır (Ottoman Turkish: مناستر) is derived from the Greek name, as is the Albanian Manastiri. so the modern serb name is closest to it's original slavic name, nice.
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Oct 18, 2011 9:02:20 GMT -5
The name Bitola is mentioned in the Bitola inscription, related to the old city fortress built in 1015. Lets see the whole text of the Bitola inscription: In the year 6523 (1015) since the creation of the world, this fortress, built and made by Ivan, Tsar of Bulgaria, was renewed with the help and the prayers of Our Most Holy Lady and through the intercession of her twelve supreme Apostles. The fortress was built as a haven and for the salvation of the lives of the Bulgarians. The work on the fortress of Bitola commenced on the twentieth day of October and ended on the [...] This Tsar was Bulgarian by birth, grandson of the pious Nikola and Ripsimia, son of Aaron, who was brother of Samuil, Tsar of Bulgaria, the two who routed the Greek army of Emperor Basil II at Stipone where gold was taken [...] and in [...] this Tsar was defeated by Emperor Basil in 6522 (1014) since the creation of the world in Klyutch and died at the end of the summer. www.encyclo.co.uk/define/Bitola%20inscription
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on Oct 18, 2011 10:06:36 GMT -5
Your English is terrible , anywho... Is this an open challenge to your Serbian 'allies?' Where are these stooges now?
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Post by missanthropology58 on Oct 18, 2011 10:48:54 GMT -5
As King Phil would say
''your posts look as if an Indian put them together''
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Post by Croatian Vanguard on Oct 18, 2011 11:33:33 GMT -5
the name Bitola is derived from the old Slavic word Obitel (monastery or abode), since the city was formerly noted for its monastery. When the meaning of the name was no longer understood, it lost its prefix "o".[4] The name Bitola is mentioned in the Bitola inscription, related to the old city fortress built in 1015. Modern Slavic variants include the Macedonian Bitola (Битола), the Serbian Bitolj (Битољ) and Bulgarian Bitolya (Битоля). In Byzantine times, the name was hellenized to Voutélion (Βουτέλιον) or Vitólia (Βιτώλια), hence the names Butella by William of Tyre, Butili by the Arab geographer al-Idrisi. The Aromanian name Bituli is also derived from the Slavic name. Another Greek name under which the city used to be best-known and which is still in use, is Monastíri (Μοναστήρι), also meaning "monastery". The Turkish name Manastır (Ottoman Turkish: مناستر) is derived from the Greek name, as is the Albanian Manastiri. Obitel(j) in the Croatian language means family or clan. You might be wrong about the meaning.
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Oct 18, 2011 17:27:21 GMT -5
The name Bitola is mentioned in the Bitola inscription, related to the old city fortress built in 1015. Lets see the whole text of the Bitola inscription: In the year 6523 (1015) since the creation of the world, this fortress, built and made by Ivan, Tsar of Bulgaria, was renewed with the help and the prayers of Our Most Holy Lady and through the intercession of her twelve supreme Apostles. The fortress was built as a haven and for the salvation of the lives of the Bulgarians. The work on the fortress of Bitola commenced on the twentieth day of October and ended on the [...] This Tsar was Bulgarian by birth, grandson of the pious Nikola and Ripsimia, son of Aaron, who was brother of Samuil, Tsar of Bulgaria, the two who routed the Greek army of Emperor Basil II at Stipone where gold was taken [...] and in [...] this Tsar was defeated by Emperor Basil in 6522 (1014) since the creation of the world in Klyutch and died at the end of the summer. www.encyclo.co.uk/define/Bitola%20inscriptionis this the fake inscription?
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Oct 18, 2011 17:35:27 GMT -5
the name Bitola is derived from the old Slavic word Obitel (monastery or abode), since the city was formerly noted for its monastery. When the meaning of the name was no longer understood, it lost its prefix "o".[4] The name Bitola is mentioned in the Bitola inscription, related to the old city fortress built in 1015. Modern Slavic variants include the Macedonian Bitola (Битола), the Serbian Bitolj (Битољ) and Bulgarian Bitolya (Битоля). In Byzantine times, the name was hellenized to Voutélion (Βουτέλιον) or Vitólia (Βιτώλια), hence the names Butella by William of Tyre, Butili by the Arab geographer al-Idrisi. The Aromanian name Bituli is also derived from the Slavic name. Another Greek name under which the city used to be best-known and which is still in use, is Monastíri (Μοναστήρι), also meaning "monastery". The Turkish name Manastır (Ottoman Turkish: مناستر) is derived from the Greek name, as is the Albanian Manastiri. Obitel(j) in the Croatian language means family or clan. You might be wrong about the meaning. there has been no record of either serb or croat settlements of bitola. the name is of slavic origin, given by the Dragoviti tribe who settled the area around the 6th century. around bitola you will find many names attesting to the dragoviti tribe - the river Dragor, villgage Dragosh etc.
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Post by terroreign on Oct 18, 2011 18:15:38 GMT -5
Dragoviti tribe....is a Serb tribe itself....Dragovici would be the de-Anglicized version of the name.
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Oct 18, 2011 18:28:46 GMT -5
Dragoviti tribe....is a Serb tribe itself....Dragovici would be the de-Anglicized version of the name. sources of the time treat the croat and serb tribes as separate from the slavic tribes (sklavinians). much the same way as they treat the bulgar tribes as separate. why is this so?
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Post by terroreign on Oct 18, 2011 18:35:18 GMT -5
Dragoviti tribe....is a Serb tribe itself....Dragovici would be the de-Anglicized version of the name. sources of the time treat the croat and serb tribes as separate from the slavic tribes (sklavinians). much the same way as they treat the bulgar tribes as separate. why is this so? not really. serbs and 'sclavinians' were used interchangebly. for example King Mihailo of duklja like each duklja ruler held the title "King of Serbs", but was crowned "Rex Sclavorum" "King of the Slavs" by the Vatican.
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Oct 18, 2011 18:51:40 GMT -5
sources of the time treat the croat and serb tribes as separate from the slavic tribes (sklavinians). much the same way as they treat the bulgar tribes as separate. why is this so? not really. serbs and 'sclavinians' were used interchangebly. for example King Mihailo of duklja like each duklja ruler held the title "King of Serbs", but was crowned "Rex Sclavorum" "King of the Slavs" by the Vatican. the serboi were a non-slavic people (either sarmation, or iranian). they cannot be both slavic and sarmation at the same time. byzantine sources separate the serboi from the sklavians...
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Post by terroreign on Oct 18, 2011 19:02:57 GMT -5
not really. serbs and 'sclavinians' were used interchangebly. for example King Mihailo of duklja like each duklja ruler held the title "King of Serbs", but was crowned "Rex Sclavorum" "King of the Slavs" by the Vatican. the serboi were a non-slavic people (either sarmation, or iranian). they cannot be both slavic and sarmation at the same time. byzantine sources separate the serboi from the sklavians... they were/are (though that's another topic entirely) as well as slavic at the same time. as the serbs are mentioned by Fredegar in the Latin Chronicle as "dux gente Surbiorum que ex genere Sclavinorum" (the Serb people of the slav tribe/nation) in 631 AD. the serb city-states of the middle ages were informally known as sclavaneas by the romans/greeks, and as "serbia".
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Post by ulf on Oct 18, 2011 19:12:03 GMT -5
not really. serbs and 'sclavinians' were used interchangebly. for example King Mihailo of duklja like each duklja ruler held the title "King of Serbs", but was crowned "Rex Sclavorum" "King of the Slavs" by the Vatican. the serboi were a non-slavic people (either sarmation, or iranian). they cannot be both slavic and sarmation at the same time. byzantine sources separate the serboi from the sklavians... Yes they can. Scythians and Slavs both had same ancestors long time ago(and thus Sarmatians/west Scythians had intemixed with Slavs who again were once same people), except most Scythians lived more Eastern(check the "Valley of the Kings" in the Russia-Mongolia border). So Krivosanin wasn't wrong when he said that Serbs were Slavs and Sarmatians, just LOOOOOOOOOONG time ago.
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Oct 18, 2011 19:13:43 GMT -5
the serbs are just one of many tribes inhabiting Sclavinia...and they are north of Macedonia...
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Post by terroreign on Oct 18, 2011 19:51:26 GMT -5
^The map's wrong....as is explained in the DAI, travunians/trebounians, paganians, zahumljians, dukljanians, are all ethnic serb tribes. using this evidence it's safe to assume the other tribes in the region are too.
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Oct 18, 2011 22:28:37 GMT -5
Lets see the whole text of the Bitola inscription: In the year 6523 (1015) since the creation of the world, this fortress, built and made by Ivan, Tsar of Bulgaria, was renewed with the help and the prayers of Our Most Holy Lady and through the intercession of her twelve supreme Apostles. The fortress was built as a haven and for the salvation of the lives of the Bulgarians. The work on the fortress of Bitola commenced on the twentieth day of October and ended on the [...] This Tsar was Bulgarian by birth, grandson of the pious Nikola and Ripsimia, son of Aaron, who was brother of Samuil, Tsar of Bulgaria, the two who routed the Greek army of Emperor Basil II at Stipone where gold was taken [...] and in [...] this Tsar was defeated by Emperor Basil in 6522 (1014) since the creation of the world in Klyutch and died at the end of the summer. www.encyclo.co.uk/define/Bitola%20inscriptionis this the fake inscription? no of course. if it was fake you will not put it in the Bitola museum plus you Macedonians would be the first to shout out its fake (let alone put it into your own museum). It directly contradicts macedonism and your glorious ancient (greek) past. But you act as you normally do when you are shown a source that prooves the Macedonians identified as Bulgarians: silence.
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Oct 18, 2011 22:30:37 GMT -5
the serboi were a non-slavic people (either sarmation, or iranian). they cannot be both slavic and sarmation at the same time. byzantine sources separate the serboi from the sklavians... absolutely right
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Oct 18, 2011 22:32:12 GMT -5
is this the fake inscription? no of course. if it was fake you will not put it in the Bitola museum plus you Macedonians would be the first to shout out its fake (let alone put it into your own museum). It directly contradicts macedonism and your glorious ancient (greek) past. But you act as you normally do when you are shown a source that prooves the Macedonians identified as Bulgarians: silence. look it's not the first time you have been caught falsifiying. have a look at the below; www.gate.net/~mango/Bulgarian_falsification.htmlthe two inscriptions look remarkably alike to me....
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ioan
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Post by ioan on Oct 18, 2011 22:50:37 GMT -5
Sure I know about it. But we are discussing here the Bitola inscription. And thats the reality: if Bitola inscription was fake you (Macedonians) ll be the first to SHOUT it to the world!!! And you ll make everything in your power to proove to the world its fake. Arent you aware that there are scientific methods that proove the age of the inscription? You think your scientists dont make these calculations? All scientists do. If your historians had a slight doubt the inscription was fake, the whole wourld would ve known. Instead, you put the inscription into your OWN MUSEUM. I think thats enough proof if its fake!!! Obviouslly it is not. Even you YOURSELF used it as a proof of how Bitolas name sounded. I think that explains even your position that it is a real.
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Sokol
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Post by Sokol on Oct 18, 2011 22:57:05 GMT -5
Sure I know about it. But we are discussing here the Bitola inscription. And thats the reality: if Bitola inscription was fake you (Macedonians) ll be the first to SHOUT it to the world!!! And you ll make everything in your power to proove to the world its fake. Arent you aware that there are scientific methods that proove the age of the inscription? You think your scientists dont make these calculations? All scientists do. If your historians had a slight doubt the inscription was fake, the whole wourld would ve known. Instead, you put the inscription into your OWN MUSEUM. I think thats enough proof if its fake!!! Obviouslly it is not. Even you YOURSELF used it as a proof of how Bitolas name sounded. I think that explains even your position that it is a real. The Voden inscription was revealed as fake by your own Bozhidar Dimitrov. I guess it's only a matter of time before evidence is found of this one's fakeness aswell. It should remain in the museum as evidence of the level of Bulgarian desperation in trying to Bulgarise Macedonia. The Bitola museum also has many other exhibits - such as the Battle of Kaymaktchalan, Tito's visit to Bitola, a large section on Kemal Ataturk... www.bitolamuseum.org/
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